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Questions About reviews -- glinks in general

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Questions About reviews -- glinks in general
Hi

Sorry if i couldn't do a proper search to address following queries (in general and not just limited to glinks3 beta):

(1) Where and when does this "review_search_results.html" come into play?
(2) Where and when does this "reviews_edit.html" come into play?

I am testing on glinks 3 beta the same and submitted review both as guest and a logged in user and could not find "Edit" thing despite having submitted two reviews to same link with submission coming from same IP address.

I know the "reviews_edit_success.html" would only come into play once i have "reviews_edit.html" link visible somewhere. Confusion on this. It seems that i could submit all day long (sort of spam) on a link with same email address, from same ip whether as guest or as a logged in user. This could be a headache for admins :/

I never did such a test on 2.2 and nor can i do on a live site. Just testing it on a test install with glinks3-beta and am definitely confused on this. Also, if a logged in user is submitting a review on a link, shouldn't the name and email address (non editable) be picked up from the database? Other wise what's the difference if the email address and name is editable even for a logged in user?

To my mind, if a user is submitting a review then following should be applicable:

  • If submitting as a logged in user:
The Name and Email Address should be picked up from the database and not needed to be keyed in.

The above should be non editable by the logged in user.
On a given link, he/she should not be able to submit more than one review in any case. he could edit his reviews on a given link but not submit multiple reviews to same link. Edit possible only if Edit Link appears which i do not see it happening anywhere in glinks3 beta.

  • If a guest is submitting a review.
Unless the email address of the guest is verified (through a link sent in a mail automatically) even admin should not be able to validate the same (ie it should not be listed in the list of reviews to be validated). Something like what happens on Alexa (could be i am wrong as it has been a long time that i submitted any review on alexa).

From the same email address, the guest should not be able to submit a second review on the same link. At least this keeps the review system more meaningful from reducing Guest Submitted Spams...

Just my thoughts after being confused over this Review system in glinks

Thanks
HyTC
==================================
Mail Me If Contacting Privately Is That Necessary.
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Last edited by:

HyperTherm: Mar 13, 2005, 6:13 PM
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Re: [HyperTherm] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
review_search_results.html is used in a few places: when reviews a displayed for a link, and when all of a user's reviews are displayed.

reviews_edit.html is used when editing a review. However, the current design requires that a user post a new review to edit an existing one. This is one of the things I intend to improve for the next release.

Adrian
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Re: [brewt] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
I posted (on test install), 1 review as guest.
I posted 2 reviews to the same link, posting as same user logged in from same ip address. However, i could not find the "Edit Reviews" or list reviews by that logged in user to edit. So this confusion as to when the Edit reviews link appear? I must have tried everywhere to see that Edit reviews link but nope it doesn't appear anywhere.

As for the navigation part, for the time being (till that gets fixed), i have changed it to option 3 so that it's all plain text links. But Edit Reviews still haunts me :)

Thanks
HyTC
==================================
Mail Me If Contacting Privately Is That Necessary.
==================================
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Re: [HyperTherm] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
If you try to add a review for a user who already has an existing review for the link, then you'll get the edit review page.

Adrian
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Re: [HyperTherm] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
From what I recall, Edit Reviews is only available if "user_review_required" is set to "yes" in Setup:Review Options.

When user_review_required = yes, Only users can post reviews, and they can edit reviews they've posted. If they are not logged in and attempt to submit a review, they get taken to login screen with the familiar "You must login to access that". At least that's how I thought it worked, but something seems different with beta.

When reviews are tied to a user, and they go to read a review, they see a list of all reviews for that link, from all users. Clicking on the username hyperlink gives a list of reviews by that user.

When user_review_required = no, basically any visitor can submit a review. They are prompted for name, email and comment. These reviews (submitted by a non-user), list like other reviews, but clicking on the Name hyperlink, it (annoyingly) takes you to your email client with their address conveniently filled in (sarcasm). Reviews submitted by non-users (visitors) can not be edited. This is something I would like to see changed. They should be able to login with Name and email and edit the review. It is not critical data anyways.

Like I said, something seems different with the beta. It is allowing me to post a review, regardless of user_review_required. I know for a fact, it used to ask for name and email when user_review_required = no.

It appears that <%if anonymous%> is not working.
Take this stuff with a grain of salt as i have just upgraded my live site to the beta and I am using my own completely rewritten templates that were designed for 2.x.

Interestingly enough, I was about to make a post about reviews myself :-)
What I would like to see will be in my next post.

Chris
RGB World, Inc. - Software &amp; Web Development.
rgbworld.com
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Re: [rgbworld] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
Fine.

But if a user has logged in and submitted a review, then once the user logs back in and try to resubmit a review to the same link/ tries to resubmit a review again to the same link, then his/her already submitted link should come up (irrespective of what admin settings are there for submitting review). Otherwise, it doesn't make sense whether a logged in user submits a review or a guest submits a review. Admin setting should just make a Guest Review submit possible/impossible that's how i see it.

Thanks
HyTC
==================================
Mail Me If Contacting Privately Is That Necessary.
==================================
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Re: [rgbworld] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
I would like to make a Feature request for "auto_validate_reviews" and/or "allow_visitor_reviews".

There really should be a variable on Setup: Review Options of the Admin that would allow auto-validating of Reviews. I use Reviews as Comments, more like a guestbook. I want Comments immediately added when submitted. This allows "visitors" to leave comments, and leaves "link owners" to submitting links.

I have to make the following (1 word) edit everytime I do an update.

TURN REVIEWS INTO COMMENTS
===============================================
Description: This mod auto-validates Review submissions.

File: links/admin/Links/User/Review.pm

sub _add_this_review {
# ------------------------------------------------------------------
# Add this review
#

Find:
$input->{Review_Validated} = 'No';
Replace with:
$input->{Review_Validated} = 'Yes';

================================================

IMHO, Things should work like this.... with 2 variables "allow_visitor_reviews" and "auto_validate_reviews".

When allow_visitor_reviews = yes.
Any visitor can submit a review. They should be prompted for name, email and comment.
Visitor reviews list like other reviews, but clicking on the Name hyperlink should list reviews submitted by the email address associated with the review. Just like with registered users.

When allow_visitor_reviews = no.
Visitors must login (becoming a user) in order to post a review. When a "user" posts a review, no need to ask for name or email, just static text for that and a comment field.

Then in either case, follow the "auto_validate_reviews" and send emails or whatever.

A couple things make no sense to me, like... Why do we even need the rating system on reviews? I can see rating a link, but a review of a review? (rant) In addition, the star system should be associated with the links, not the reviews. Anyways those things are easy enough not to use, so leave them in, I just think it is overkill.

It really would be nice though to have reviews be able to be used as a comment or guestbook system as well as reviews. A few minor edits makes it possible.

I don't want a database full of users (visitors) who have created accounts, just so they can leave a comment. I want my users to add links to my directory, and I want visitors to leave comments and votes. There should be 2 distinct entities for this purpose.

Oh, and most importantly, a logged in user should be able to delete reviews (comments) that were submitted by ANYONE, whether that be a different registered user or a visitor. The link owner is the master user when it comes to reviews.

Thanks for listening. I see new references to Review_GuestName in the luna templates, so you guys are probably on the right track, and may even have this all working? I am using the beta.

Chris
RGB World, Inc. - Software &amp; Web Development.
rgbworld.com

Last edited by:

rgbworld: Mar 13, 2005, 11:38 PM
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Re: [HyperTherm] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
I agree.Smile
RGB World, Inc. - Software &amp; Web Development.
rgbworld.com
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Re: [rgbworld] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
You have enumerated more than i could do with precision.

Guest Submissions Not Really Validated Unless The Email Address Of The Person Submitting the review is validated. I mean you would not want to have useless spams being submitted with email addresses like aa@bbb.com chekme@arabqueeeen.com etc etc .... Admins just have to validate that, wait for a bounce message and then delete it if message bounces back... so it's a headache dealing with such type of reviews.

And if aa2@bb.com or for that matter even myname@yahoo.com (genuine email address) comes back to submit a review on the same link, on submission he should get a message that he has already reviewed and can't submit review to same link again. Perhaps something to do with primary key stuff in table but that should be doeable. ... linkid and emailid (of submitter) combination or whatever be the primary key so that at least aa@bb.com cannot engage in "Refresh" after the first post and keep submitting the same data over and over again.... just to abuse the system. System has to be protected from Visitor Abuse ... and Asking for login is no answer when you want to operate a PAID Links directory.

It could be argued that have user login... well just as you said, i would not want to have users login just for saying hello (and perhaps never ever come back again). This gains more relevance when glinks is being used for PAID Links exclusively...

IMHO, software developers rarely take any suggestions from end users. Unfortunate but that's a reality...

Thanks
HyTC
==================================
Mail Me If Contacting Privately Is That Necessary.
==================================
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Re: [brewt] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
Sorry, unless i make that changes from Admin requiring a user to login, it doesn't happen that way.

I login as a user.
I pickup a link.

I can keep adding reviews all day long for the same link even as a logged in user.
If only i change the settings in Admin, does that happen (what you mentioned). Unless it is that, I as a logged in user can change my email address/Name in the review form. And never ever do i get that conditon that i have already submitted a review for the link....

And this part i have tested starting site access both in static as well as dynamic mode (d=1 in url). It fails to recognize me as a logged in user who has already submitted a review for a given link.... has that Name And Email Address Are displayed for keying in.

If it's designed to work this way, then review system is open for gross abuse just by anyone (logged in or not)... unless Admin sets it to requiring login which is impractical ...

Thanks
HyTC
==================================
Mail Me If Contacting Privately Is That Necessary.
==================================

Last edited by:

HyperTherm: Mar 14, 2005, 12:45 AM
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Re: [HyperTherm] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
I'm afraid some of these ideas will have to wait till the next version (into my todo list it goes!). We want to release soon and adding more features will only delay the release. From now till the 3.0 final release, we're going to be trying to keep changes to bug fixes only (ie. feature freeze).

Adrian
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Re: [rgbworld] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
This question was started in "Default format of emails" thread, but it more appropriatly belongs here.

In Reply To:
With "user_review_required" set to "no", there are 2 issues with the beta.

-----------------------------------------------------------
When not logged in, Adding a review gives me the error...
"Column Review Owner can not be left blank."
-----------------------------------------------------------
When logged in:
Submitting of the review works, but
When I go to Admin>Database>Validate Review

"Validate" - Works fine
"Delete without Reason" - Works fine
"Delete and email" shows this message after deletion...
--------------------------------------------------------------
This allows you to validate reviews that users have entered.
GT::Mail=HASH(0xa1ed1fc)
There are 0 reviews waiting to be validated.
--------------------------------------------------------------

This is duplicatable with 2.x or luna templates in dynamic mode.


OK, well I tried to fix this error that occurs when submitting a review without being logged in.
Error: "Column Review Owner can not be left blank."

-----------------------------------------------------------
I went to Edit Review_Owner Column Definition and changed "Not Null" to "no".
It errored and said I could not Index if allowing null. So I set
Column Index to "none",
and the Column updated ok.

I added a review again (while not logged in) and it submitted ok with 2 problems:
1) The Review_Owner was left empty. So, I tried to change...

# Get the review owner (in Review.pm) from:
$input->{Review_Owner} = ($USER) ? $USER->{Username} : 'admin';

To (several variations of this line):
$input->{Review_Owner} = ($USER) ? $USER->{Username} : Review_GuestName;

I also tried just adding this in review_add.html:
<input type="hidden" name="Review_Owner" value="test-admin" />
That didn't work either,
So I restored Review.pm to its orig.

2) When I went to "Validate Reviews" after successfully submitting the review (other than validating it), I get this...
A fatal error has occured:
Can't use an undefined value as a HASH reference at /home/virtual/site129/fst/var/www/cgi-bin/links/admin/Links/Tools.pm line 1006.

Please enable debugging in setup for more details.

The review is in the database, and all fields are fine except that Review_Owner is NULL, which I expected it to be, but I thought I would be able to validate the review still. The only way I was able to get rid of the fatal error was to delete the review I had added while not being logged in, and reverting Review_Owner Column Definition to not allow null and be indexed.

I would like to know how to set the Review_Owner to be the Review_GuestName when reviews are submitted by non-users.
I restored everything and am back to the orig error. I think I was close, can someone enlighten me?
Also, How do I force any "compiled" code to recompile if I am in dynamic mode? or does it not matter

Thanks
Chris

PS I hate this message editor Cool

RGB World, Inc. - Software &amp; Web Development.
rgbworld.com
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Re: [rgbworld] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
Guest reviews should be owned by the admin, as it has to be owned by a user in the Users table. I don't see why you would be getting the "Column Review Owner can not be left blank." error unless your admin user did not exist.

There was another bug in the code though, but it looks like you didn't run into it (the use of $USER when trying to send an email to the admin).

Adrian
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Re: [brewt] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
My report:
I have not made any mods to source code. user_review_required is set to "no".

Luna templates. Add a review without signing in:
Initially, I get an error from User/Review.pm line 335.
I do not remember the error text, but you just mentioned of it.

Line 335:
Links::send_email('review_added.eml', { %$USER, %$input, %$rec }, { admin_email => 1 }) or die "Unable to send mail: $GT::Mail::error";

On second and subsequent attempts to add a review, while not logged in, I (still) get:
  • Column Review Owner can not be left blank.
you can test at supportmusicians.com. defaults to 2.x templates, but luna ones are there.
Same error, either template although I never got line 335 error with 2.x template.

The only thing I had done was modify the Column for Review_Owner to allow null, but I have put the column back exactly like it was.
Review_Owner VARCHAR(50) Yes Review Owner TEXT
Chris
RGB World, Inc. - Software &amp; Web Development.
rgbworld.com
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Re: [rgbworld] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
Did you do something to fix that line 335 error? Because the line which sets Review_Owner is breaking because $USER is set to an empty hash instead of undef.

Adrian
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Re: [brewt] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
Well, I cleaned out all reviews that didn't have an owner that was a user.

The only other thing I have done was changed
<input type="hidden" name="Review_ByLine" value="" />
in review_add.html

to:
<input type="hidden" name="Review_ByLine" value="Is it the byline" />

But only in the 2.x default/local. Not luna.
I thought you fixed it because it just started working...
Reviews by non-users are being added, and the "Review Owner can not be empty" message is gone.

I thought you fixed something... wierd
I will try to figure out what I did if anything to fix it. Did you fix anything?

Also I dont understand your comment completely.

Chris
RGB World, Inc. - Software &amp; Web Development.
rgbworld.com

Last edited by:

rgbworld: Mar 15, 2005, 6:11 PM
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Re: [rgbworld] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
Yes, I did fix it on your install, but I wasn't sure if it's a fix that needed to be committed. The problem is that around line 291:
Code:
$input->{Review_Owner} = ($USER) ? $USER->{Username} : 'admin';
should have set Review_Owner to 'admin', however on your installation $USER = {} instead of undef.

The error in the code that I found on my copy and have fixed was around line 331:
Code:
Links::send_email('review_added.eml', { %$USER, %$input, %$rec }, { admin_email => 1 }) or die "Unable to send mail: $GT::Mail::error";
and was due to $USER not being set when no user was logged in. However, on your installation since $USER is set, you didn't run into this issue (or you did and fixed it by setting $USER - this is why I asked you about that in my last message).

Adrian
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Re: [brewt] Questions About reviews -- glinks in general In reply to
Well thanks once again for your expertise. Problem solved.

Quote:
However, on your installation since $USER is set, you didn't run into this issue

Code:
$input->{Review_Owner} = ($USER) ? $USER->{Username} : 'admin';

I fought that line of code for a few hours last night :-)

Seems I didn't intentionally set $USER, How is it that $USER is set differently on one install than another?

Thanks again. Lets move on

Chris

RGB World, Inc. - Software &amp; Web Development.
rgbworld.com