Mailing List Archive: Zope: Web

Re: ZDG updates

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joel at joelburton

Aug 19, 2004, 5:57 AM

Post #1 of 11 (1393 views)
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Re: ZDG updates

On Thu, Aug 19, 2004 at 08:26:57AM +0200, Chris Withers wrote:
> Okay, user 'pupq' now has a local role of Manager in /Documentation/Books.
>
> Joel, if that's not you, please let me know ASAP. If it doesn't work,
> likewise, lemme know :-)

Thanks, ChrisW!

- j.
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chris at simplistix

Aug 18, 2004, 11:26 PM

Post #2 of 11 (1333 views)
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Re: ZDG updates [In reply to]

Joel Burton wrote:
>> Is there anything stopping you making the updates yourself?
>
> Yep. Don't have edit privileges for the this. I'm a reviewer for
> zope.org, but have nothing special wrt to editing.

Okay, user 'pupq' now has a local role of Manager in /Documentation/Books.

Joel, if that's not you, please let me know ASAP. If it doesn't work,
likewise, lemme know :-)

Others, was that the right thing to do? If not, lemme know what I should
have done and I'll sort it out...

cheers,

Chris

--
Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting
- http://www.simplistix.co.uk
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andrew at zope

Aug 20, 2004, 12:26 PM

Post #3 of 11 (1340 views)
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Re: Re: ZDG updates [In reply to]

Chris Withers wrote:

> Joel Burton wrote:
>
>>> Is there anything stopping you making the updates yourself?
>>
>>
>> Yep. Don't have edit privileges for the this. I'm a reviewer for
>> zope.org, but have nothing special wrt to editing.
>
>
> Okay, user 'pupq' now has a local role of Manager in /Documentation/Books.
>
> Joel, if that's not you, please let me know ASAP. If it doesn't work,
> likewise, lemme know :-)
>
> Others, was that the right thing to do? If not, lemme know what I should
> have done and I'll sort it out...
>
> cheers,
>
> Chris
>
Giving out local roles without some kind of record keeping is likely
going to be problematic in the future....I'm not sure a sane policy for
zope.org but I think we should make some plan before it gets
unmanageable......
Andrew

--
Zope Corporation
Software Engineer
(540) 361-1700
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jens at dataflake

Aug 20, 2004, 1:14 PM

Post #4 of 11 (1360 views)
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Re: Re: ZDG updates [In reply to]

> Giving out local roles without some kind of record keeping is likely
> going to be problematic in the future....I'm not sure a sane policy
> for zope.org but I think we should make some plan before it gets
> unmanageable......
> Andrew

Even before determining a policy (which is definitely needed, true)
people who have "elevated" access to zope.org *must* have one central
place where they have to report any privileges they hand out.

If it was my own site I would even go so far as to put added privileges
to people who are not part of the admin group to a vote. And anyone who
gives out privileges without notifying the group runs the risk of
having their own privileges removed.

jens

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chris at simplistix

Aug 20, 2004, 10:23 PM

Post #5 of 11 (1356 views)
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Re: Re: ZDG updates [In reply to]

Andrew Sawyers wrote:
> Giving out local roles without some kind of record keeping is likely
> going to be problematic in the future....

Build a role and permission auditor and put it in the Zope core?

Seriously, this functionality has been cried out for a long time.
Likewise, a more sane way of managing the role to permission mapping...

cheers,

Chris

--
Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting
- http://www.simplistix.co.uk
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chris at simplistix

Aug 20, 2004, 10:30 PM

Post #6 of 11 (1354 views)
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Re: Re: ZDG updates [In reply to]

Jens Vagelpohl wrote:
> Even before determining a policy (which is definitely needed, true)
> people who have "elevated" access to zope.org *must* have one central
> place where they have to report any privileges they hand out.

It's recorded in the archives of the zope-web and webmaster [at] zope lists.

> If it was my own site I would even go so far as to put added privileges
> to people who are not part of the admin group to a vote.

To put it bluntly: no fucking way. I will not stand idly by and see
people who are offering help have their offers of help effectively
rejected due to unnecessary red tape demanded by one or two individuals.

That said, I DO think anyone who hands out a local role, as I did, needs
to take responsibility for their actions. I know Joel, and I trust him
not to fuck anything up. ZODB's undo gives us an option to quickly and
easily revert unfortunate changes, and my responsibility taking means
that, for example, if anyone complains about a change he has made, I'd
expect to be responsible for sorting it out.

To put it another way, Jens, would you like to maintain the ZDG, or
would you prefer Joel to do it?

Chris

--
Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting
- http://www.simplistix.co.uk
_______________________________________________
Zope-web maillist - Zope-web [at] zope
http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web

andrew at zope

Aug 20, 2004, 10:35 PM

Post #7 of 11 (1313 views)
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Re: Re: ZDG updates [In reply to]

Chris Withers wrote:

> Jens Vagelpohl wrote:
>
>> Even before determining a policy (which is definitely needed, true)
>> people who have "elevated" access to zope.org *must* have one central
>> place where they have to report any privileges they hand out.
>
>
> It's recorded in the archives of the zope-web and webmaster [at] zope lists.
Which isn't the best place; thus the point of my post. A simple svn log
would be satisfactory (Jim's idea). Just name and place or something.
Spelunking through list archives isn't scalable.
:)
Andrew

--
Zope Corporation
Software Engineer
(540) 361-1700
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jens at dataflake

Aug 20, 2004, 10:36 PM

Post #8 of 11 (1370 views)
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Re: Re: ZDG updates [In reply to]

>> Even before determining a policy (which is definitely needed, true)
>> people who have "elevated" access to zope.org *must* have one central
>> place where they have to report any privileges they hand out.
>
> It's recorded in the archives of the zope-web and webmaster [at] zope
> lists.

Yes, when it's already said and done... As you might be aware, there
are also legal implications. That's why people have to sign stuff
before getting Manager access.

> To put it bluntly: no fucking way. I will not stand idly by and see
> people who are offering help have their offers of help effectively
> rejected due to unnecessary red tape demanded by one or two
> individuals.
>
> That said, I DO think anyone who hands out a local role, as I did,
> needs to take responsibility for their actions. I know Joel, and I
> trust him not to fuck anything up. ZODB's undo gives us an option to
> quickly and easily revert unfortunate changes, and my responsibility
> taking means that, for example, if anyone complains about a change he
> has made, I'd expect to be responsible for sorting it out.
>
> To put it another way, Jens, would you like to maintain the ZDG, or
> would you prefer Joel to do it?

Don't get your knickers all twisted up. I'm not making any policy here.
I am giving my opinion.

jens

_______________________________________________
Zope-web maillist - Zope-web [at] zope
http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web

chris at simplistix

Aug 21, 2004, 12:25 AM

Post #9 of 11 (1354 views)
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Re: Re: ZDG updates [In reply to]

Andrew Sawyers wrote:
> Which isn't the best place; thus the point of my post. A simple svn log
> would be satisfactory (Jim's idea).

Sounds great.Although I don't remember reading the suggestion anywhere.
More ghost mail from Mailman? :-S

> Just name and place or something.

Sounds good to me, although I think Zope needs this as a core tool ;-)

Chris

--
Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting
- http://www.simplistix.co.uk
_______________________________________________
Zope-web maillist - Zope-web [at] zope
http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web

chris at simplistix

Aug 21, 2004, 12:28 AM

Post #10 of 11 (1334 views)
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Re: Re: ZDG updates [In reply to]

Jens Vagelpohl wrote:
>
> Yes, when it's already said and done... As you might be aware, there
> are also legal implications.

...of which I think I'm aware, although I might be missing something.
The ZDG has few legal implications, there's no private data there, etc.
Paul Winkler wanted to help out with the front page, which I ducked on
since that would require Manager access much higher up ;-)

> That's why people have to sign stuff before
> getting Manager access.

AFAIK, Joel has signed stuff, if not, I'd encourage him to do so ASAP...

> Don't get your knickers all twisted up. I'm not making any policy here.
> I am giving my opinion.

Good :-)

Chris

--
Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting
- http://www.simplistix.co.uk
_______________________________________________
Zope-web maillist - Zope-web [at] zope
http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web

andrew at zope

Aug 21, 2004, 12:35 AM

Post #11 of 11 (1370 views)
Permalink

Re: Re: ZDG updates [In reply to]

Chris Withers wrote:
> Andrew Sawyers wrote:
>
>> Which isn't the best place; thus the point of my post. A simple svn
>> log would be satisfactory (Jim's idea).
>
>
> Sounds great.Although I don't remember reading the suggestion anywhere.
> More ghost mail from Mailman? :-S
No, it was spoken between he and I this afternoon. :)
>
>> Just name and place or something.
>
>
> Sounds good to me, although I think Zope needs this as a core tool ;-)
>
> Chris
>

Andrew
--
Zope Corporation
Software Engineer
(540) 361-1700
_______________________________________________
Zope-web maillist - Zope-web [at] zope
http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web

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