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[Wikimedia-l] Watchlist email notifications enabled on all wikis

 

 

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nemowiki at gmail

Apr 27, 2012, 2:27 PM

Post #1 of 12 (1040 views)
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[Wikimedia-l] Watchlist email notifications enabled on all wikis

A few hours ago, a year after the discussion on this list about editor
retention and communication,[1] email notification[2] of edits to
watchlisted pages has been enabled on all Wikimedia projects — at last!
Until yesterday, only 16 lucky content projects, including Commons (plus
a bunch of small backstage wikis), benefited from this feature.
There are still a few steps left, to monitor performance impact.[3]

The only inconvenience is that both new and old users still have to
manually enable the feature on their preferences, while it would make
more sense to make it opt-out, as for user talk: users want to disable
it only on the very few wikis they monitor very closely, when/if the
watchlist gets crowded and would generate too much spam. Some thought is
needed to address this pat of the problem because of course we don't
want to suddenly send thousands of emails to the super-users with (tens
of?) thousands of pages in their watchlist before they opt-out.

Nemo

[1]
http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/foundation-l/2011-April/thread.html#65294
[2] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Help:Watching_pages#E-mail_notification
[3] https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28026#c53

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jayvdb at gmail

Apr 27, 2012, 3:44 PM

Post #2 of 12 (1031 views)
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Watchlist email notifications enabled on all wikis [In reply to]

Thanks to the tech team and everyone else who helped this feature
become enabled.

I also hope we can have this featured enabled by default for old and
new users soon, even on the big wikis. Doing that will bring many
experienced editors back to the wiki.

As someone with tens of thousands of pages on my watchlists, I think
it would be reasonable to disable this feature on enwp for people with
more than 5,000 content pages on their watchlist, as the content pages
change often on enwp. However that approach shouldnt be applied to
all wikis indescriminately; e.g. wikisource content pages rarely
change after the initial burst of editing.

--
John Vandenberg

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vasilvv at gmail

Apr 27, 2012, 3:51 PM

Post #3 of 12 (1030 views)
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Watchlist email notifications enabled on all wikis [In reply to]

Please, do not enable this feature by default. A lot of people do not
like > 10 emails/day in their mailbox, and I have such amount of
watchlisted edits even in smaller projects like Meta.

vvv

On Sat, Apr 28, 2012 at 1:27 AM, Federico Leva (Nemo)
<nemowiki [at] gmail> wrote:
> A few hours ago, a year after the discussion on this list about editor
> retention and communication,[1] email notification[2] of edits to
> watchlisted pages has been enabled on all Wikimedia projects at last!
> Until yesterday, only 16 lucky content projects, including Commons (plus a
> bunch of small backstage wikis), benefited from this feature.
> There are still a few steps left, to monitor performance impact.[3]
>
> The only inconvenience is that both new and old users still have to manually
> enable the feature on their preferences, while it would make more sense to
> make it opt-out, as for user talk: users want to disable it only on the very
> few wikis they monitor very closely, when/if the watchlist gets crowded and
> would generate too much spam. Some thought is needed to address this pat of
> the problem because of course we don't want to suddenly send thousands of
> emails to the super-users with (tens of?) thousands of pages in their
> watchlist before they opt-out.
>
> Nemo
>
> [1]
> http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/foundation-l/2011-April/thread.html#65294
> [2] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Help:Watching_pages#E-mail_notification
> [3] https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=28026#c53
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> Wikimedia-l [at] lists
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l

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phnash at blueyonder

Apr 27, 2012, 4:02 PM

Post #4 of 12 (1029 views)
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Watchlist email notifications enabled on all wikis [In reply to]

----- Original Message -----
From: "Victor Vasiliev" <vasilvv [at] gmail>
To: "Wikimedia Mailing List" <wikimedia-l [at] lists>
Sent: Friday, April 27, 2012 11:51 PM
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Watchlist email notifications enabled on all
wikis


Please, do not enable this feature by default. A lot of people do not
like > 10 emails/day in their mailbox, and I have such amount of
watchlisted edits even in smaller projects like Meta.

Agree. The whole thing seems a tad unnecessary to me, since most users tend
to contribute to their home language wikipedia, and perhaps Commons, but
little else. A talk page edit is therefore unlikely to be important enough
to need immediate action, but if the issue *is* important, a more focussed
email may be sent to SUL users. Perhaps this might be a more useful option.


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jayvdb at gmail

Apr 27, 2012, 4:05 PM

Post #5 of 12 (1030 views)
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Watchlist email notifications enabled on all wikis [In reply to]

On Sat, Apr 28, 2012 at 8:51 AM, Victor Vasiliev <vasilvv [at] gmail> wrote:
> Please, do not enable this feature by default. A lot of people do not
> like > 10 emails/day in their mailbox, and I have such amount of
> watchlisted edits even in smaller projects like Meta.

Then turn off the feature.

New users dont know how to turn it on.

The emails can explain how to turn it off.

--
John Vandenberg

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jayvdb at gmail

Apr 27, 2012, 4:07 PM

Post #6 of 12 (1032 views)
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Watchlist email notifications enabled on all wikis [In reply to]

On Sat, Apr 28, 2012 at 8:51 AM, Victor Vasiliev <vasilvv [at] gmail> wrote:
> Please, do not enable this feature by default. A lot of people do not
> like > 10 emails/day in their mailbox, and I have such amount of
> watchlisted edits even in smaller projects like Meta.

A daily digest would be cool.

https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30187

--
John Vandenberg

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sdaugherty at gmail

Apr 27, 2012, 4:20 PM

Post #7 of 12 (1043 views)
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Watchlist email notifications enabled on all wikis [In reply to]

Automatically adjusting the email frequency might be a worthwhile feature
to strive for:
If an editor hasn't logged in within the past 30 days, revert to monthly
digest, that way we don't drive editors away with the email frequency.

-Stephanie


On Fri, Apr 27, 2012 at 7:07 PM, John Vandenberg <jayvdb [at] gmail> wrote:

> On Sat, Apr 28, 2012 at 8:51 AM, Victor Vasiliev <vasilvv [at] gmail>
> wrote:
> > Please, do not enable this feature by default. A lot of people do not
> > like > 10 emails/day in their mailbox, and I have such amount of
> > watchlisted edits even in smaller projects like Meta.
>
> A daily digest would be cool.
>
> https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=30187
>
> --
> John Vandenberg
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> Wikimedia-l [at] lists
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l
>
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bodnotbod at gmail

Apr 27, 2012, 4:29 PM

Post #8 of 12 (1024 views)
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Watchlist email notifications enabled on all wikis [In reply to]

On Sat, Apr 28, 2012 at 00:05, John Vandenberg <jayvdb [at] gmail> wrote:

>> Please, do not enable this feature by default. A lot of people do not
>> like > 10 emails/day in their mailbox, and I have such amount of
>> watchlisted edits even in smaller projects like Meta.
>
> Then turn off the feature.
>
> New users dont know how to turn it on.
>
> The emails can explain how to turn it off.

So the feature sends out one email per watchlist edit?

If so, I can imagine a few users finding themselves with hundreds of
emails before they next checked their mail and saw any opportunity to
switch it off.

Could a site banner be put up just to let users know it's there,
perhaps with a link to a page of explanation about what it does and
how to switch it on? Sounds better to me than risking potential
surprise email barrages.

Bodnotbod

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bodnotbod at gmail

Apr 27, 2012, 4:40 PM

Post #9 of 12 (1023 views)
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Watchlist email notifications enabled on all wikis [In reply to]

On Sat, Apr 28, 2012 at 00:05, John Vandenberg <jayvdb [at] gmail> wrote:

> New users dont know how to turn it on.

...and I've just had a little trouble myself. I looked under the
'watchlist' tab of my prefs. It isn't there. It's under 'user
profile'.

Hmmm.

Bodnotbod

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andrew.gray at dunelm

Apr 27, 2012, 4:46 PM

Post #10 of 12 (1022 views)
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Watchlist email notifications enabled on all wikis [In reply to]

On 27 April 2012 22:27, Federico Leva (Nemo) <nemowiki [at] gmail> wrote:

> The only inconvenience is that both new and old users still have to manually
> enable the feature on their preferences, while it would make more sense to
> make it opt-out, as for user talk: users want to disable it only on the very
> few wikis they monitor very closely, when/if the watchlist gets crowded and
> would generate too much spam. Some thought is needed to address this pat of
> the problem because of course we don't want to suddenly send thousands of
> emails to the super-users with (tens of?) thousands of pages in their
> watchlist before they opt-out.

Would it be possible to have it like SUL - if you create an account
after X date it is automatically watchlist-email-enabled, if you have
an older account you have to manually turn it on.

The problem then becomes notifying people that they can have emailed
watchlist alerts, as without some form of notification we'll be having
people saying "wait, we can do that?" in 2015...

Perhaps a way to do it would be to trigger a *single* email to a user
who doesn't have it enabled, at the time their first "triggered"
watchlist edit would be sent out, informing them of the system and
inviting them to turn it on if desired, with an explicit statement
that unless they do, there won't be any further emails?

--
- Andrew Gray
andrew.gray [at] dunelm

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p858snake at gmail

Apr 27, 2012, 4:49 PM

Post #11 of 12 (1021 views)
Permalink
Re: [Wikimedia-l] Watchlist email notifications enabled on all wikis [In reply to]

On Sat, Apr 28, 2012 at 9:29 AM, Bod Notbod <bodnotbod [at] gmail> wrote:
> Could a site banner be put up just to let users know it's there,
> perhaps with a link to a page of explanation about what it does and
> how to switch it on? Sounds better to me than risking potential
> surprise email barrages.

Communities are free to put up their own SiteNotices about this, This
does not warrant a CentralNotice imho.

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nemowiki at gmail

Apr 27, 2012, 11:38 PM

Post #12 of 12 (1018 views)
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Watchlist email notifications enabled on all wikis [In reply to]

Bod Notbod, 28/04/2012 01:29:
> So the feature sends out one email per watchlist edit?

No, one email per watchlisted *page* edited. If there are hundreds of
edits to a single page, you'll receive only one email.

Andrew Gray, 28/04/2012 01:46:
> On 27 April 2012 22:27, Federico Leva (Nemo) wrote:
>
>> The only inconvenience is that both new and old users still have to manually
>> enable the feature on their preferences, while it would make more sense to
>> make it opt-out, as for user talk: users want to disable it only on the very
>> few wikis they monitor very closely, when/if the watchlist gets crowded and
>> would generate too much spam. Some thought is needed to address this pat of
>> the problem because of course we don't want to suddenly send thousands of
>> emails to the super-users with (tens of?) thousands of pages in their
>> watchlist before they opt-out.
>
> Would it be possible to have it like SUL - if you create an account
> after X date it is automatically watchlist-email-enabled, if you have
> an older account you have to manually turn it on.

Sure, this is the easiest part. If the default for the checkbox is
changed, it changes only for new users (as opposed to defaults in the
dropdown options, like thumb size), as far as I know/remember (but I'm
not a dev).

> The problem then becomes notifying people that they can have emailed
> watchlist alerts, as without some form of notification we'll be having
> people saying "wait, we can do that?" in 2015...
>
> Perhaps a way to do it would be to trigger a *single* email to a user
> who doesn't have it enabled, at the time their first "triggered"
> watchlist edit would be sent out, informing them of the system and
> inviting them to turn it on if desired, with an explicit statement
> that unless they do, there won't be any further emails?

This was already done by en.wiki for user talk notifications by changing
[[MediaWiki:Enotif body]] to explain the "new" thing.

Nemo

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