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Board restructuring and community

 

 

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saintonge at telus

Apr 29, 2008, 11:59 AM

Post #51 of 76 (500 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

Michael Snow wrote:
> Jussi-Ville Heiskanen wrote:
>
>> Michael Snow wrote:
>>
>>> If you have more questions (preferably open-ended ones that promote
>>> reasoned thought and discussion), you're welcome to ask them and I will
>>> try to answer as I have time.
>>>
>> For my own part (not pretending to speak for anyone else) the question
>> I would most like to see answered by each of the board members is:
>>
>> "What in the proposal of the exploratory body do you think was
>> for you the thing that made you support/demurr its implementation
>> by the board directly?"
>>
> For me, it was the fact that it sought to rely on the board's blessing
> in order to organize and do its work, which I believe would defeat the
> purpose. The essence of my opinion is what I wrote a little earlier in
> response to Lodewijk:
>
> "I think it likely that if the board creates a council, that will end up
> defining its relationship to the community and the world at large, and
> it will be perceived as a creature (literally, "thing created") of the
> board. If so, it would lose nearly all the value hoped for in its
> development."
Perhaps "create" was a poor choice of words to put in the resolution,
and I would have been quite content had the Board substituted more
propitious terminology. Whatever becomes of such a Council it must be
prepared to work amicably with both the Board and the community. I
certainly do not envision a rogue organization that is constantly
butting heads with the Board.

An atmosphere based on the premise that community members have the
*right* to set up whatever organization they want, or on a Board that
dwelling upon its right not to pay attention to what the group says puts
too much emphasis on confrontation. Both of these premises may be
legally correct, but that does not make them constructive.

Somewhere between outright creation and insurgency there is bound to be
a balanced structure.

Ec

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wikimedia at alisonwheeler

Apr 29, 2008, 4:15 PM

Post #52 of 76 (502 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

On Tue, April 29, 2008 12:43, Ilario Valdelli wrote:
> Personally I think that 4 experts is a big number for the board.
> Experts are consultants not board members!!!
>
> Probably 2 experts is a number sufficient to cover particular skills
> but the board it's the *unique* link between the communities and the
> management, IMHO this new configuration it's a suicide of the board.
>
> Surely the 2 chapters members in the board must replace the experts
> seats and not the community's seats.

Taking my Chapter hat off for a moment, most Boards or organisations - be
they major or minor, profit-seeking or charitable - will choose to have
50% (or more) of their board as non-executives (ie external) who bring
useful skills, expertise and contacts to the table.

The WMF of recent history has, I would suggest without intending any
disrespect, been dire in this respect as it has elected people who had
little or no relevant skills in the general or strategic management of a
world-wide organisation, and some of the past actions / decisions of the
Board have suffered because of that.

Consultants may be experts in some things, but they are never experts in
how *your* organisation works, just on organisations in general (I myself
worked in business consultancy for many years and I would never profess to
fully understand the 'internals' of any company in detail - my skill was
in understanding what questions needed to be asked and what to make of the
answers.)

Whether we like it or now, Wikimedia needs a controlling body, and that
body is the Wikimedia Foundation. The Wikimedia projects are way too big
and important to have that body be a spare-time bedroom activity and the
members of the Board should *all* have relevant expertise (so far as I am
concerned) if we want to see the projects continue their stellar growth
rate in the future.

Yes, of course I want to see experienced editors and wikimedians on the
Board, but that shouldn't (again imho) mean that someone without at least
some skills should be there.

(And no, I knew nothing about this beforehand, and yes, I did query some
aspects when I did)

Alison Wheeler


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jwales at wikia

Apr 29, 2008, 7:57 PM

Post #53 of 76 (496 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

Alison Wheeler wrote:
> The WMF of recent history has, I would suggest without intending any
> disrespect, been dire in this respect as it has elected people who had
> little or no relevant skills in the general or strategic management of a
> world-wide organisation, and some of the past actions / decisions of the
> Board have suffered because of that.

I think that most (or possibly) all members of the board are willing to
accept that sort of criticism without it being thought of as
disrespectful in the least.

One of the things that the board has been very good about in recent
months is internal growth and understanding that there are skills that
we need to recruit to the board.

--Jimbo

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delirium at hackish

Apr 30, 2008, 1:43 AM

Post #54 of 76 (496 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

Alison Wheeler wrote:
> On Tue, April 29, 2008 12:43, Ilario Valdelli wrote:
>
>> Personally I think that 4 experts is a big number for the board.
>> Experts are consultants not board members!!!
>>
>> Probably 2 experts is a number sufficient to cover particular skills
>> but the board it's the *unique* link between the communities and the
>> management, IMHO this new configuration it's a suicide of the board.
>>
>> Surely the 2 chapters members in the board must replace the experts
>> seats and not the community's seats.
>>
>
> Taking my Chapter hat off for a moment, most Boards or organisations - be
> they major or minor, profit-seeking or charitable - will choose to have
> 50% (or more) of their board as non-executives (ie external) who bring
> useful skills, expertise and contacts to the table.
>

This is certainly not true of other non-profit organizations in the
free-culture movement (which we happen to be a part of).

To take two of the larger examples,

The Electronic Frontier Foundation has 10 members of its Board of
Directors[1]; all ten have prior experience strongly relevant to the
foundation's mission (digital civil liberties, free culture, copyright
reform, etc.). In addition, at least eight have strong prior advocacy
credentials. There are no technocrats who are there simply because of
their experience in some managerial or executive aspect of nonprofits,
and only a minority is even arguably there just for their professional
(mission-related) expertise without also having a record of agitating
for EFF-type causes. Of course, they have staff to handle other things,
but the staff are not on the Board of Directors.

Software in the Public Interest, the parent project of Debian, is *100%*
elected by the Debian developers. They may choose to elect anyone, of
course, but generally elect community members. Of the 9 board
members[2], at least 6 are Debian developers, and at least 7 have a
strong history of free-software development.

-Mark

[1] http://www.eff.org/about/board
[2] http://www.spi-inc.org/corporate/board


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delirium at hackish

Apr 30, 2008, 1:47 AM

Post #55 of 76 (496 views)
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Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

Delirium wrote:
> Software in the Public Interest, the parent project of Debian, is
> *100%* elected by the Debian developers. They may choose to elect
> anyone, of course, but generally elect community members. Of the 9
> board members[2], at least 6 are Debian developers, and at least 7
> have a strong history of free-software development.
Err, that was sloppy wording on my part; though Debian is their largest
member project, they're elected by all their member projects, which
include others such as Drupal. Nonetheless the election outcomes are
still as summarized above. (I suppose this is like assuming Wikipedia is
the only important Wikimedia project. ;-))

-Mark

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midom.lists at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 1:49 AM

Post #56 of 76 (496 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

Hello,

I have stated multiple time, that I'm non-contributing user of
Wikipedia. It is quite unpopular here, I know.
I could never vote in elections, unless exclusions were done ( I
don't have 400 edits on any project ).
My English writing skills are satisfactory for technical
communication, can get worse for various other prose and poems, and
usually aligns with writing style of last book read. :)

Now that I can't comfortably spend my hours and days and years
editing Wikipedia, I end up working on technology instead - and used
to do baby sitting of the cluster.
Heck, stress levels used to be so high, I'd wake up at night and go
check if everything was running well (actually, once hit a power
outage that way :).

I used to hear multiple times back then, I hear same nowadays - I'm
supposed to work for editors.
Replies to what I say on IRC come back with the fact that I work for
editors, replies to what I write in mailing lists tell I'm supposed
to work for editors.

And, by the way, I don't. I'm entirely value centric. I work for our
mission and our values, and editors are my peers. I don't work for
editors, editors don't work for me. We help each other to achieve the
common goal.

Actually, Community and Foundation should be acting as peers too.
Board is not seen as governing body of Community.
Foundation should be seen as facilitator, "encouraging the growth,
development and distribution of free, multilingual content, and to
providing the full content of these wiki-based projects to the public
free of charge".
Board should ensure, that Foundation does what it is supposed to do.

Still, there're multiple issues in what Foundation does -
multilingual content goes beyond borders of enwiki, free of charge
requires sustainability of operations, growth needs outreach besides
editing, development and distribution asks for partnerships too.

So far, chapters have been doing great job (and showing even more
potential) in outreach and partnerships. Though it is commonly seen
that we provide power to them, we merely ask for their experience.
Board is not a senate, where representation matters entirely and most
of politics at senates are about composition of factions. Board is a
working group, that strives to work on consensus, bringing experience
from all parties, to assist operating the organization.
And, let me remind, organization that does not govern the Community,
but acts as a peer, providing legal, tech, communications
infrastructure for community.

If Community or Communities need it, of course it is possible to
raise Volunteer Council, or any other body to facilitate cross-
project governance or communication or anything else needed.
Foundation should stay encouraging and assisting, not managing
communities.

There were suggestions here that board members should have hands-on
experience editing the site.
If I'd be sarcastic, I'd sure reply that they also need hands-on
experience on fundraising, software development, performance
engineering, technology operations, accounting, legal, PR, etc , and
that would leave us with just few people from this list.

Still, our broader community is everyone who invests their time and
emotions into success of our mission.
I consider myself part of such community, and if I'd picky, I'd feel
underrepresented by election process.

Still, folks, though our mission is great and important, one of key
issues in success is satisfaction in what we're all doing. That
includes good faith.

BR,
--
Domas Mituzas -- http://dammit.lt/ -- [[user:midom]]



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dgerard at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 4:23 AM

Post #57 of 76 (491 views)
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Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

2008/4/30 Domas Mituzas <midom.lists [at] gmail>:

> I have stated multiple time, that I'm non-contributing user of
> Wikipedia. It is quite unpopular here, I know.
> I could never vote in elections, unless exclusions were done ( I
> don't have 400 edits on any project ).


Hmmmm. What do you think would be a suitable criterion to allow votes
from our (ridiculously valuable) technical volunteers? Good devs and
volunteer sysadmins (a phrase I'd never thought would be a reality
before I saw it happening on Wikimedia) are much rarer than good
content contributors.


- d.

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wikimail at inbox

Apr 30, 2008, 4:37 AM

Post #58 of 76 (490 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

On Tue, Apr 29, 2008 at 7:15 PM, Alison Wheeler
<wikimedia [at] alisonwheeler> wrote:
> Taking my Chapter hat off for a moment, most Boards or organisations - be
> they major or minor, profit-seeking or charitable - will choose to have
> 50% (or more) of their board as non-executives (ie external) who bring
> useful skills, expertise and contacts to the table.
>
What do you mean by non-executive/external? None of the board of the
WMF is employed by the foundation, so in that sense you can say all
are "non-executive/external". But I'd like to see examples of
non-profit boards in particular (the skills for for-profit board
members are IMO very different) which fit the majority you're
referring to.

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millosh at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 4:40 AM

Post #59 of 76 (491 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 1:23 PM, David Gerard <dgerard [at] gmail> wrote:
> Hmmmm. What do you think would be a suitable criterion to allow votes
> from our (ridiculously valuable) technical volunteers? Good devs and
> volunteer sysadmins (a phrase I'd never thought would be a reality
> before I saw it happening on Wikimedia) are much rarer than good
> content contributors.

Even it is not a question to me: A number of Subversion commits. They
varies like articles -- from minor edits to major ones. And there is a
list which gathers all of those informations (one with the biggest
archive).

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guillom.pom at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 4:45 AM

Post #60 of 76 (491 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

Hi,

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 1:40 PM, Milos Rancic <millosh [at] gmail> wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 1:23 PM, David Gerard <dgerard [at] gmail> wrote:
> > Hmmmm. What do you think would be a suitable criterion to allow votes
> > from our (ridiculously valuable) technical volunteers? Good devs and
> > volunteer sysadmins (a phrase I'd never thought would be a reality
> > before I saw it happening on Wikimedia) are much rarer than good
> > content contributors.
>
> Even it is not a question to me: A number of Subversion commits. They
> varies like articles -- from minor edits to major ones. And there is a
> list which gathers all of those informations (one with the biggest
> archive).

That might work for MediaWiki developers, but not necessarily for
system administrators.

--
Guillaume Paumier
[[m:User:guillom]]
"Go confidently in the direction of your dreams. Live the life you
have imagined." Henry David Thoreau

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gerard.meijssen at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 4:46 AM

Post #61 of 76 (490 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

Hoi,
Let us be practical. There are two ways of doing this; either you insist on
a measurement for the number of commits - this has to be developed and as it
is for a REALLY small group of people it is expensive or you create a group
and call it something like SVN committer and all committers can vote. This
too takes some work but seems to me to be much less expensive.
Thanks,
GerardM

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 1:40 PM, Milos Rancic <millosh [at] gmail> wrote:

> On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 1:23 PM, David Gerard <dgerard [at] gmail> wrote:
> > Hmmmm. What do you think would be a suitable criterion to allow votes
> > from our (ridiculously valuable) technical volunteers? Good devs and
> > volunteer sysadmins (a phrase I'd never thought would be a reality
> > before I saw it happening on Wikimedia) are much rarer than good
> > content contributors.
>
> Even it is not a question to me: A number of Subversion commits. They
> varies like articles -- from minor edits to major ones. And there is a
> list which gathers all of those informations (one with the biggest
> archive).
>
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dgerard at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 4:53 AM

Post #62 of 76 (497 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

2008/4/30 Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijssen [at] gmail>:

> Let us be practical. There are two ways of doing this; either you insist on
> a measurement for the number of commits - this has to be developed and as it
> is for a REALLY small group of people it is expensive or you create a group
> and call it something like SVN committer and all committers can vote. This
> too takes some work but seems to me to be much less expensive.


A question like "Brion, do you have a list of your current and recent
volunteer sysadmin/dev minions?" might be enough for a manageable
group, at least this time around - it won't be a lot of people at all,
but enfranchising them would be a good thing.


- d.

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midom.lists at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 5:19 AM

Post #63 of 76 (491 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

Hi!

> A question like "Brion, do you have a list of your current and recent
> volunteer sysadmin/dev minions?" might be enough for a manageable
> group, at least this time around - it won't be a lot of people at all,
> but enfranchising them would be a good thing.

thats what we used to do for past elections. :) anyway, the issue is
that there're lots of people who do us good, that does not get
measured in number of edits.

--
Domas Mituzas -- http://dammit.lt/ -- [[user:midom]]



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dgerard at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 5:33 AM

Post #64 of 76 (491 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

2008/4/30 Domas Mituzas <midom.lists [at] gmail>:

> > A question like "Brion, do you have a list of your current and recent
> > volunteer sysadmin/dev minions?" might be enough for a manageable
> > group, at least this time around - it won't be a lot of people at all,
> > but enfranchising them would be a good thing.

> thats what we used to do for past elections. :)


If that'll work, and the election committee are fine with it, then good!


> anyway, the issue is
> that there're lots of people who do us good, that does not get
> measured in number of edits.


Yes - people who inarguably contribute greatly. What other groups have
we missed who should be enfranchised? (e.g. do BetaWiki contributors
consider themselves part of the Wikimedia community?)


- d.

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gerard.meijssen at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 5:42 AM

Post #65 of 76 (500 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

Hoi,
The Betawiki contributors are typically also contributors to WMF projects.
There are some exceptions to that rule. The ones that I know are not likely
to be interested to vote for a board member of the WMF.

I am really pleased that Betawiki is considered in this way. Thank you.
Thanks,
GerardM

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 2:33 PM, David Gerard <dgerard [at] gmail> wrote:

> 2008/4/30 Domas Mituzas <midom.lists [at] gmail>:
>
> > > A question like "Brion, do you have a list of your current and recent
> > > volunteer sysadmin/dev minions?" might be enough for a manageable
> > > group, at least this time around - it won't be a lot of people at
> all,
> > > but enfranchising them would be a good thing.
>
> > thats what we used to do for past elections. :)
>
>
> If that'll work, and the election committee are fine with it, then good!
>
>
> > anyway, the issue is
> > that there're lots of people who do us good, that does not get
> > measured in number of edits.
>
>
> Yes - people who inarguably contribute greatly. What other groups have
> we missed who should be enfranchised? (e.g. do BetaWiki contributors
> consider themselves part of the Wikimedia community?)
>
>
> - d.
>
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millosh at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 5:58 AM

Post #66 of 76 (491 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 1:45 PM, Guillaume Paumier
<guillom.pom [at] gmail> wrote:
> That might work for MediaWiki developers, but not necessarily for
> system administrators.

Actually, a part of administration is also done by committing changes
via Subversion. However, admins of servers (as well as Office staff
should have right to vote by default.

I am also thinking that activity on mailing lists should be measured,
too. At least, it is valuable as any longer post on a talk page. The
same is for blogs aggregated to Planet Wikimedia and Open Wiki Blog
Planet. However, the most of contributors to mailing lists and to the
aggregators are, also, active at the projects.

Involvement in non-Wikimedia, but very close and to Wikimedia useful
projects, like Betawiki and OmegaWiki are -- should be also counted.

While it may look complex, I think that it is possible to make fair
rules which may cover all of the involvement in achieving Wikimedia
goals.

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millosh at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 6:01 AM

Post #67 of 76 (492 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 1:46 PM, Gerard Meijssen
<gerard.meijssen [at] gmail> wrote:
> Hoi,
> Let us be practical. There are two ways of doing this; either you insist on
> a measurement for the number of commits - this has to be developed and as it
> is for a REALLY small group of people it is expensive or you create a group
> and call it something like SVN committer and all committers can vote. This
> too takes some work but seems to me to be much less expensive.

Maybe your approach is better... I was just thinking from the
perspective of my involvement in Subversion commits. If this is the
only involvement in WM projects which I have, I shouldn't be qualified
to vote. (BTW, I am administrating sr.planet through Subversion, which
means that I need to change config file less than once per month.)

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guillom.pom at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 6:12 AM

Post #68 of 76 (493 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 2:58 PM, Milos Rancic <millosh [at] gmail> wrote:
>
> I am also thinking that activity on mailing lists should be measured,
> too.

Oh no. Please.

--
Guillaume Paumier
[[m:User:guillom]]
"Go confidently in the direction of your dreams. Live the life you
have imagined." Henry David Thoreau

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millosh at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 6:23 AM

Post #69 of 76 (492 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 3:12 PM, Guillaume Paumier
<guillom.pom [at] gmail> wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 2:58 PM, Milos Rancic <millosh [at] gmail> wrote:
> >
> > I am also thinking that activity on mailing lists should be measured,
> > too.
>
> Oh no. Please.

:) Keep in mind that talk pages often contain much more stupid content
than mailing lists. And such stupid contributions are counted for
voting, while contributions to the lists are not.

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mbimmler at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 6:41 AM

Post #70 of 76 (490 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 3:23 PM, Milos Rancic <millosh [at] gmail> wrote:

>
> :) Keep in mind that talk pages often contain much more stupid content
> than mailing lists. And such stupid contributions are counted for
> voting, while contributions to the lists are not.

"This is sooo unfair, I have been moderated in the relevant time
period and thus I couldn't send 20 posts per day, now I'm going to be
uneligible to vote!"




--
Michael Bimmler
mbimmler [at] gmail

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millosh at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 7:03 AM

Post #71 of 76 (493 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 3:41 PM, Michael Bimmler <mbimmler [at] gmail> wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 3:23 PM, Milos Rancic <millosh [at] gmail> wrote:
> >
> > :) Keep in mind that talk pages often contain much more stupid content
> > than mailing lists. And such stupid contributions are counted for
> > voting, while contributions to the lists are not.
>
> "This is sooo unfair, I have been moderated in the relevant time
> period and thus I couldn't send 20 posts per day, now I'm going to be
> uneligible to vote!"

:)) If 50 edits are enough, then 50 posts should be enough. This means
something around one email per three days. Or less than three days of
emailing before moderation started :)

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bryan.tongminh at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 7:42 AM

Post #72 of 76 (491 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 1:23 PM, David Gerard <dgerard [at] gmail> wrote:
> 2008/4/30 Domas Mituzas <midom.lists [at] gmail>:
>
>> I have stated multiple time, that I'm non-contributing user of
>> Wikipedia. It is quite unpopular here, I know.
>> I could never vote in elections, unless exclusions were done ( I
>> don't have 400 edits on any project ).
>
>
> Hmmmm. What do you think would be a suitable criterion to allow votes
> from our (ridiculously valuable) technical volunteers? Good devs and
> volunteer sysadmins (a phrase I'd never thought would be a reality
> before I saw it happening on Wikimedia) are much rarer than good
> content contributors.
>
>
> - d.
>
> _______________________________________________
> foundation-l mailing list
> foundation-l [at] lists
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>

Why not add the svn commit count to the edit count :)

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bryan.tongminh at gmail

Apr 30, 2008, 7:43 AM

Post #73 of 76 (490 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 4:42 PM, Bryan Tong Minh
<bryan.tongminh [at] gmail> wrote:
> On Wed, Apr 30, 2008 at 1:23 PM, David Gerard <dgerard [at] gmail> wrote:
>> 2008/4/30 Domas Mituzas <midom.lists [at] gmail>:
>>
>>> I have stated multiple time, that I'm non-contributing user of
>>> Wikipedia. It is quite unpopular here, I know.
>>> I could never vote in elections, unless exclusions were done ( I
>>> don't have 400 edits on any project ).
>>
>>
>> Hmmmm. What do you think would be a suitable criterion to allow votes
>> from our (ridiculously valuable) technical volunteers? Good devs and
>> volunteer sysadmins (a phrase I'd never thought would be a reality
>> before I saw it happening on Wikimedia) are much rarer than good
>> content contributors.
>>
>>
>> - d.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> foundation-l mailing list
>> foundation-l [at] lists
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>>
>
> Why not add the svn commit count to the edit count :)
>

Oh well that was already suggested earlier.

Bryan

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mgodwin at wikimedia

Apr 30, 2008, 7:59 AM

Post #74 of 76 (497 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

Delirium writes:

> The Electronic Frontier Foundation has 10 members of its Board of
> Directors[1]; all ten have prior experience strongly relevant to the
> foundation's mission (digital civil liberties, free culture, copyright
> reform, etc.). In addition, at least eight have strong prior advocacy
> credentials. There are no technocrats who are there simply because of
> their experience in some managerial or executive aspect of nonprofits,
> and only a minority is even arguably there just for their professional
> (mission-related) expertise without also having a record of agitating
> for EFF-type causes. Of course, they have staff to handle other
> things,
> but the staff are not on the Board of Directors.

Speaking as someone who worked for EFF for nine years, let me point
out that, over time, many Board members of EFF have had no connection
at all to the free culture movement. Moreover, they almost always
have had relevant and useful experience in one or another industry in
addition to whatever free-culture credentials they may have. Finally,
*all* of EFF's Board members are selected by the Board -- so far as I
know, there's no election by the EFF community of board members at all.

Anyone under the impression that EFF's Board is somehow more
democratic or representative of its constituency than the Foundation's
Board hasn't actually done a thorough comparison of the history of
both Boards.

EFF now has the luxury of having been in existence for almost 18 years
-- our Board is about 4 years old. It will be a while before we have
a large pool of expert candidates, like EFF's Board, have experience
both in relevant business fields and who have also demonstrated a long-
term commitment to Wikimedia projects and the Wikimedia movement.

(I would add that I view my own work for the Foundation as in line
with my own long-term commitment -- 18 years -- to free culture and
freedom generally in the online world.)


--Mike





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cbass at wikimedia

Apr 30, 2008, 10:07 AM

Post #75 of 76 (492 views)
Permalink
Re: Board restructuring and community [In reply to]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Domas Mituzas wrote:
| Hello,
|
| I have stated multiple time, that I'm non-contributing user of
| Wikipedia. It is quite unpopular here, I know.
| I could never vote in elections, unless exclusions were done ( I
| don't have 400 edits on any project ).
| My English writing skills are satisfactory for technical
| communication, can get worse for various other prose and poems, and
| usually aligns with writing style of last book read. :)
|
I just had a thought.

There's another class of contributor--the office volunteer or intern.
These people often have no edits or very few, but have contributed in
ways such as scanning documents, sending out mail, or organizing Mike
Godwin's legal files :).

We've had people who have helped us who have wanted to help the mission
because they have enjoyed using our projects as a resource, but have not
contributed in any way in edit counts or SVN commits. I believe that
some of the chapters also have individuals under this category. Should
they be included despite the fact that they're not members of any one of
our numerous editing communities?

(Incedentally, we're fortunate to have help in the office at present who
have contributed to the wikis...but in the past, things have been
different.)

- --
Cary Bass
Volunteer Coordinator

Your continued donations keep Wikipedia running! Support the Wikimedia
Foundation today: http://donate.wikimedia.org
Wikimedia Foundation, Inc.
Phone: 415.839.6885
Fax: 415.882.0495

E-Mail: cary [at] wikimedia
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