Mailing List Archive by Gossamer Threads http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/ en-us (c) Gossamer Threads Inc. All rights reserved. 04 Jul 2009 15:42:12 -0800 120 75 23 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/ http://www.gossamer-threads.com/images/lists/rss_logo.jpg I know it is even worse for some other languages, but I don't think it is very interesting to calculate exact numbers for a couple of hundred language 03 Jul 2009 12:36:00 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/170506 It seems like the attribution scheme chosen does not support small interactive devices and systems very Well. Are there anyone who have given this any 02 Jul 2009 16:23:24 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/170403 ****************************************** __ __ _ _ _ _ / / /\ \ (_) | _(_)___(_)_ __ ___ \ \/ \/ / | |/ / |_ / | '_ \ / _ \ \ /\ 02 Jul 2009 15:56:24 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/170391 Hi, I'm happy to tell you that I have just posted to the Foundation website, the 2009-10 Annual Plan along with Questions and Answers. The resolut 02 Jul 2009 15:14:51 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/170390 The Wikimedia Foundation is seeking a term-limited (one year) full-time Project Manager for its new "Bookshelf" Project (text below). Feel free to s 02 Jul 2009 14:32:30 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/170388 http://lists.whatwg.org/htdig.cgi/whatwg-whatwg.org/2009-June/020620.html Unfortunately OGG Theora didn't make it as the default codec for the HTML5 02 Jul 2009 02:26:07 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/170326 On Wed, Jul 1, 2009 at 8:32 PM, Jimmy Wales <jwales@wikia-inc.com> wrote: > I'd be interested to see your positive, assume-good-faith list of > sug 01 Jul 2009 21:07:33 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/170311 All, I'm very happy to announce that the Ford Foundation has awarded a $300,000 grant to the Wikimedia Foundation to improve our interfaces and workf 01 Jul 2009 18:30:01 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/170306 Going forward, how does the Foundation plan to make large changes to the software in full consultation with the community consensus? Is the assumptio 30 Jun 2009 22:16:31 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/170209 On Tue, Jun 30, 2009 at 10:16 AM, Brion Vibber<brion@wikimedia.org> wrote: > As many folks have noted, our current templating system works ok for > si 30 Jun 2009 18:54:09 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/170199 Talking about antisocial... It's quite interesting what I experienced in this very list. I wasn't aware of the study published in the New Scientist 29 Jun 2009 17:35:50 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/170072 Henrik's Wikipedia article traffic statistics tool does not indicate copyright or license status, so it's not clear if I can include a chart on a Wiki 29 Jun 2009 17:13:55 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/170071 After an initial reference implementation in the English Wikipedia and some bottom-up implementations in a number of projects, the licensing update to 29 Jun 2009 15:31:48 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/170060 Bonjor j'ai l'honneur de vous demander de bien vouloir m'nscrire -- Hadraj Said _______________________________________________ foundation-l mailing 29 Jun 2009 15:14:28 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/170059 What Wikimedia events or activities would you like to see take place in the UK? We're currently trying to pull together ideas for "initiatives" tha 29 Jun 2009 10:43:10 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/170021 Hoi, I am at the moment at a book sprint about Open Translation Tools. One of the topics in the books is how to deal with video. Subtitling and dubbin 28 Jun 2009 06:39:44 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169943 I think that it is very on topic and that we should have it here. What do others think? I know that a lot of foundation-l subscribers are Wikizine su 27 Jun 2009 23:13:58 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169934 'Forget altruism. Misanthropy and egotism are the fuel of online social production. That's the conclusion suggested by a new study of the character tr 27 Jun 2009 14:57:44 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169900 Anyone able to help with this? (Durova's been doing a lot of restoration work on Commons. There has also been discussion on wikien-l about crediting 27 Jun 2009 14:33:06 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169898 Hello, Could someone explain to me why "Wikipedia" is without definite article? In English you say "the Britannica", so why not "the Wikipedia"? I am 27 Jun 2009 08:12:22 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169865 Hi all - just a quick FYI in case you attempt to access the Foundations two official blogs, We've had to shut both blogs down (they live in the sam 26 Jun 2009 10:28:17 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169816 Hello Team, My name is Krishna and outside our corporate robe, we have initiated a Thought Leadership Organization called WOT? (World of Thought). Th 26 Jun 2009 02:37:56 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169764 OK. So let's drop the 'legal scholarship' from the original thread and get back on topic. On Tue, Jun 23, 2009 at 6:33 PM, John Vandenberg<jayvdb@gm 25 Jun 2009 18:08:34 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169728 Hello all, These days at the Village Pump of zhwiki, many wikipedians are arguing about whether Wikimedia project should apply to the US Copyright L 24 Jun 2009 20:38:05 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169646 (As this email may enact changes that affect the total Wikimedia community, please feel free to forward or post this email on any and all applicable 24 Jun 2009 16:37:09 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169635 (As this email may enact changes that affect the total Wikimedia community, please feel free to forward or post this email on any and all applicable 24 Jun 2009 14:22:00 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169624 With the license move... do we still accept GFDL-only material? I've seen OTRSer today accepting and tagging entries released as GFDL only. ________ 24 Jun 2009 08:53:29 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169599 Whatever happened to the language committee? No new languages have been created or even approved for creation in a very long time with only two except 24 Jun 2009 00:20:01 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169566 Hello. Since just a few hours ago, a new public repository has been created to host WikiXRay database dumps, containing info extracted from public Wi 23 Jun 2009 09:26:40 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169509 There are some posts about a new video solution, and even more posts that ... err ... isn't quite correct, but without any official news about it its 22 Jun 2009 05:32:02 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169418 <subject line changed> On Mon, Jun 22, 2009 at 12:55 AM, Anthony <wikimail@inbox.org> wrote: > > On Sun, Jun 21, 2009 at 10:23 AM, Anthony <wikimail@ 21 Jun 2009 16:19:34 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169386 Brian wrote: > That is against the law. It violates Google's ToS. > > I'm mostly complaining that Google is being Very Evil. There is nothing we > can 20 Jun 2009 14:35:52 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169308 http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/infolaw/2009/06/19/using-wikisource-as-an-alternative-open-access-repository-for-legal-scholarship/ Interesting. How wel 20 Jun 2009 08:41:45 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169263 Just wondering whether anyone's had a check in from any of our wikimedians in Iran? Any safety reports on our folks? Philippe ________________ 20 Jun 2009 06:00:15 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169246 Hi all, It's been 10 days since the last note on flagged revisions, which is sufficiently important to warrant a follow up at this point in my view. I 19 Jun 2009 15:47:03 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/169201 OK, the question has popped up so many times, that I think it would only be fair to give it a separate topic on this list :) Now I'd like to have a d 16 Jun 2009 08:41:49 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168860 As per the licensing update decision by the community and the Board, I've updated the site terms on the English Wikipedia (and the WMF website) today, 15 Jun 2009 18:59:49 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168810 Since Facebook is a pretty popular Internet service, where Wikimedia already has a sort of presence, it might make sense for the Foundation to contact 15 Jun 2009 15:14:18 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168785 Hello everybody, I hope, it is never too late to discuss these things. Today, I have noticed the Commons added following text under the edit window: 15 Jun 2009 10:53:38 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168732 David Gerard schrieb: > 2009/6/15 Rama Neko <ramaneko@gmail.com>: > > >> The "service project angle" worries me too. I have noticed that many >> ar 15 Jun 2009 07:56:52 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168711 [foundation-l added back to cc: as well as commons-l] 2009/6/15 Gnangarra <gnangarra@gmail.com>: > Sysops on Commons arent just handed the tools th 15 Jun 2009 02:22:33 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168669 I wish to see no political limitation towards the exploitation of googletranslate technology to the success of wikipedia and its underwriting pockets; 15 Jun 2009 01:50:07 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168663 Hi Cary Bass, Congratulations on your new voluntary position in the oversight of Wikipeida! As a volunteer and regular foundantion-l list e-mail rece 15 Jun 2009 01:39:51 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168662 After an unintentional long delay, there are short summaries of foundation-l posted now for: April: http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/LSS/foundation-l-a 14 Jun 2009 11:00:12 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168630 Good news from the Tamil WP community. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Kiruba @ Kiruba.com <kiruba@kiruba.com> Date: Sat, Jun 13, 2009 14 Jun 2009 10:55:06 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168629 2009/6/9 Platonides <Platonides@gmail.com>: > Sorry if it has already been discussed before but, why has the English > version to be included in the s 12 Jun 2009 19:51:25 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168556 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi all, please see new volunteer position[1] for Email response (OTRS) statistician. This position is 12 Jun 2009 13:54:04 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168540 Summary: Google Chrome includes Ogg support for the <video> element. It also includes H.264 support. Fine, but ... they're also testing HTML5 YouTube 12 Jun 2009 11:22:28 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168526 Hello, I had started a discussion on the Village Pump of Commons. I think Commons is a very important project, and a very complicated project. With 12 Jun 2009 08:10:32 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168511 Hi folks, The 1st Wiki-Conference New York will be held over the weekend of July 25-26 2009 (confirmed!) at New York University, and hosted by Free C 11 Jun 2009 17:18:04 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168478 Wikimedia IRC community, I invite you to read the following announcement and then, if you wish to discuss it, join us on meta at <http://meta.wikimed 11 Jun 2009 14:03:17 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168452 Ladies and Gentlemen, Boys and Girls, (wikimedia-au, chapters-cultural-partnerships, foundation-l) The event that you have (hopefully) heard about, " 10 Jun 2009 20:07:20 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168390 I can not help share this with you. I was looking for the name "devouard" in a little tool I just discovered today (TouchGraph). And I was surprise 10 Jun 2009 07:36:38 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168333 Let me agree with it completely (out of the shadow ;). This feature's aim is obviously to help understand totally "alien" texts to a certain [.at leas 10 Jun 2009 04:38:43 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168319 On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 3:13 PM, Amir E. Aharoni wrote: > Machine translation in its current status is so useless for anything > beyond ordering Oper 09 Jun 2009 20:28:50 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168291 Google has built in support for using its machine translation technology to help bootstrap human translations of Wikipedia articles. http://translate 09 Jun 2009 13:42:47 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168243 All, after some internal discussion with the licensing update committee, I'm proposing the following final site terms to be implemented on all Wikime 09 Jun 2009 00:39:48 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168201 This may be of interest to some Wikimedia contributors. The Digital Open is a competition for youth (under 17) around the world to create innovative f 08 Jun 2009 18:38:13 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168185 I am definitely not opposed to adding in that functionality as I have mentioned in the past: see thread: http://www.mail-archive.com/wikitech-l@list 08 Jun 2009 13:28:19 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168151 We have been talking about how we survived being blocked by the Chinese government during the last June 4th ban but now this is on the table. We hav 08 Jun 2009 11:27:55 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168140 http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?NewsID=30848 Free tuition, admission fee, testing fee. No word on freedom of materials. Anyone know more about 08 Jun 2009 09:17:12 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168127 It would be a simple matter of programming to have something that allows upload of encumbered video and audio formats and re-encode them as Ogg Theora 07 Jun 2009 08:26:47 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/168039 It might be worth seeing if we can get the EFF to add our privacy policy to http://www.tosback.org/timeline.php In order to raise the profile of any c 06 Jun 2009 07:58:02 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167954 bug18898 (https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18898) is relevant, both in the technical response proposed, which is more appropriate for t 06 Jun 2009 02:15:42 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167942 Hello all -- There is an ongoing discussion about a possible global biographies of living people policy at Meta.[1] Any input / comments / suggestio 05 Jun 2009 18:02:14 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167916 Bence Damokos <bdamokos@...> writes: > I'd like to note in the interest of facts that the Huwp stats have been > implemented (without complaint till 05 Jun 2009 13:49:28 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167886 Hello, I wasn't subscribed to this list, since I usually try to avoid the politics around. I was notified, however, that some interesting claims wer 05 Jun 2009 11:03:48 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167874 This is in reference to: http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/foundation-l/2009-May/051889.html I would like to thank Michael Bimmler for steering 05 Jun 2009 10:16:24 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167863 Hi, recently the report of the KnowPrivacy [1] study - a research project by the School of Information from University of California in Berkeley - hi 03 Jun 2009 23:18:38 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167700 On Mon, Jun 1, 2009 at 12:20 PM, Thomas Dalton <thomas.dalton@gmail.com>wrote: > 2009/6/1 Brian <Brian.Mingus@colorado.edu>: > > While I'm thinking a 01 Jun 2009 12:28:08 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167492 Sunday 31th of May the Norwegian newspaper VG (Verdens Gang) compared Wikipedia in Norsk (Bokmål) and Store Norske Leksikon. The latter encyclopedia i 01 Jun 2009 04:03:19 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167455 On Sat, May 30, 2009 at 9:33 PM, Brian <Brian.Mingus@colorado.edu> wrote: > How does Google Wave help the WMF achieve its goals? Not sure, it doesn 31 May 2009 04:42:41 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167335 I would guess a partership with Google would be a good idea because: 1) They are the best (according to Brian) and 2) If we were to go through with th 31 May 2009 00:37:41 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167317 It does sound like an excellent idea, but it does appear to require us teaming up with Google, a hardware vendor, a software vendor (the OS of cours 30 May 2009 22:54:58 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167312 Given currently existing technology, and technology that we can reasonably assume to be available within the next decade, how can the WMF best achieve 30 May 2009 19:38:33 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167309 Hi all, As promised on this list, the election committee has revisited the election dates. The election pages have been updated to reflect new d 30 May 2009 06:34:05 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167268 Probably, some of you already saw that Google made something for which I think that it will be the new form of the mainstream Internet perception. You 29 May 2009 12:10:32 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167170 Hoi, We have been testing the LocalisationUpdate extension for some time now and, we consider it quite good at the moment. We have been testing it in 29 May 2009 03:16:41 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167155 Another step towards an open web -- Google's Chrome browser is going to support Theora video natively with the HTML5 video tag: http://blog.internetne 28 May 2009 13:56:56 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/167128 Hello, The relicensing process is underway. This means we have only 2 months to help GFDL wikis that want Wikipedia compatibility to follow suit. Th 27 May 2009 02:54:43 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166971 Information concerning the election rules, candidacy, and suffrage/ voting requirements for the 2009 election to the Board of Trustees is now poste 27 May 2009 01:41:56 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166966 Some may find this interesting. http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2009/05/22/tech-vancouver-open-source-standards-software-city.html Ec __________ 26 May 2009 20:53:17 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166950 Dear all, I would like to use this opportunity to say "Goodbye" to all of you, because my involvement with Wikimedia is now coming to an end. I could 26 May 2009 10:50:36 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166916 Hi, I hope this is the right list to post this email - otherwise I would appreciate being directed to the right one. Shortly, I would like to prom 26 May 2009 04:00:31 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166879 Hello Everyone, As you may recall the board was restructured last year around this time. At that time we asked the chapters to select two board me 22 May 2009 11:53:23 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166727 Hi all, I saw this news item today; http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8061979.stm and felt that it was tangentially related to the discussions on this 21 May 2009 19:50:09 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166683 In light of the vote results announced regarding the proposed licensing update, the Wikimedia Foundation Board of Trustees has unanimously passed th 21 May 2009 10:25:47 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166641 The licensing update poll has been tallied. "Yes, I am in favor of this change" : 13242 (75.8%) "No, I am opposed to this change" : 1829 (10.5%) "I 20 May 2009 22:54:03 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166624 Hello, Maybe this is interesting for Wikimedians too, certainly for Wikibookians. The Dutch ministry of education is going to set up "Wikiwijs", a pr 19 May 2009 07:40:18 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166502 ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Ave Maria Mõistlik <avjoska@yahoo.com> Date: 2009/5/18 Subject: Fw: Embassies sponsor article-writing co 18 May 2009 20:10:00 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166494 As many of you know, the Foundation has an Audit Committee which represents the Board in oversight of financial and accounting issues, including plann 17 May 2009 15:12:15 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166408 On Fri, May 15, 2009 at 9:33 AM, Birgitte SB <birgitte_sb@yahoo.com> wrote: > Your really didn't address my question.  Why do you think WMF resources 15 May 2009 11:26:55 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166248 --- On Thu, 5/14/09, Aryeh Gregor <Simetrical+wikilist@gmail.com> wrote: > From: Aryeh Gregor <Simetrical+wikilist@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: [Foundat 15 May 2009 10:44:56 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166246 http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8051262.stm Google has an hour of slow service and it's headline news. Imagine the donations we could get if ou 15 May 2009 04:59:45 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166218 Dear Sirs, The day before yesterday (http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Pedidos_a_administradores/Discuss%C3%A3o_de_bloqueio/Arquivo/2009/05#NH) 14 May 2009 15:19:11 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166154 There was a "Wikipedians" group which was apparently started for "networking" (which in practice seemed to mean spam blasts), per http://davidgerard. 14 May 2009 11:47:48 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166108 ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Virgilio A. P. Machado <vam@fct.unl.pt> Date: Thu, May 14, 2009 at 11:29 AM Subject: pt:wiki policies To 14 May 2009 11:32:14 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166104 Here we have an interesting discussion topic. So what /is/ the main focus of Wikimedia? Is it about collecting together free knowledge, or is it about 14 May 2009 05:34:48 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166058 > This is not a photograph of sexual activity , but the after-effects of > sexual activity. A photograph is clearer about the nature of it than > any 14 May 2009 04:46:28 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166055 My opinion on this is clear: Commons should welcome both photographs and pictures. Whether a project shows a picture or a photograph should be the pro 13 May 2009 23:18:58 -0800 http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/wiki/foundation/166050