Mailing List Archive: SpamAssassin: users

Advice

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robert at webtent

Jul 3, 2012, 9:19 AM

Post #1 of 7 (365 views)
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Advice

Looking for some advice, hope it's OK to ask here. I have a few
customers over the past several months start getting an unusual amount
of messages being blocked or returned when sending via our SMTP servers.
I have checked that none of our servers are listed on any databases, but
after some querying of the customers involved, I have found that they
all have recently been sending mailing to their customer lists. Even
though all of them assure me that these lists are only of the opt-in
variety, it is the only thing they all have in common and seems to be
the problem.

I have also noticed that every time one of these mailings is sent with
several AOL users, our servers will be temporarily blocked. Are there
some precautions I should take to possible get their mails trusted? Any
other advice?

--
Robert

larrys at fullcompass

Jul 3, 2012, 9:23 AM

Post #2 of 7 (345 views)
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Re: Advice [In reply to]

AOL does operate their own, volume mail, blocking and require some sort of
registration in order to send buld mail to AOL users. You may want to
contact AOL for details.

Sorry I don't have that contact information readily available.

On Tuesday, July 03, 2012 11:19:05 Robert Fitzpatrick wrote:
> Looking for some advice, hope it's OK to ask here. I have a few
> customers over the past several months start getting an unusual amount
> of messages being blocked or returned when sending via our SMTP servers.
> I have checked that none of our servers are listed on any databases, but
> after some querying of the customers involved, I have found that they
> all have recently been sending mailing to their customer lists. Even
> though all of them assure me that these lists are only of the opt-in
> variety, it is the only thing they all have in common and seems to be
> the problem.
>
> I have also noticed that every time one of these mailings is sent with
> several AOL users, our servers will be temporarily blocked. Are there
> some precautions I should take to possible get their mails trusted? Any
> other advice?
>
> --
> Robert

--
Larry Starr
Software Engineer
Full Compass Systems
9770 Silicon Prairie Pkwy
Madison, WI 53593-8442
P: 608-831-7330 x1347
F: 608-831-6330
E: larrys [at] fullcompass

KMcGrail at PCCC

Jul 3, 2012, 9:25 AM

Post #3 of 7 (348 views)
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Re: Advice [In reply to]

On 7/3/2012 12:19 PM, Robert Fitzpatrick wrote:
> Looking for some advice, hope it's OK to ask here. I have a few
> customers over the past several months start getting an unusual amount
> of messages being blocked or returned when sending via our SMTP servers.
> I have checked that none of our servers are listed on any databases, but
> after some querying of the customers involved, I have found that they
> all have recently been sending mailing to their customer lists. Even
> though all of them assure me that these lists are only of the opt-in
> variety, it is the only thing they all have in common and seems to be
> the problem.
>
> I have also noticed that every time one of these mailings is sent with
> several AOL users, our servers will be temporarily blocked. Are there
> some precautions I should take to possible get their mails trusted? Any
> other advice?
>
>

I would likely look at setting up feedback loops for Spam complaints
such as:

http://postmaster.aol.com/Postmaster.FeedbackLoop.php

Regards,
KAM

Bowie_Bailey at BUC

Jul 3, 2012, 9:51 AM

Post #4 of 7 (345 views)
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Re: Advice [In reply to]

On 7/3/2012 12:25 PM, Kevin A. McGrail wrote:
> On 7/3/2012 12:19 PM, Robert Fitzpatrick wrote:
>> Looking for some advice, hope it's OK to ask here. I have a few
>> customers over the past several months start getting an unusual amount
>> of messages being blocked or returned when sending via our SMTP servers.
>> I have checked that none of our servers are listed on any databases, but
>> after some querying of the customers involved, I have found that they
>> all have recently been sending mailing to their customer lists. Even
>> though all of them assure me that these lists are only of the opt-in
>> variety, it is the only thing they all have in common and seems to be
>> the problem.
>>
>> I have also noticed that every time one of these mailings is sent with
>> several AOL users, our servers will be temporarily blocked. Are there
>> some precautions I should take to possible get their mails trusted? Any
>> other advice?
>>
>>
> I would likely look at setting up feedback loops for Spam complaints
> such as:
>
> http://postmaster.aol.com/Postmaster.FeedbackLoop.php

I've had this set up for a while. I find the emails they send to be
almost useless. I don't know if there is any benefit to simply being
signed up.

You get emails that basically say, "someone thinks your email is junk,
but we're not going to tell you who." And they obfuscate the email
addresses in the attached email. So unless you have something else in
the email to tell you who the recipient was, you can't even take the
person off your list.

--
Bowie

KMcGrail at PCCC

Jul 3, 2012, 11:34 AM

Post #5 of 7 (345 views)
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Re: Advice [In reply to]

On 7/3/2012 12:51 PM, Bowie Bailey wrote:
> I've had this set up for a while. I find the emails they send to be
> almost useless. I don't know if there is any benefit to simply being
> signed up.
>
> You get emails that basically say, "someone thinks your email is junk,
> but we're not going to tell you who." And they obfuscate the email
> addresses in the attached email. So unless you have something else in
> the email to tell you who the recipient was, you can't even take the
> person off your list.
The point isn't to remove the person complaining as much as it is to
know if you have patterns of problems.

So if I get 45 complaints, I can usually look and see that someone isn't
using opt-in lists or has a virus, etc.

michael.scheidell at secnap

Jul 3, 2012, 11:38 AM

Post #6 of 7 (341 views)
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Re: Advice [In reply to]

On 7/3/12 2:34 PM, Kevin A. McGrail wrote:
> On 7/3/2012 12:51 PM, Bowie Bailey wrote:
>> I've had this set up for a while. I find the emails they send to be
>> almost useless. I don't know if there is any benefit to simply being
>> signed up.

>>
>>
> The point isn't to remove the person complaining as much as it is to
> know if you have patterns of problems.
>
> So if I get 45 complaints, I can usually look and see that someone
> isn't using opt-in lists or has a virus, etc.
to confirm, the point for AOL isn't 'list washing', since if you get a
lot of complaints, this means that a large multiple of that number has
manually blacklisted you and your network :-(

oh, and you can't get past AOL's rate limiting unless you do sign up.

So, it works exactly as AOL designed it.

ESP's who listwash and don't want to disable spamming clients can't get
on AOL's good list

--
Michael Scheidell, CTO
o: 561-999-5000
d: 561-948-2259
>*| *SECNAP Network Security Corporation

* Best Mobile Solutions Product of 2011
* Best Intrusion Prevention Product
* Hot Company Finalist 2011
* Best Email Security Product
* Certified SNORT Integrator

______________________________________________________________________
This email has been scanned and certified safe by SpammerTrap(r).
For Information please see http://www.spammertrap.com/
______________________________________________________________________

rramsdell at activedg

Jul 5, 2012, 1:12 PM

Post #7 of 7 (330 views)
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Re: Advice [In reply to]

On 07/03/2012 12:51 PM, Bowie Bailey wrote:
> On 7/3/2012 12:25 PM, Kevin A. McGrail wrote:
>> On 7/3/2012 12:19 PM, Robert Fitzpatrick wrote:
>>> Looking for some advice, hope it's OK to ask here. I have a few
>>> customers over the past several months start getting an unusual amount
>>> of messages being blocked or returned when sending via our SMTP servers.
>>> I have checked that none of our servers are listed on any databases, but
>>> after some querying of the customers involved, I have found that they
>>> all have recently been sending mailing to their customer lists. Even
>>> though all of them assure me that these lists are only of the opt-in
>>> variety, it is the only thing they all have in common and seems to be
>>> the problem.
>>>
>>> I have also noticed that every time one of these mailings is sent with
>>> several AOL users, our servers will be temporarily blocked. Are there
>>> some precautions I should take to possible get their mails trusted? Any
>>> other advice?
>>>
>>>
>> I would likely look at setting up feedback loops for Spam complaints
>> such as:
>>
>> http://postmaster.aol.com/Postmaster.FeedbackLoop.php
> I've had this set up for a while. I find the emails they send to be
> almost useless. I don't know if there is any benefit to simply being
> signed up.
>
> You get emails that basically say, "someone thinks your email is junk,
> but we're not going to tell you who." And they obfuscate the email
> addresses in the attached email. So unless you have something else in
> the email to tell you who the recipient was, you can't even take the
> person off your list.
>
The always redact the email address so you have to tag a unique ID for
that customer. In addition, once you are on the feedback list, then
apply for the whitelist.

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