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fiber plant management?

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streiner at cluebyfour

Feb 4, 2010, 6:56 AM

Post #1 of 9 (1436 views)
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fiber plant management?

To those of you who currently operate large campus/metro fiber plants,
what are you currently using to track the usage of that plant? By that I
mean things such as:
* tracking the number of free/used/unusable strands in a cable
* tracking conduit utilization
* tying OTDR test results/power meter readings to strands
* trying as-built drawings to cable routes and plant assets like
manholes, junction boxes, transition splice points, duct banks,
utility poles, etc.
* mapping termination bays to cables
* tracking cross-connects and splice locations
* grouping cable segments and cross-connects together into a path/circuit
* utilization reports, etc.

I've looked at one or two commercial packages, and might look at more as
time permits. I haven't seen much in the open-source world, and I suspect
that many places ended up rolling their own management apps to tie into
existing provisioning systems, etc. It's possible that I could end up
going that route as well.

jms

martin at theicelandguy

Feb 4, 2010, 9:38 PM

Post #2 of 9 (1373 views)
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Re: fiber plant management? [In reply to]

Honestly? A spreadsheet will do it.

-M<

On 2/4/10, Justin M. Streiner <streiner [at] cluebyfour> wrote:
> To those of you who currently operate large campus/metro fiber plants,
> what are you currently using to track the usage of that plant? By that I
> mean things such as:
> * tracking the number of free/used/unusable strands in a cable
> * tracking conduit utilization
> * tying OTDR test results/power meter readings to strands
> * trying as-built drawings to cable routes and plant assets like
> manholes, junction boxes, transition splice points, duct banks,
> utility poles, etc.
> * mapping termination bays to cables
> * tracking cross-connects and splice locations
> * grouping cable segments and cross-connects together into a path/circuit
> * utilization reports, etc.
>
> I've looked at one or two commercial packages, and might look at more as
> time permits. I haven't seen much in the open-source world, and I suspect
> that many places ended up rolling their own management apps to tie into
> existing provisioning systems, etc. It's possible that I could end up
> going that route as well.
>
> jms
>
>

--
Martin Hannigan martin [at] theicelandguy
p: +16178216079
Power, Network, and Costs Consulting for Iceland Datacenters and Occupants

streiner at cluebyfour

Feb 5, 2010, 11:26 AM

Post #3 of 9 (1369 views)
Permalink

Re: fiber plant management? [In reply to]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2010, Martin Hannigan wrote:

> Honestly? A spreadsheet will do it.

Our fiber plant is large enough, and enough people make changes that a
spreadsheet is not a scalable option.

jms

> On 2/4/10, Justin M. Streiner <streiner [at] cluebyfour> wrote:
>> To those of you who currently operate large campus/metro fiber plants,
>> what are you currently using to track the usage of that plant? By that I
>> mean things such as:
>> * tracking the number of free/used/unusable strands in a cable
>> * tracking conduit utilization
>> * tying OTDR test results/power meter readings to strands
>> * trying as-built drawings to cable routes and plant assets like
>> manholes, junction boxes, transition splice points, duct banks,
>> utility poles, etc.
>> * mapping termination bays to cables
>> * tracking cross-connects and splice locations
>> * grouping cable segments and cross-connects together into a path/circuit
>> * utilization reports, etc.
>>
>> I've looked at one or two commercial packages, and might look at more as
>> time permits. I haven't seen much in the open-source world, and I suspect
>> that many places ended up rolling their own management apps to tie into
>> existing provisioning systems, etc. It's possible that I could end up
>> going that route as well.
>>
>> jms
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Martin Hannigan martin [at] theicelandguy
> p: +16178216079
> Power, Network, and Costs Consulting for Iceland Datacenters and Occupants
>

martin at theicelandguy

Feb 5, 2010, 12:02 PM

Post #4 of 9 (1366 views)
Permalink

Re: fiber plant management? [In reply to]

On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 2:26 PM, Justin M. Streiner
<streiner [at] cluebyfour>wrote:

> On Fri, 5 Feb 2010, Martin Hannigan wrote:
>
> Honestly? A spreadsheet will do it.
>>
>
> Our fiber plant is large enough, and enough people make changes that a
> spreadsheet is not a scalable option.
>
>

How large?

--
Martin Hannigan martin [at] theicelandguy
p: +16178216079
Power, Network, and Costs Consulting for Iceland Datacenters and Occupants

dustin at rseng

Feb 5, 2010, 1:05 PM

Post #5 of 9 (1363 views)
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RE: fiber plant management? [In reply to]

Hello fellow Nanogers,

I know this is an emotional issue for some but we're looking at some upgrades to our cores and being a classic cisco shop we're wondering if anyone has had any experience with the Cisco ASR models in the service provider space. We're used to running VXR's and are trying to make a decision between going with G2 proc or moving into the ASR's. These would be edge routers. Any input would be appreciated. Thank you.

Dustin

Dustin Jurman
CEO
1211 North Westshore Blvd - Suite 711
Tampa, Fl 33607
813-232-4887
dustin [at] rseng
"Building Better Infrastructure"

-----Original Message-----
From: Martin Hannigan [mailto:martin [at] theicelandguy]
Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 3:02 PM
To: Justin M. Streiner
Cc: nanog [at] nanog
Subject: Re: fiber plant management?

On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 2:26 PM, Justin M. Streiner
<streiner [at] cluebyfour>wrote:

> On Fri, 5 Feb 2010, Martin Hannigan wrote:
>
> Honestly? A spreadsheet will do it.
>>
>
> Our fiber plant is large enough, and enough people make changes that a
> spreadsheet is not a scalable option.
>
>

How large?

--
Martin Hannigan martin [at] theicelandguy
p: +16178216079
Power, Network, and Costs Consulting for Iceland Datacenters and Occupants

streiner at cluebyfour

Feb 5, 2010, 1:28 PM

Post #6 of 9 (1367 views)
Permalink

RE: fiber plant management? [In reply to]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2010, Dustin Jurman wrote:

> I know this is an emotional issue for some but we're looking at some
> upgrades to our cores and being a classic cisco shop we're wondering if
> anyone has had any experience with the Cisco ASR models in the service
> provider space. We're used to running VXR's and are trying to make a
> decision between going with G2 proc or moving into the ASR's. These
> would be edge routers. Any input would be appreciated. Thank you.

Wouldn't it be better to start a new thread for this, rather trying to
hijack an unrelated thread? VXRs and ASRs have nothing to do with fiber
plant management.

jms

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Martin Hannigan [mailto:martin [at] theicelandguy]
> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 3:02 PM
> To: Justin M. Streiner
> Cc: nanog [at] nanog
> Subject: Re: fiber plant management?
>
> On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 2:26 PM, Justin M. Streiner
> <streiner [at] cluebyfour>wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 5 Feb 2010, Martin Hannigan wrote:
>>
>> Honestly? A spreadsheet will do it.
>>>
>>
>> Our fiber plant is large enough, and enough people make changes that a
>> spreadsheet is not a scalable option.
>>
>>
>
>
> How large?
>
>
>
> --
> Martin Hannigan martin [at] theicelandguy
> p: +16178216079
> Power, Network, and Costs Consulting for Iceland Datacenters and Occupants
>
>
>

jackson.tim at gmail

Feb 5, 2010, 1:42 PM

Post #7 of 9 (1374 views)
Permalink

Re: fiber plant management? [In reply to]

We're in the process of evaluating:

http://www.stellarrad.com/windowsbased/stellarmap.cfm

So far it looks OK... Our OSP guys & technicians seem happy with it,
which is the important part... Something that helps them identify
where a potential problem or where plant is down is the #1 goal we're
after.. The hardest part is actually gathering the data to put into
the system, we're gathering every pole & every splice to enter into
the system...

And no, an Excel sheet does not work...

--
Tim

On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 1:26 PM, Justin M. Streiner
<streiner [at] cluebyfour> wrote:
> On Fri, 5 Feb 2010, Martin Hannigan wrote:
>
>> Honestly? A spreadsheet will do it.
>
> Our fiber plant is large enough, and enough people make changes that a
> spreadsheet is not a scalable option.
>
> jms
>
>> On 2/4/10, Justin M. Streiner <streiner [at] cluebyfour> wrote:
>>>
>>> To those of you who currently operate large campus/metro fiber plants,
>>> what are you currently using to track the usage of that plant? �By that I
>>> mean things such as:
>>> * tracking the number of free/used/unusable strands in a cable
>>> * tracking conduit utilization
>>> * tying OTDR test results/power meter readings to strands
>>> * trying as-built drawings to cable routes and plant assets like
>>> � � � �manholes, junction boxes, transition splice points, duct banks,
>>> � � � �utility poles, etc.
>>> * mapping termination bays to cables
>>> * tracking cross-connects and splice locations
>>> * grouping cable segments and cross-connects together into a path/circuit
>>> * utilization reports, etc.
>>>
>>> I've looked at one or two commercial packages, and might look at more as
>>> time permits. �I haven't seen much in the open-source world, and I
>>> suspect
>>> that many places ended up rolling their own management apps to tie into
>>> existing provisioning systems, etc. �It's possible that I could end up
>>> going that route as well.
>>>
>>> jms
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Martin Hannigan � � � � � � � � � � � � � � � martin [at] theicelandguy
>> p: +16178216079
>> Power, Network, and Costs Consulting for Iceland Datacenters and Occupants
>>
>
>

streiner at cluebyfour

Feb 5, 2010, 1:43 PM

Post #8 of 9 (1368 views)
Permalink

Re: fiber plant management? [In reply to]

On Fri, 5 Feb 2010, Martin Hannigan wrote:

>> Our fiber plant is large enough, and enough people make changes that a
>> spreadsheet is not a scalable option.
>
> How large?

Around 90 buildings, lots of conduits/manholes/pullboxes, lots of owned
fiber or varying vintages, lots of leased fiber. Around a dozen people
have the ability to work on the plant. A spreadsheet won't cut it.

jms

wavetossed at googlemail

Feb 6, 2010, 2:01 PM

Post #9 of 9 (1325 views)
Permalink

Re: fiber plant management? [In reply to]

On Fri, Feb 5, 2010 at 5:38 AM, Martin Hannigan
<martin [at] theicelandguy> wrote:
> Honestly? A spreadsheet will do it.

Let me translate that into plain English for you.
He said that a "barebones database" will do it and he happens to use a
simple one that he built himself.

Clearly there are scaling issues with his technology choice, but other
than that, his solution is probably the most common one you will find
out there. Most ISPs use a straightforward database (usually a
full-blown relational one) and build their own application around it.
A company that I worked at 10 years ago built a system around a CRM
tool called Vantive. At first glance, CRM tools are not the kind of
thing you would normally choose for tracking circuits and physical
plant. But since this CRM tool allowed customization with VBA, and
since VBA allowed access to full-blown relational databases, we ended
up with a very nice tool that not only tracked circuits, fibres, etc.
but also allowed us to link it all to customers so if there was a
specific fibre route cut, we could immediately get a list of contact
names and numbers for all customers whose services were affected.

My advice is to find out what in-house database skills you have
available, and get them to build a simple records system using Oracle,
PostreSQL, DB2, SQL Server or similar, and to make sure that they
understand that the intent is to evolve it step by step into a
full-blown system. This last is important so that they think about how
to make a long-term design and make fewer mistakes that need to be
fixed later.

--Michael Dillon

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