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Using twitter as an outage notification (was: Fire, Power loss at Fisher Plaza in Seattle)

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Jul 4, 2009, 3:17 AM

Post #1 of 60 (1329 views)
Permalink

Using twitter as an outage notification (was: Fire, Power loss at Fisher Plaza in Seattle)

In article <786BA8C0-B534-40FF-9126-1E33BD11CB3C[at]americafree.tv>,
Marshall Eubanks <tme[at]americafree.tv> writes
>> That's a great idea, use some lame Web 2.0 trend to communicate with
>> actual real life customers. </sarcasm>
>>
>I would assume they figured it was better than just remaining silent.

I'm about to recommend to an organisation that it [a twitter account] is
better than posting news of an outage on their low-volume website, which
will get swamped when too many people poll it for news.

What does the team think?

Paying a lot more to host the website with higher "burst" capacity
during an emergency, isn't an option.

The only other idea I've had is to sign all the customers up to receive
an SMS via some sort of broadcast service (the news will fit easily in
one SMS).
--
Roland Perry

brandon at rd

Jul 4, 2009, 5:22 AM

Post #2 of 60 (1291 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification (was: Fire, Power loss at Fisher Plaza in Seattle) [In reply to]

> Paying a lot more to host the website with higher "burst" capacity
> during an emergency, isn't an option.
>
> The only other idea I've had is to sign all the customers up to receive
> an SMS via some sort of broadcast service (the news will fit easily in
> one SMS).

If the event is suitably calamitous we will do that for you -

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/help/5194672.stm

brandon

lists at internetpolicyagency

Jul 4, 2009, 5:52 AM

Post #3 of 60 (1289 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification (was: Fire, Power loss at Fisher Plaza in Seattle) [In reply to]

In article <200907041222.NAA23352[at]sunf10.rd.bbc.co.uk>, Brandon
Butterworth <brandon[at]rd.bbc.co.uk> writes
>> Paying a lot more to host the website with higher "burst" capacity
>> during an emergency, isn't an option.
>>
>> The only other idea I've had is to sign all the customers up to receive
>> an SMS via some sort of broadcast service (the news will fit easily in
>> one SMS).
>
>If the event is suitably calamitous we will do that for you -
>
>http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/help/5194672.stm

The "event" (typically closing a High School because of snow, but we
have swine flu these days too) is currently reported mainly by local
radio stations. However it doesn't scale - there are perhaps two hundred
of them trying to phone in to one radio station during the same 15
minutes after they made the decision, half an hour before the school is
supposed to open for the day.

Another problem with a literally "broadcast" system is that it takes
them too long to read out the names of the schools which are closed,
even if trying to cover just one county.

Nor does it matter to anyone except a particular closed group of perhaps
1000 households whether any one school is closed - so telling everyone
is a bit of a waste.

So it seemed to me that a Tweet from the school would be an ideal
solution.

But a system like yours, if it could be divided up into a few tens of
thousands of SIGs (one for each school), is the kind of "more
traditional" solution I was thinking about.
--
Roland Perry

tme at americafree

Jul 4, 2009, 6:47 AM

Post #4 of 60 (1289 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification (was: Fire, Power loss at Fisher Plaza in Seattle) [In reply to]

On Jul 4, 2009, at 6:17 AM, Roland Perry wrote:

> In article <786BA8C0-B534-40FF-9126-1E33BD11CB3C[at]americafree.tv>,
> Marshall Eubanks <tme[at]americafree.tv> writes
>>> That's a great idea, use some lame Web 2.0 trend to communicate with
>>> actual real life customers. </sarcasm>
>>>
>> I would assume they figured it was better than just remaining silent.
>
> I'm about to recommend to an organisation that it [a twitter
> account] is better than posting news of an outage on their low-
> volume website, which will get swamped when too many people poll it
> for news.
>

What if the outage takes out their website too ?

I don't think that their website was up, and I would guess that they
didn't have email either. That
is a bad situation to be in.

Note, BTW, that twitter itself is subject to frequent planned and
unplanned outages.

Marshall

> What does the team think?
>
> Paying a lot more to host the website with higher "burst" capacity
> during an emergency, isn't an option.
>
> The only other idea I've had is to sign all the customers up to
> receive an SMS via some sort of broadcast service (the news will fit
> easily in one SMS).
> --
> Roland Perry
>
>

Regards
Marshall Eubanks
CEO / AmericaFree.TV

jcdill.lists at gmail

Jul 4, 2009, 6:50 AM

Post #5 of 60 (1289 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

Roland Perry wrote:
> In article <786BA8C0-B534-40FF-9126-1E33BD11CB3C[at]americafree.tv>,
> Marshall Eubanks <tme[at]americafree.tv> writes
>>> That's a great idea, use some lame Web 2.0 trend to communicate with
>>> actual real life customers. </sarcasm>
>>>
>> I would assume they figured it was better than just remaining silent.
>
> I'm about to recommend to an organisation that it [a twitter account]
> is better than posting news of an outage on their low-volume website,
> which will get swamped when too many people poll it for news.
>
> What does the team think?

I don't understand why this is an either/or question. Why not post to both?

Twitter is a great method of communication, for those that use twitter.
But some people don't use twitter. So use every avenue you have. If
you have a customer mailing list for announcements, send email. If you
have a blog, post to the blog.

I'm in the process of setting up posterous to post to a blog, myspace,
facebook, and twitter all with one email. Can't get much simpler than
that for getting the word out via all the channels (assuming that
outbound email is working). (Obviously some businesses don't want/need
myspace or facebook, but if you use them, post there too.)

http://posterous.com/autopost

Quoting:

How does autoposting work?

Just set up your other accounts here. The next time you post to
posterous, we will instantly autopost everywhere else.
Facebook profile newsfeeds will be updated each time you post to notify
your friends. You can also autopost photos to your photo album and embed
your blog directly in your profile.

Twitter messages will use the title of your post up to 130 characters,
and then append a shortened post.ly url.

Flickr photos will be put automatically in your photostream. If you
attach multiple photos, we'll post them all in the order we receive them.

Blogs will be updated with the full content you send us. We'll host your
images, music and files, so you don't have to lift a finger.

You control where we post.

Just email the right address and we'll do the right thing.
Post Everywhere? post[at]posterous.com as usual
Twitter? twitter[at]posterous.com
Flickr? flickr[at]posterous.com
Facebook? facebook[at]posterous.com
Tumblr? tumblr[at]posterous.com
Any other blog? blog[at]posterous.com
Posterous only? posterous[at]posterous.com
Combine them! flickr+twitter[at]posterous.com

You can also address an email to #{text}@posterous.com and it will post
to any site where the url contains that text.

#apple[at]posterous.com will go to apple.wordpress.com and
flickr.com/apple, but NOT banana.blogspot.com.

jc

lists at internetpolicyagency

Jul 4, 2009, 7:43 AM

Post #6 of 60 (1288 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification (was: Fire, Power loss at Fisher Plaza in Seattle) [In reply to]

In article <F832A12A-0AED-4A01-955D-E24DCA6181C8[at]americafree.tv>,
Marshall Eubanks <tme[at]americafree.tv> writes

>>>> That's a great idea, use some lame Web 2.0 trend to communicate with
>>>> actual real life customers. </sarcasm>
>>>>
>>> I would assume they figured it was better than just remaining silent.
>>
>> I'm about to recommend to an organisation that it [a twitter account]
>>is better than posting news of an outage on their low- volume website,
>>which will get swamped when too many people poll it for news.
>
>What if the outage takes out their website too ?

The website is hosted elsewhere, however the entire message can be
delivered in one Tweet, so there's no need to confirm by looking at a
website.

>I don't think that their website was up, and I would guess that they
>didn't have email either. That is a bad situation to be in.

They don't plan to respond to email in real time.

>Note, BTW, that twitter itself is subject to frequent planned and
>unplanned outages.

The question being, how often will they co-incide with the events I'm
trying to track?

fwiw, I've been using twitter for about three months now, and have never
encountered either kind of outage.

--
Roland Perry

jeffrey.lyon at blacklotus

Jul 4, 2009, 7:47 AM

Post #7 of 60 (1289 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification (was: Fire, Power loss at Fisher Plaza in Seattle) [In reply to]

Personally, I find it difficult to take Twitter seriously. It seems
like more of a kids toy than a business tool. Something like a
blogspot account would make a lot more sense.

Jeff

On 7/4/09, Marshall Eubanks <tme[at]americafree.tv> wrote:
>
> On Jul 4, 2009, at 6:17 AM, Roland Perry wrote:
>
>
> > In article
> <786BA8C0-B534-40FF-9126-1E33BD11CB3C[at]americafree.tv>,
> Marshall Eubanks <tme[at]americafree.tv> writes
> >
> > >
> > > > That's a great idea, use some lame Web 2.0 trend to communicate with
> > > > actual real life customers. </sarcasm>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > I would assume they figured it was better than just remaining silent.
> > >
> >
> > I'm about to recommend to an organisation that it [a twitter account] is
> better than posting news of an outage on their low-volume website, which
> will get swamped when too many people poll it for news.
> >
> >
>
> What if the outage takes out their website too ?
>
> I don't think that their website was up, and I would guess that they didn't
> have email either. That
> is a bad situation to be in.
>
> Note, BTW, that twitter itself is subject to frequent planned and unplanned
> outages.
>
> Marshall
>
>
> > What does the team think?
> >
> > Paying a lot more to host the website with higher "burst" capacity during
> an emergency, isn't an option.
> >
> > The only other idea I've had is to sign all the customers up to receive an
> SMS via some sort of broadcast service (the news will fit easily in one
> SMS).
> > --
> > Roland Perry
> >
> >
> >
>
> Regards
> Marshall Eubanks
> CEO / AmericaFree.TV
>
>
>
>
>

--
Jeffrey Lyon, Leadership Team
jeffrey.lyon[at]blacklotus.net | http://www.blacklotus.net
Black Lotus Communications of The IRC Company, Inc.

Look for us at HostingCon 2009 in Washington, DC on August 10th - 12th
at Booth #401.

lists at internetpolicyagency

Jul 4, 2009, 7:50 AM

Post #8 of 60 (1288 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

In article <4A4F5E3C.5040301[at]gmail.com>, JC Dill
<jcdill.lists[at]gmail.com> writes

>>>> That's a great idea, use some lame Web 2.0 trend to communicate with
>>>> actual real life customers. </sarcasm>
>>>>
>>> I would assume they figured it was better than just remaining silent.
>>
>> I'm about to recommend to an organisation that it [a twitter account]
>>is better than posting news of an outage on their low-volume website,
>>which will get swamped when too many people poll it for news.
>>
>> What does the team think?
>
>I don't understand why this is an either/or question. Why not post to both?

Yes, that can be done.

What I'm trying to anticipate is the objection to *also* posting to
Twitter, which might be raised on the grounds that it's too
"unofficial", or "unsupported" or something like that.

>You control where we post.
>
>Just email the right address and we'll do the right thing.
>Post Everywhere? post[at]posterous.com as usual
>Twitter? twitter[at]posterous.com
>Flickr? flickr[at]posterous.com
>Facebook? facebook[at]posterous.com
>Tumblr? tumblr[at]posterous.com
>Any other blog? blog[at]posterous.com
>Posterous only? posterous[at]posterous.com
>Combine them! flickr+twitter[at]posterous.com

It's this richness which confuses the ordinary person. How are they to
know which bit of the scattergun approach is the right one to use? Or
whether "posting everywhere" has some hidden disadvantage.
--
Roland Perry

m.hallgren at free

Jul 4, 2009, 7:58 AM

Post #9 of 60 (1289 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification (was: Fire, Power loss at Fisher Plaza in Seattle) [In reply to]

Le samedi 04 juillet 2009 à 10:47 -0400, Jeffrey Lyon a écrit :
> Personally, I find it difficult to take Twitter seriously. It seems
> like more of a kids toy than a business tool. Something like a
> blogspot account would make a lot more sense.

Yes.

What about (continue to) use old email (inc lists), coupled with
some roughly out-of-band like cell/pots/sms service? And in parallel
old irc, et al.

Any severe problem with, asking us to move over to "portal
services"?

mh
>
> Jeff
>
>
>
> On 7/4/09, Marshall Eubanks <tme[at]americafree.tv> wrote:
> >
> > On Jul 4, 2009, at 6:17 AM, Roland Perry wrote:
> >
> >
> > > In article
> > <786BA8C0-B534-40FF-9126-1E33BD11CB3C[at]americafree.tv>,
> > Marshall Eubanks <tme[at]americafree.tv> writes
> > >
> > > >
> > > > > That's a great idea, use some lame Web 2.0 trend to communicate with
> > > > > actual real life customers. </sarcasm>
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > I would assume they figured it was better than just remaining silent.
> > > >
> > >
> > > I'm about to recommend to an organisation that it [a twitter account] is
> > better than posting news of an outage on their low-volume website, which
> > will get swamped when too many people poll it for news.
> > >
> > >
> >
> > What if the outage takes out their website too ?
> >
> > I don't think that their website was up, and I would guess that they didn't
> > have email either. That
> > is a bad situation to be in.
> >
> > Note, BTW, that twitter itself is subject to frequent planned and unplanned
> > outages.
> >
> > Marshall
> >
> >
> > > What does the team think?
> > >
> > > Paying a lot more to host the website with higher "burst" capacity during
> > an emergency, isn't an option.
> > >
> > > The only other idea I've had is to sign all the customers up to receive an
> > SMS via some sort of broadcast service (the news will fit easily in one
> > SMS).
> > > --
> > > Roland Perry
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > Regards
> > Marshall Eubanks
> > CEO / AmericaFree.TV
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
--
michael hallgren, mh2198-ripe

jcdill.lists at gmail

Jul 4, 2009, 8:02 AM

Post #10 of 60 (1289 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

Roland Perry wrote:
>
> What I'm trying to anticipate is the objection to *also* posting to
> Twitter, which might be raised on the grounds that it's too
> "unofficial", or "unsupported" or something like that.
Anyone who makes that argument is just showing how little they know
about Twitter. It would be like complaining you shouldn't use email
because "not everyone has email".

>> You control where we post.
>>
>> Just email the right address and we'll do the right thing.
>> Post Everywhere? post[at]posterous.com as usual
>> Twitter? twitter[at]posterous.com
>> Flickr? flickr[at]posterous.com
>> Facebook? facebook[at]posterous.com
>> Tumblr? tumblr[at]posterous.com
>> Any other blog? blog[at]posterous.com
>> Posterous only? posterous[at]posterous.com
>> Combine them! flickr+twitter[at]posterous.com
>
> It's this richness which confuses the ordinary person.
That's a lot like saying Perl is too complicated for the ordinary person
so never use Perl. :-)
> How are they to know which bit of the scattergun approach is the right
> one to use? Or whether "posting everywhere" has some hidden disadvantage.

You can configure it and use it however YOU want. If it's too confusing
to use it selectively - sometimes posting in all places, sometimes
posting in just one place, then configure it for your preferred use and
use the regular "post everywhere" method each time you post. For
network outage announcements it would work perfectly to post to Twitter
and your company blog(s) in one step. Bonus - if it can't reach one
system at least the post gets posted on the other system. For this
reason your company may want to setup a shadow blog on one of the free
blogging platforms, in addition to a blog on the company website. This
way if your website is down, the news on the other blog is still out
there for those that follow the blog to find/read.

The configurable aspects of posterous are most helpful for people who
have more diverse posting habits - who want to post news to some (but
not all) channels, who sometimes post chatty things they want to go to
facebook, sometimes post business things they don't want to go to
facebook, who post photos they want to go to flickr and facebook but not
their blog, etc. If you are active with social networking it would be
perfect. I you just use it as an announcement tool, just use the defaults.

jc

lists at internetpolicyagency

Jul 4, 2009, 8:07 AM

Post #11 of 60 (1288 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification (was: Fire, Power loss at Fisher Plaza in Seattle) [In reply to]

In article
<16720fe00907040747k67ca1206kb871420deb5e8163[at]mail.gmail.com>, Jeffrey
Lyon <jeffrey.lyon[at]blacklotus.net> writes
>Personally, I find it difficult to take Twitter seriously. It seems
>like more of a kids toy than a business tool. Something like a
>blogspot account would make a lot more sense.

That's the kind of "marketing-led" response I was hoping to hear.

But the UK National Rail system now uses Tweets to tell customers about
disruptions on the trains, and several major UK government departments
and news organisations use it for announcements and "Breaking News".

So has it become "respectable" yet?
--
Roland Perry

lists at internetpolicyagency

Jul 4, 2009, 8:16 AM

Post #12 of 60 (1289 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

In article <4A4F6EF5.9030502[at]gmail.com>, JC Dill
<jcdill.lists[at]gmail.com> writes

>> What I'm trying to anticipate is the objection to *also* posting to
>>Twitter, which might be raised on the grounds that it's too
>>"unofficial", or "unsupported" or something like that.

>Anyone who makes that argument is just showing how little they know
>about Twitter.

So that's 98% of the population then...

>It would be like complaining you shouldn't use email because "not
>everyone has email".

But email has become respectable, although I still see "people who know
better" starting speeches with 'of course, ten years ago none of us used
email, but now....' which shows they are very late adopters themselves.

>>> You control where we post.
>>>
>>> Just email the right address and we'll do the right thing.
>>> Post Everywhere? post[at]posterous.com as usual
>>> Twitter? twitter[at]posterous.com
>>> Flickr? flickr[at]posterous.com
>>> Facebook? facebook[at]posterous.com
>>> Tumblr? tumblr[at]posterous.com
>>> Any other blog? blog[at]posterous.com
>>> Posterous only? posterous[at]posterous.com
>>> Combine them! flickr+twitter[at]posterous.com
>>
>> It's this richness which confuses the ordinary person.

>That's a lot like saying Perl is too complicated for the ordinary
>person so never use Perl. :-)

You are confusing the tool with the platform.

>> How are they to know which bit of the scattergun approach is the
>>right one to use? Or whether "posting everywhere" has some hidden
>>disadvantage.
>
>You can configure it and use it however YOU want.

Again, that's about the platform called posterous. How can I explain to
the School Board that posterous has enough credibility to be used. I
don't think it has. All they ever hear about other Web2.0 like Facebook
and Bebo is how dangerous they are for kids. But I'm beginning to think
that finally maybe Twitter has the right profile for this application.
--
Roland Perry

chaz at chaz6

Jul 4, 2009, 8:22 AM

Post #13 of 60 (1265 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

On 04/07/09 17:07, Roland Perry wrote:
> That's the kind of "marketing-led" response I was hoping to hear.
>
> But the UK National Rail system now uses Tweets to tell customers about
> disruptions on the trains, and several major UK government departments
> and news organisations use it for announcements and "Breaking News".
>
> So has it become "respectable" yet?

When there are open-source equivalents available (e.g. Laconica,
OpenMicroBlogger - both of which incidentally are compatible since they
are based upon the OMB spec), I do wonder why a commercial or government
entity would use a closed-source, non-domestic service.

m.hallgren at free

Jul 4, 2009, 8:26 AM

Post #14 of 60 (1265 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification (was: Fire, Power loss at Fisher Plaza in Seattle) [In reply to]

Le samedi 04 juillet 2009 à 16:58 +0200, Michael Hallgren a écrit :
> Le samedi 04 juillet 2009 à 10:47 -0400, Jeffrey Lyon a écrit :
> > Personally, I find it difficult to take Twitter seriously. It seems
> > like more of a kids toy than a business tool. Something like a
> > blogspot account would make a lot more sense.
>
> Yes.
>
> What about (continue to) use old email (inc lists), coupled with
> some roughly out-of-band like cell/pots/sms service? And in parallel
> old irc, et al.
>
> Any severe problem with, asking us to move over to "portal
> services"?

Of course not negative with respect to new innovative means... But if
we didn't have pidgin: msn, yahoo!, gtalk, icq, facebook,... ...
would be hard to manage... and remember who's message to track via
what channel...

So, the channel I think is much dependent on the audience. The crowd
small enough, most any means will be fine. The crowd more universal,
well-known, stable communication protocols should be a natural
choice. No?

mh

>
> mh
> >
> > Jeff
> >
> >
> >
> > On 7/4/09, Marshall Eubanks <tme[at]americafree.tv> wrote:
> > >
> > > On Jul 4, 2009, at 6:17 AM, Roland Perry wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > > In article
> > > <786BA8C0-B534-40FF-9126-1E33BD11CB3C[at]americafree.tv>,
> > > Marshall Eubanks <tme[at]americafree.tv> writes
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > That's a great idea, use some lame Web 2.0 trend to communicate with
> > > > > > actual real life customers. </sarcasm>
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > I would assume they figured it was better than just remaining silent.
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > I'm about to recommend to an organisation that it [a twitter account] is
> > > better than posting news of an outage on their low-volume website, which
> > > will get swamped when too many people poll it for news.
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > What if the outage takes out their website too ?
> > >
> > > I don't think that their website was up, and I would guess that they didn't
> > > have email either. That
> > > is a bad situation to be in.
> > >
> > > Note, BTW, that twitter itself is subject to frequent planned and unplanned
> > > outages.
> > >
> > > Marshall
> > >
> > >
> > > > What does the team think?
> > > >
> > > > Paying a lot more to host the website with higher "burst" capacity during
> > > an emergency, isn't an option.
> > > >
> > > > The only other idea I've had is to sign all the customers up to receive an
> > > SMS via some sort of broadcast service (the news will fit easily in one
> > > SMS).
> > > > --
> > > > Roland Perry
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > Regards
> > > Marshall Eubanks
> > > CEO / AmericaFree.TV
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
--
michael hallgren, mh2198-ripe

mike at delusion

Jul 4, 2009, 8:33 AM

Post #15 of 60 (1266 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

Roland Perry wrote:
> In article
> <16720fe00907040747k67ca1206kb871420deb5e8163[at]mail.gmail.com>, Jeffrey
> Lyon <jeffrey.lyon[at]blacklotus.net> writes
>> Personally, I find it difficult to take Twitter seriously. It seems
>> like more of a kids toy than a business tool. Something like a
>> blogspot account would make a lot more sense.
>
> That's the kind of "marketing-led" response I was hoping to hear.
>
> But the UK National Rail system now uses Tweets to tell customers
> about disruptions on the trains, and several major UK government
> departments and news organisations use it for announcements and
> "Breaking News".
>
> So has it become "respectable" yet?
there are plenty of examples where twitter is being used for useful
notifications. in the sf bay area, there's a user maintained version of
what you describe for our commuter rail. a large example of this is
comcast's customer service (see http://twitter.com/comcastcares)
personally, i like the twitter idea. i can follow/unfollow at will, i
can set up sms alerts for specific "users" i follow, etc. sure, twitter
had some stability issues, but i think if we're being fair, they've been
very stable of late. sure, twitter might be down at the same time, but
it seems more likely that the website for the provider in question would
be affected and twitter can be updated very quickly using a cell phone
either with a twitter app or simply via sms.

just my $0.02 worth (perhaps $0.03 and perhaps not worth over $0.01)

+m

lists at internetpolicyagency

Jul 4, 2009, 8:37 AM

Post #16 of 60 (1265 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

In article <h2ns2s$kcv$1[at]ger.gmane.org>, Chris Hills <chaz[at]chaz6.com>
writes
>> That's the kind of "marketing-led" response I was hoping to hear.
>>
>> But the UK National Rail system now uses Tweets to tell customers about
>> disruptions on the trains, and several major UK government departments
>> and news organisations use it for announcements and "Breaking News".
>>
>> So has it become "respectable" yet?
>
>When there are open-source equivalents available (e.g. Laconica,
>OpenMicroBlogger - both of which incidentally are compatible since they
>are based upon the OMB spec), I do wonder why a commercial or
>government entity would use a closed-source, non-domestic service.

That's fair comment, but how do you get your customers to install quirky
niche solutions to what's a once-a-year problem?

They all seem pretty happy using a multitude of other "non-domestic"
solutions, which probably accounts for 99% of the stuff they have on
their PCs.

So "not sufficiently mature" we can get away with as an excuse, but
"Made in America" isn't going to put many people off :)
--
Roland Perry

frnkblk at iname

Jul 4, 2009, 1:59 PM

Post #17 of 60 (1247 views)
Permalink

RE: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

When the local power companies uses twitter, then maybe I'll consider using
twitter for our customers.

There's the temptation by some of companies to leverage the latest
technology to appear "cool" and "in tune" with customers, but by far and
large, when something goes down customers either do no nothing, wait, or
call in. I think the best use of everyone's time is to make sure their call
center/support desk has the capability to post an announcement to those that
call in. And then make sure something gets posted to the website. SMS,
Facebook, and Twitter fall in line after all that.

Frank

-----Original Message-----
From: Roland Perry [mailto:lists[at]internetpolicyagency.com]
Sent: Saturday, July 04, 2009 10:38 AM
To: nanog[at]merit.edu
Subject: Re: Using twitter as an outage notification

In article <h2ns2s$kcv$1[at]ger.gmane.org>, Chris Hills <chaz[at]chaz6.com>
writes
>> That's the kind of "marketing-led" response I was hoping to hear.
>>
>> But the UK National Rail system now uses Tweets to tell customers about
>> disruptions on the trains, and several major UK government departments
>> and news organisations use it for announcements and "Breaking News".
>>
>> So has it become "respectable" yet?
>
>When there are open-source equivalents available (e.g. Laconica,
>OpenMicroBlogger - both of which incidentally are compatible since they
>are based upon the OMB spec), I do wonder why a commercial or
>government entity would use a closed-source, non-domestic service.

That's fair comment, but how do you get your customers to install quirky
niche solutions to what's a once-a-year problem?

They all seem pretty happy using a multitude of other "non-domestic"
solutions, which probably accounts for 99% of the stuff they have on
their PCs.

So "not sufficiently mature" we can get away with as an excuse, but
"Made in America" isn't going to put many people off :)
--
Roland Perry

marc at let

Jul 4, 2009, 2:07 PM

Post #18 of 60 (1247 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

Am 04.07.2009 um 22:59 schrieb Frank Bulk:

> When the local power companies uses twitter, then maybe I'll
> consider using
> twitter for our customers.

well it seems popular

http://www.dell.com/twitter

dell made some money with it too

http://en.community.dell.com/blogs/direct2dell/archive/2009/06/11/delloutlet-surpasses-2-million-on-twitter.aspx

:-))

>
> There's the temptation by some of companies to leverage the latest
> technology to appear "cool" and "in tune" with customers, but by far
> and
> large, when something goes down customers either do no nothing,
> wait, or
> call in. I think the best use of everyone's time is to make sure
> their call
> center/support desk has the capability to post an announcement to
> those that
> call in. And then make sure something gets posted to the website.
> SMS,
> Facebook, and Twitter fall in line after all that.
>
> Frank
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Roland Perry [mailto:lists[at]internetpolicyagency.com]
> Sent: Saturday, July 04, 2009 10:38 AM
> To: nanog[at]merit.edu
> Subject: Re: Using twitter as an outage notification
>
> In article <h2ns2s$kcv$1[at]ger.gmane.org>, Chris Hills <chaz[at]chaz6.com>
> writes
>>> That's the kind of "marketing-led" response I was hoping to hear.
>>>
>>> But the UK National Rail system now uses Tweets to tell customers
>>> about
>>> disruptions on the trains, and several major UK government
>>> departments
>>> and news organisations use it for announcements and "Breaking News".
>>>
>>> So has it become "respectable" yet?
>>
>> When there are open-source equivalents available (e.g. Laconica,
>> OpenMicroBlogger - both of which incidentally are compatible since
>> they
>> are based upon the OMB spec), I do wonder why a commercial or
>> government entity would use a closed-source, non-domestic service.
>
> That's fair comment, but how do you get your customers to install
> quirky
> niche solutions to what's a once-a-year problem?
>
> They all seem pretty happy using a multitude of other "non-domestic"
> solutions, which probably accounts for 99% of the stuff they have on
> their PCs.
>
> So "not sufficiently mature" we can get away with as an excuse, but
> "Made in America" isn't going to put many people off :)
> --
> Roland Perry
>
>
>

--
Les enfants teribbles - research / deployment
Marc Manthey
Vogelsangerstrasse 97
D - 50823 K�ln - Germany
Vogelsangerstrasse 97
Geo: 50.945554, 6.920293
PGP/GnuPG: 0x1ac02f3296b12b4d
Tel.:0049-221-29891489
Mobil:0049-1577-3329231
web : http://www.let.de

Opinions expressed may not even be mine by the time you read them, and
certainly don't reflect those of any other entity (legal or otherwise).

Please note that according to the German law on data retention,
information on every electronic information exchange with me is
retained for a period of six months.

sethm at rollernet

Jul 4, 2009, 2:09 PM

Post #19 of 60 (1246 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

Frank Bulk wrote:
> When the local power companies uses twitter, then maybe I'll consider using
> twitter for our customers.
>
> There's the temptation by some of companies to leverage the latest
> technology to appear "cool" and "in tune" with customers, but by far and
> large, when something goes down customers either do no nothing, wait, or
> call in. I think the best use of everyone's time is to make sure their call
> center/support desk has the capability to post an announcement to those that
> call in. And then make sure something gets posted to the website. SMS,
> Facebook, and Twitter fall in line after all that.
>

A plain-text status website and recorded message before the phone tree
scale quite well in the event of a major problem.

But yeah, Twitter will attract the "what's cool right now" demographic.

~Seth

n6mod at milewski

Jul 4, 2009, 2:10 PM

Post #20 of 60 (1246 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

On 7/4/09 7:50 AM, Roland Perry wrote:

> What I'm trying to anticipate is the objection to *also* posting to
> Twitter, which might be raised on the grounds that it's too
> "unofficial", or "unsupported" or something like that.

Anecdotal, of course, but I found twitter to be very useful during the
SF Bay Area fiber cuts a few months back. I was able to fairly quickly
get reports of who was down (UnitedLayer) and who wasn't (everyone
else), and made some good contacts, some of whom I've done business with
since (Cernio).

Set up a twitter account for outage/event notifications, and don't
*ever* use it for marketing.

mem at mv

Jul 4, 2009, 2:12 PM

Post #21 of 60 (1248 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

On Sat, Jul 04, 2009 at 03:59:48PM -0500, Frank Bulk wrote:
> When the local power companies uses twitter, then maybe I'll consider using
> twitter for our customers.

During the ice storm we had here last winter, the local power
company did just that. "psnh" "ice storm" "twitter" etc are all
good search terms.

I haven't been following this thread closely, so I dunno if that had
already been mentioned and your remark was a sardonic one. Nevertheless..

-mm- (probably due for an annual nanog posting)

wbailey at gci

Jul 4, 2009, 2:16 PM

Post #22 of 60 (1246 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

Why aren't you all out getting drunk like me?? ;)

----- Original Message -----
From: Mark E. Mallett <mem[at]mv.mv.com>
To: Frank Bulk <frnkblk[at]iname.com>
Cc: nanog[at]merit.edu <nanog[at]merit.edu>
Sent: Sat Jul 04 13:12:14 2009
Subject: Re: Using twitter as an outage notification

On Sat, Jul 04, 2009 at 03:59:48PM -0500, Frank Bulk wrote:
> When the local power companies uses twitter, then maybe I'll consider using
> twitter for our customers.

During the ice storm we had here last winter, the local power
company did just that. "psnh" "ice storm" "twitter" etc are all
good search terms.

I haven't been following this thread closely, so I dunno if that had
already been mentioned and your remark was a sardonic one. Nevertheless..

-mm- (probably due for an annual nanog posting)

jcdill.lists at gmail

Jul 4, 2009, 3:19 PM

Post #23 of 60 (1241 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

Roland Perry wrote:
> In article <4A4F6EF5.9030502[at]gmail.com>, JC Dill
> <jcdill.lists[at]gmail.com> writes
>
>>> What I'm trying to anticipate is the objection to *also* posting to
>>> Twitter, which might be raised on the grounds that it's too
>>> "unofficial", or "unsupported" or something like that.
>
>> Anyone who makes that argument is just showing how little they know
>> about Twitter.
>
> So that's 98% of the population then...

We aren't talking about the general population. IMHO anyone in Network
Operations or NOC management who doesn't know about emerging and cutting
edge communications is in the wrong job or the wrong industry.
>
>> It would be like complaining you shouldn't use email because "not
>> everyone has email".
>
> But email has become respectable, although I still see "people who
> know better" starting speeches with 'of course, ten years ago none of
> us used email, but now....' which shows they are very late adopters
> themselves.
How many of them are running Internet Networks?

>>>
>>> It's this richness which confuses the ordinary person.
>
>> That's a lot like saying Perl is too complicated for the ordinary
>> person so never use Perl. :-)
>
> You are confusing the tool with the platform.
Twitter is a tool just like Perl. You can reach twitter from any
browser, and most mobile phones.

>
>>> How are they to know which bit of the scattergun approach is the
>>> right one to use? Or whether "posting everywhere" has some hidden
>>> disadvantage.
>>
>> You can configure it and use it however YOU want.
>
> Again, that's about the platform called posterous. How can I explain
> to the School Board that posterous has enough credibility to be used.

You explain that it's a tool. You configure it and then you give a
demonstration. Send a post, then show them how users who keep up with
local news will find the info depending on what channels they use most
often to get important info.

Even easier, you make an email address on your system that is an alias
to posterous. So they send to "post[at]schoolsystem.edu" which .forwards
out to posterous, which posts to the school blog, myspace, facebook,
twitter, and any other system you configure. Show them how a radio
station can retweet the info and then announce "to get info on school
closings, follow us on twitter at...." and everyone can send the info TO
the radio station and get the info FROM the radio station quickly and
easily.

> I don't think it has. All they ever hear about other Web2.0 like
> Facebook and Bebo is how dangerous they are for kids.

Sheesh. Cars and bikes are far more dangerous for kids than Facebook
and Bebo. That's why kids are taught the rules of the road, to always
wear bike helmets, to always buckle up in the car, and they get driver
training.

> But I'm beginning to think that finally maybe Twitter has the right
> profile for this application.

Again, why limit yourself? Use all the tools available.

jc

netfortius at gmail

Jul 4, 2009, 4:34 PM

Post #24 of 60 (1230 views)
Permalink

Re: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

For DR issues (among many others, of course) think of Twitter as a paging
system of global proportions: not a lot to be said, but if you get the
message right its broadcast and amplification capabilities are unmatched.

--
***Stefan
http://twitter.com/netfortius

On Sat, Jul 4, 2009 at 5:19 PM, JC Dill <jcdill.lists[at]gmail.com> wrote:

> Roland Perry wrote:
>
>> In article <4A4F6EF5.9030502[at]gmail.com>, JC Dill <jcdill.lists[at]gmail.com>
>> writes
>>
>> What I'm trying to anticipate is the objection to *also* posting to
>>>> Twitter, which might be raised on the grounds that it's too "unofficial", or
>>>> "unsupported" or something like that.
>>>>
>>>
>> Anyone who makes that argument is just showing how little they know about
>>> Twitter.
>>>
>>
>> So that's 98% of the population then...
>>
>
> We aren't talking about the general population. IMHO anyone in Network
> Operations or NOC management who doesn't know about emerging and cutting
> edge communications is in the wrong job or the wrong industry.
>
>>
>> It would be like complaining you shouldn't use email because "not
>>> everyone has email".
>>>
>>
>> But email has become respectable, although I still see "people who know
>> better" starting speeches with 'of course, ten years ago none of us used
>> email, but now....' which shows they are very late adopters themselves.
>>
> How many of them are running Internet Networks?
>
>
>>>> It's this richness which confuses the ordinary person.
>>>>
>>>
>> That's a lot like saying Perl is too complicated for the ordinary person
>>> so never use Perl. :-)
>>>
>>
>> You are confusing the tool with the platform.
>>
> Twitter is a tool just like Perl. You can reach twitter from any browser,
> and most mobile phones.
>
>
>> How are they to know which bit of the scattergun approach is the right
>>>> one to use? Or whether "posting everywhere" has some hidden disadvantage.
>>>>
>>>
>>> You can configure it and use it however YOU want.
>>>
>>
>> Again, that's about the platform called posterous. How can I explain to
>> the School Board that posterous has enough credibility to be used.
>>
>
> You explain that it's a tool. You configure it and then you give a
> demonstration. Send a post, then show them how users who keep up with local
> news will find the info depending on what channels they use most often to
> get important info.
>
> Even easier, you make an email address on your system that is an alias to
> posterous. So they send to "post[at]schoolsystem.edu" which .forwards out
> to posterous, which posts to the school blog, myspace, facebook, twitter,
> and any other system you configure. Show them how a radio station can
> retweet the info and then announce "to get info on school closings, follow
> us on twitter at...." and everyone can send the info TO the radio station
> and get the info FROM the radio station quickly and easily.
>
>
> I don't think it has. All they ever hear about other Web2.0 like Facebook
>> and Bebo is how dangerous they are for kids.
>>
>
> Sheesh. Cars and bikes are far more dangerous for kids than Facebook and
> Bebo. That's why kids are taught the rules of the road, to always wear bike
> helmets, to always buckle up in the car, and they get driver training.
>
> But I'm beginning to think that finally maybe Twitter has the right
>> profile for this application.
>>
>
> Again, why limit yourself? Use all the tools available.
>
> jc
>
>

frnkblk at iname

Jul 4, 2009, 4:51 PM

Post #25 of 60 (1229 views)
Permalink

RE: Using twitter as an outage notification [In reply to]

So does twitter address the mass public, or those who are Web 2.0 literate
or techies? I'm glad to see that Dell reached two million people, but how
many more people call in or visit its web page every day?

My point in another fork of this thread is that for most people, the
traditional forms of communication are *it*. I'm not saying that twitter
hasn't been used and found a way to reach the some portion of the population
-- the traditional methods (announcement at top of phone tree & note on
homepage) should be maintained and as one more additional way to
communication. I think you mentioned that yourself a few posts ago. =)

Frank

-----Original Message-----
From: JC Dill [mailto:jcdill.lists[at]gmail.com]
Sent: Saturday, July 04, 2009 5:20 PM
Cc: nanog[at]merit.edu
Subject: Re: Using twitter as an outage notification

Roland Perry wrote:
> In article <4A4F6EF5.9030502[at]gmail.com>, JC Dill
> <jcdill.lists[at]gmail.com> writes
>
>>> What I'm trying to anticipate is the objection to *also* posting to
>>> Twitter, which might be raised on the grounds that it's too
>>> "unofficial", or "unsupported" or something like that.
>
>> Anyone who makes that argument is just showing how little they know
>> about Twitter.
>
> So that's 98% of the population then...

We aren't talking about the general population. IMHO anyone in Network
Operations or NOC management who doesn't know about emerging and cutting
edge communications is in the wrong job or the wrong industry.
>
>> It would be like complaining you shouldn't use email because "not
>> everyone has email".
>
> But email has become respectable, although I still see "people who
> know better" starting speeches with 'of course, ten years ago none of
> us used email, but now....' which shows they are very late adopters
> themselves.
How many of them are running Internet Networks?

>>>
>>> It's this richness which confuses the ordinary person.
>
>> That's a lot like saying Perl is too complicated for the ordinary
>> person so never use Perl. :-)
>
> You are confusing the tool with the platform.
Twitter is a tool just like Perl. You can reach twitter from any
browser, and most mobile phones.

>
>>> How are they to know which bit of the scattergun approach is the
>>> right one to use? Or whether "posting everywhere" has some hidden
>>> disadvantage.
>>
>> You can configure it and use it however YOU want.
>
> Again, that's about the platform called posterous. How can I explain
> to the School Board that posterous has enough credibility to be used.

You explain that it's a tool. You configure it and then you give a
demonstration. Send a post, then show them how users who keep up with
local news will find the info depending on what channels they use most
often to get important info.

Even easier, you make an email address on your system that is an alias
to posterous. So they send to "post[at]schoolsystem.edu" which .forwards
out to posterous, which posts to the school blog, myspace, facebook,
twitter, and any other system you configure. Show them how a radio
station can retweet the info and then announce "to get info on school
closings, follow us on twitter at...." and everyone can send the info TO
the radio station and get the info FROM the radio station quickly and
easily.

> I don't think it has. All they ever hear about other Web2.0 like
> Facebook and Bebo is how dangerous they are for kids.

Sheesh. Cars and bikes are far more dangerous for kids than Facebook
and Bebo. That's why kids are taught the rules of the road, to always
wear bike helmets, to always buckle up in the car, and they get driver
training.

> But I'm beginning to think that finally maybe Twitter has the right
> profile for this application.

Again, why limit yourself? Use all the tools available.

jc

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