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Level 3 (was: "legacy" Wiltel/Looking Glass bandwidth)

 

 

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deepak at ai

Jul 2, 2009, 11:50 AM

Post #1 of 5 (569 views)
Permalink
Level 3 (was: "legacy" Wiltel/Looking Glass bandwidth)

Without continuing the L3 pile-on, one can easily glean from their public filings that they have never properly filled out their management depth in acquisition absorption and/or sufficiently empowered those folks. The billions in revenue lost from acquisitions like Genuity and others have told this story more than once.

L3 is not alone in this. Worldcomm's failure to integrate acquisitions led to a much larger operational cash need than VZ has shown for the same assets (verio, lots of other names here). This is because VZ understands how traditional businesses acquire others, better, in my opinion.

Unfortunately, L3 has shown little interest in making the "real world, tough business" cuts in heads and absorbing the real (internal) pain of acquisitions and seems to have a pretty laissez-faire attitude towards its customers, even at its senior management levels (Cxx). I think this will be (and has been) the biggest problem for them. Even a possible merger/JV with Sprint may not be sufficient to solve that. Their resolution of billing disputes is much more typical of WCOM than VZ.

They are a big fish in lots, and lots, of markets. They enjoy being able to dictate pricing in them. IMO, however, they don't have the maturity of (say, AT&T or others) to take that big fish status and leave you still happy with the service. (colloquially: if [good companies] are going to take advantage, at least they don't make it more painful than necessary).

Operationally, where you have options (because of pricing, locality, etc) it's long-term good to support competitors, diversity in connectivity, etc. History has shown time and time again that when an industry consolidates a lot of business with a certain vendor, bad things can and do occur.

Deepak Jain
AiNET


sronan at fattoc

Jul 2, 2009, 12:20 PM

Post #2 of 5 (523 views)
Permalink
Re: Level 3 (was: "legacy" Wiltel/Looking Glass bandwidth) [In reply to]

I could not agree with the points below more.

Prior to the mergers, I had multiple services each with Looking Glass,
Wiltel and Broadwing and Level3. After Level3's round of acquisitions
the service level for all four of them went way down.

I've had the experience of not being able to resolve issues with
Wiltel circuits because there was no techs available who could access
the gear, been told they no longer wished to provide me with a Type 2
service sold to me by Looking Glass or Broadwing, and had billing and
implementation issues that have lasted almost two years with Level3,
because they started moving services from one billing system to another.

Given that Level3's prices are usually not even close to competitive
with solutions provided by other providers, I would suggest that
people look elsewhere for reliable, reasonably priced services.

Shane

On Jul 2, 2009, at 2:50 PM, Deepak Jain wrote:

>
> Without continuing the L3 pile-on, one can easily glean from their
> public filings that they have never properly filled out their
> management depth in acquisition absorption and/or sufficiently
> empowered those folks. The billions in revenue lost from
> acquisitions like Genuity and others have told this story more than
> once.
>
> L3 is not alone in this. Worldcomm's failure to integrate
> acquisitions led to a much larger operational cash need than VZ has
> shown for the same assets (verio, lots of other names here). This is
> because VZ understands how traditional businesses acquire others,
> better, in my opinion.
>
> Unfortunately, L3 has shown little interest in making the "real
> world, tough business" cuts in heads and absorbing the real
> (internal) pain of acquisitions and seems to have a pretty laissez-
> faire attitude towards its customers, even at its senior management
> levels (Cxx). I think this will be (and has been) the biggest
> problem for them. Even a possible merger/JV with Sprint may not be
> sufficient to solve that. Their resolution of billing disputes is
> much more typical of WCOM than VZ.
>
> They are a big fish in lots, and lots, of markets. They enjoy being
> able to dictate pricing in them. IMO, however, they don't have the
> maturity of (say, AT&T or others) to take that big fish status and
> leave you still happy with the service. (colloquially: if [good
> companies] are going to take advantage, at least they don't make it
> more painful than necessary).
>
> Operationally, where you have options (because of pricing, locality,
> etc) it's long-term good to support competitors, diversity in
> connectivity, etc. History has shown time and time again that when
> an industry consolidates a lot of business with a certain vendor,
> bad things can and do occur.
>
> Deepak Jain
> AiNET
>
>
>


adam.lafountain at googlemail

Jul 2, 2009, 3:48 PM

Post #3 of 5 (521 views)
Permalink
Re: Level 3 (was: "legacy" Wiltel/Looking Glass bandwidth) [In reply to]

>
>
>> Without continuing the L3 pile-on, one can easily glean from their public
>> filings that they have never properly filled out their management depth in
>> acquisition absorption and/or sufficiently empowered those folks. The
>> billions in revenue lost from acquisitions like Genuity and others have told
>> this story more than once.
>>
>> L3 is not alone in this. Worldcomm's failure to integrate acquisitions led
>> to a much larger operational cash need than VZ has shown for the same assets
>> (verio, lots of other names here). This is because VZ understands how
>> traditional businesses acquire others, better, in my opinion.
>>
>> Unfortunately, L3 has shown little interest in making the "real world,
>> tough business" cuts in heads and absorbing the real (internal) pain of
>> acquisitions and seems to have a pretty laissez-faire attitude towards its
>> customers, even at its senior management levels (Cxx). I think this will be
>> (and has been) the biggest problem for them. Even a possible merger/JV with
>> Sprint may not be sufficient to solve that. Their resolution of billing
>> disputes is much more typical of WCOM than VZ.
>>
>> They are a big fish in lots, and lots, of markets. They enjoy being able
>> to dictate pricing in them. IMO, however, they don't have the maturity of
>> (say, AT&T or others) to take that big fish status and leave you still happy
>> with the service. (colloquially: if [good companies] are going to take
>> advantage, at least they don't make it more painful than necessary).
>>
>> Operationally, where you have options (because of pricing, locality, etc)
>> it's long-term good to support competitors, diversity in connectivity, etc.
>> History has shown time and time again that when an industry consolidates a
>> lot of business with a certain vendor, bad things can and do occur.
>>
>> Deepak Jain
>> AiNET
>>
>
Not to mention they have also been the subject of several class action suits
for this very reason regarding the integration of acquired assets, or lack
thereof:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/The-Shuman-Law-Firm-Announces-pz-14325037.html?x=1
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/The-Pomerantz-Firm-Charges-pz-14430251.html?x=1
http://biz.yahoo.com/iw/090330/0486160.html


Adam LaFountain


jml at packetpimp

Jul 8, 2009, 6:30 AM

Post #4 of 5 (440 views)
Permalink
Re: Level 3 [In reply to]

To boot almost all the original Telcove crew we had are gone. They're
losing the better people through attrition as they're frustrated at not
being able to help their customers. I also have a feeling Level3 makes
changes during business hours that are not announced. I have no proof
but I have a feeling due to some odd changes in routing I see every now
and then.

Shane Ronan wrote:
> I could not agree with the points below more.
>
> Prior to the mergers, I had multiple services each with Looking Glass,
> Wiltel and Broadwing and Level3. After Level3's round of acquisitions
> the service level for all four of them went way down.
>
> I've had the experience of not being able to resolve issues with
> Wiltel circuits because there was no techs available who could access
> the gear, been told they no longer wished to provide me with a Type 2
> service sold to me by Looking Glass or Broadwing, and had billing and
> implementation issues that have lasted almost two years with Level3,
> because they started moving services from one billing system to another.
>
> Given that Level3's prices are usually not even close to competitive
> with solutions provided by other providers, I would suggest that
> people look elsewhere for reliable, reasonably priced services.
>
> Shane
>
> On Jul 2, 2009, at 2:50 PM, Deepak Jain wrote:
>
>>
>> Without continuing the L3 pile-on, one can easily glean from their
>> public filings that they have never properly filled out their
>> management depth in acquisition absorption and/or sufficiently
>> empowered those folks. The billions in revenue lost from acquisitions
>> like Genuity and others have told this story more than once.
>>
>> L3 is not alone in this. Worldcomm's failure to integrate
>> acquisitions led to a much larger operational cash need than VZ has
>> shown for the same assets (verio, lots of other names here). This is
>> because VZ understands how traditional businesses acquire others,
>> better, in my opinion.
>>
>> Unfortunately, L3 has shown little interest in making the "real
>> world, tough business" cuts in heads and absorbing the real
>> (internal) pain of acquisitions and seems to have a pretty
>> laissez-faire attitude towards its customers, even at its senior
>> management levels (Cxx). I think this will be (and has been) the
>> biggest problem for them. Even a possible merger/JV with Sprint may
>> not be sufficient to solve that. Their resolution of billing disputes
>> is much more typical of WCOM than VZ.
>>
>> They are a big fish in lots, and lots, of markets. They enjoy being
>> able to dictate pricing in them. IMO, however, they don't have the
>> maturity of (say, AT&T or others) to take that big fish status and
>> leave you still happy with the service. (colloquially: if [good
>> companies] are going to take advantage, at least they don't make it
>> more painful than necessary).
>>
>> Operationally, where you have options (because of pricing, locality,
>> etc) it's long-term good to support competitors, diversity in
>> connectivity, etc. History has shown time and time again that when an
>> industry consolidates a lot of business with a certain vendor, bad
>> things can and do occur.
>>
>> Deepak Jain
>> AiNET
>>
>>
>>
>
>


charles at thewybles

Jul 8, 2009, 9:55 AM

Post #5 of 5 (441 views)
Permalink
Re: Level 3 [In reply to]

So..... where is all this talent going? NTT? AT&T? Verizon? Dare I say
it.... cogent? :)

Also has anyone filed complaints with the FTC or DOJ?


Jason LeBlanc wrote:
> To boot almost all the original Telcove crew we had are gone. They're
> losing the better people through attrition as they're frustrated at not
> being able to help their customers. I also have a feeling Level3 makes
> changes during business hours that are not announced. I have no proof
> but I have a feeling due to some odd changes in routing I see every now
> and then.
>

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