Mailing List Archive: MythTV: Users

New wunderground weather scripts for 0.26

Index | Next | Previous | View Threaded

gjhurlbu at gmail

Jul 14, 2012, 12:06 AM

Post #1 of 14 (972 views)
Permalink

New wunderground weather scripts for 0.26

Wunderground has obsoleted the API we were previously using for
weather maps and for forecasts. They have replaced it with a much
sleeker REST API, but however, this came at a "cost". It now requires
the use of API keys.

NOTE: All users who wish to use the wunderground weather source in
0.26 and beyond **MUST** sign up for an API key, which should be put
into either
$HOME/.mythtv/MythWeather/wunderground.key
or
$MYTHCONFDIR/MythWeather/wunderground.key

One can sign up for an API key at:
http://www.wunderground.com/weather/api/

You will need your key to be at the
"Cumulus Developer" level for static maps or weather forecasts and
"Anvil Developer" level for animated maps.

Since this has required coding and theme changes (adding the logo),
this will not likely ever be backported to 0.25 or earlier.
_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users [at] mythtv
http://www.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

joe at thefrys

Jul 14, 2012, 8:27 PM

Post #2 of 14 (918 views)
Permalink

Re: New wunderground weather scripts for 0.26 [In reply to]

>
> Wunderground has obsoleted the API we were previously using for
> weather maps and for forecasts. They have replaced it with a much
> sleeker REST API, but however, this came at a "cost". It now requires
> the use of API keys.
>
> NOTE: All users who wish to use the wunderground weather source in
> 0.26 and beyond **MUST** sign up for an API key, which should be put
> into either
> $HOME/.mythtv/MythWeather/wunderground.key
> or
> $MYTHCONFDIR/MythWeather/wunderground.key
>
> One can sign up for an API key at:
> http://www.wunderground.com/weather/api/
>
> You will need your key to be at the
> "Cumulus Developer" level for static maps or weather forecasts and
> "Anvil Developer" level for animated maps.
>
> Since this has required coding and theme changes (adding the logo),
> this will not likely ever be backported to 0.25 or earlier.
>

Aren't developer API's typically required for application developers,
rather than users? Why can't the Mythtv developers register for an API key
thats good for all users? Does it somehow tie the key to the IP or URL of
the server? If so that will kill it for use for those with dynamic IP's.

gary.buhrmaster at gmail

Jul 14, 2012, 8:45 PM

Post #3 of 14 (917 views)
Permalink

Re: New wunderground weather scripts for 0.26 [In reply to]

On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 8:27 PM, Joseph Fry <joe [at] thefrys> wrote:
.
> Aren't developer API's typically required for application developers, rather
> than users?

For "product" use, yes.

> Why can't the Mythtv developers register for an API key thats
> good for all users?

Any one key (that is "free") is limited for small number of requests
per interval.

Now, for a corporate project, you can pay for (mostly) unlimited
usage, but there is no "open source exception". So (for example)
a microsoft (or google) could pay a modest fee for all users (just
like Microsoft pays for schedules information for all windows
media center users).

I do not believe any of the developers have those deep pockets.

So, each user has to get their own API key.

Ideal? No. Realistic? Yes.

Gary
_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users [at] mythtv
http://www.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

knight at teksavvy

Jul 14, 2012, 10:18 PM

Post #4 of 14 (912 views)
Permalink

Re: New wunderground weather scripts for 0.26 [In reply to]

Hi,

On 7/14/2012 11:27 PM, Joseph Fry wrote:
> Why can't the Mythtv developers register for an API key thats good for all users?

That is done whenever possible but as Gary pointed out, it wasn't in
this case (no open source exception...).

It was, for example, done for the Met Office weather grabber that was
committed today...

The first thing (and I mean it) Gavin (beirdo) did when he saw that the
new API required a key was check if one could be obtained for all MythTV
users. How do I know? I was talking with him on IRC at the time because
we had been discussing the problems (incorrect data) the old grabber had
(because it was using the old deprecated (and soon to be removed) API).

The solution was either to ask all users to get their own key or no
longer be able to get weather data from wundeground...

Have a nice day,

Nick
_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users [at] mythtv
http://www.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

gjhurlbu at gmail

Jul 14, 2012, 10:56 PM

Post #5 of 14 (908 views)
Permalink

Re: New wunderground weather scripts for 0.26 [In reply to]

If you'd like to pay the $300/month for such a key, and can think out a
good way to make sure no one steals the key for their own app on our dime,
I'm all ears. This is the way they said to use it best for an open source
application. As long as you stay under their limits, as this is a
non-commercial application, this is how it is done legitimately with their
API.

The keys are not tied to IP, which you'd know if you had bothered to click
on the url before asking.

I understand that this is not ideal, but it was a choice of this or just
deleting the wunderground scripts entirely. I figured this was the better
option. This is especially the case if we want to extend mythweather later
to include hurricane information, for instance.
On Jul 14, 2012 8:27 PM, "Joseph Fry" <joe [at] thefrys> wrote:

> Wunderground has obsoleted the API we were previously using for
>> weather maps and for forecasts. They have replaced it with a much
>> sleeker REST API, but however, this came at a "cost". It now requires
>> the use of API keys.
>>
>> NOTE: All users who wish to use the wunderground weather source in
>> 0.26 and beyond **MUST** sign up for an API key, which should be put
>> into either
>> $HOME/.mythtv/MythWeather/wunderground.key
>> or
>> $MYTHCONFDIR/MythWeather/wunderground.key
>>
>> One can sign up for an API key at:
>> http://www.wunderground.com/weather/api/
>>
>> You will need your key to be at the
>> "Cumulus Developer" level for static maps or weather forecasts and
>> "Anvil Developer" level for animated maps.
>>
>> Since this has required coding and theme changes (adding the logo),
>> this will not likely ever be backported to 0.25 or earlier.
>>
>
> Aren't developer API's typically required for application developers,
> rather than users? Why can't the Mythtv developers register for an API key
> thats good for all users? Does it somehow tie the key to the IP or URL of
> the server? If so that will kill it for use for those with dynamic IP's.
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://www.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>

gjhurlbu at gmail

Jul 14, 2012, 10:58 PM

Post #6 of 14 (907 views)
Permalink

Re: New wunderground weather scripts for 0.26 [In reply to]

Oh bother, my new phone decided to top post. I'll teach it who's boss.

joe at thefrys

Jul 14, 2012, 11:10 PM

Post #7 of 14 (907 views)
Permalink

Re: New wunderground weather scripts for 0.26 [In reply to]

>
> If you'd like to pay the $300/month for such a key, and can think out a
> good way to make sure no one steals the key for their own app on our dime,
> I'm all ears. This is the way they said to use it best for an open source
> application. As long as you stay under their limits, as this is a
> non-commercial application, this is how it is done legitimately with their
> API.
>
> The keys are not tied to IP, which you'd know if you had bothered to click
> on the url before asking.
>
> I understand that this is not ideal, but it was a choice of this or just
> deleting the wunderground scripts entirely. I figured this was the better
> option. This is especially the case if we want to extend mythweather later
> to include hurricane information, for instance.
>

I wasn't trying to be hostile or condescending... did I come across that
way? I was simply asking questions out of curiosity.

Sure I might have found answers in the terms of service, but I was making
assumptions based on the fact that the page linked says "Free" and "For
Developers" so I never opened the terms of service... even if I had, I
would have guessed you guys dug a little deeper than what was
published (for example you may have emailed the site owners to see if they
would consider an open source option).

gjhurlbu at gmail

Jul 14, 2012, 11:36 PM

Post #8 of 14 (907 views)
Permalink

Re: New wunderground weather scripts for 0.26 [In reply to]

Yeah, I contacted them on the support forum. It does say free for non-
commercial though. Anyways, not to worry.

I'm sure you can even share with your buddies if you want, but you'd end up
sharing the limits with them. The key used while developing is my own key
though, and I have no intentions to share as I don't want to be throttled
for overages. :)

joe at thefrys

Jul 14, 2012, 11:55 PM

Post #9 of 14 (914 views)
Permalink

Re: New wunderground weather scripts for 0.26 [In reply to]

>
> Yeah, I contacted them on the support forum. It does say free for non-
> commercial though. Anyways, not to worry.
>
> I'm sure you can even share with your buddies if you want, but you'd end
> up sharing the limits with them. The key used while developing is my own
> key though, and I have no intentions to share as I don't want to be
> throttled for overages. :)
>
Actually it's free for personal or commercial use... which I respect...
just a shame that they don't have an opensource/non-profit provision. But
then I guess there would be no way to prevent someone from stealing the API
key from an open source app and using it for their own commercial project.

nick.rout at gmail

Jul 15, 2012, 2:29 PM

Post #10 of 14 (880 views)
Permalink

Re: New wunderground weather scripts for 0.26 [In reply to]

On Sun, Jul 15, 2012 at 5:56 PM, Gavin Hurlbut <gjhurlbu [at] gmail> wrote:
> If you'd like to pay the $300/month for such a key, and can think out a good
> way to make sure no one steals the key for their own app on our dime, I'm
> all ears. This is the way they said to use it best for an open source
> application. As long as you stay under their limits, as this is a
> non-commercial application, this is how it is done legitimately with their
> API.
>
> The keys are not tied to IP, which you'd know if you had bothered to click
> on the url before asking.
>
> I understand that this is not ideal, but it was a choice of this or just
> deleting the wunderground scripts entirely. I figured this was the better
> option. This is especially the case if we want to extend mythweather later
> to include hurricane information, for instance.

Gavin, I know XBMC now have wunderground as a "sponsor" and use them
as their weather source. I don't know if being a "sponsor" means XBMC
gave them a special api key or what, but the sponsorship doesn't seem
to amount to more than the words "weather underground" being displayed
on the weather page.

Worth exploring? Up to you! (NB the above sponsorship deal seems to
have been done before the old API was obsoleted. I just checked XBMC
and the weather works still for me).
_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users [at] mythtv
http://www.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

gary.buhrmaster at gmail

Jul 15, 2012, 2:56 PM

Post #11 of 14 (871 views)
Permalink

Re: New wunderground weather scripts for 0.26 [In reply to]

On Sun, Jul 15, 2012 at 9:29 PM, Nick Rout <nick.rout [at] gmail> wrote:
....
> Worth exploring?

Now that TWC (The Weather Channel, a NBC Universal channel) has
scooped up wunderground (Weather Underground), I suspect that it is
only time before more changes will occur in the "for profit" weather
business. For those that missed the press release:
http://www.wunderground.com/about/pr/news.asp?date=20120702

Gary
_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users [at] mythtv
http://www.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

gjhurlbu at gmail

Jul 15, 2012, 2:59 PM

Post #12 of 14 (874 views)
Permalink

Re: New wunderground weather scripts for 0.26 [In reply to]

On Sun, Jul 15, 2012 at 2:29 PM, Nick Rout <nick.rout [at] gmail> wrote:
> Gavin, I know XBMC now have wunderground as a "sponsor" and use them
> as their weather source. I don't know if being a "sponsor" means XBMC
> gave them a special api key or what, but the sponsorship doesn't seem
> to amount to more than the words "weather underground" being displayed
> on the weather page.
>
> Worth exploring? Up to you! (NB the above sponsorship deal seems to
> have been done before the old API was obsoleted. I just checked XBMC
> and the weather works still for me).

That's not an option anymore, it seems. Also, with the new API comes
a new TOS which includes having the copyright text AND the logo
present. I wouldn't be surprised if XBMC is in violation even of the
old TOS.
_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users [at] mythtv
http://www.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

gjhurlbu at gmail

Jul 15, 2012, 3:07 PM

Post #13 of 14 (875 views)
Permalink

Re: New wunderground weather scripts for 0.26 [In reply to]

On Sun, Jul 15, 2012 at 2:56 PM, Gary Buhrmaster
<gary.buhrmaster [at] gmail> wrote:
> Now that TWC (The Weather Channel, a NBC Universal channel) has
> scooped up wunderground (Weather Underground), I suspect that it is
> only time before more changes will occur in the "for profit" weather
> business. For those that missed the press release:
> http://www.wunderground.com/about/pr/news.asp?date=20120702

Yeah, the much improved API is part of that. As I said, $300/month
for Anvil Drizzle which is 5000 calls/day and 100/min. It's free for
Developer at all levels, but 500 calls/day, 10/min. This is why my
developer key will remain *my* key :) They are already working
for-profit (or at least for-cover-expenses, I guess), and
non-commercial use, personal use is allowed using developer API keys.

As mentioned earlier, it would be nearly impossible for us to keep a
commercial entity from using our API key should we ever pay for one,
as our source is publically accessible, and they can just steal the
key. If it's distributed, it's easy to scam. I really think getting
our own individual keys solves much of the distribution issues the
best way, even if it's a wee bit inconvenient.
_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users [at] mythtv
http://www.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

gary.buhrmaster at gmail

Jul 15, 2012, 3:30 PM

Post #14 of 14 (872 views)
Permalink

Re: New wunderground weather scripts for 0.26 [In reply to]

On Sun, Jul 15, 2012 at 10:07 PM, Gavin Hurlbut <gjhurlbu [at] gmail> wrote:
....
> As mentioned earlier, it would be nearly impossible for us to keep a
> commercial entity from using our API key should we ever pay for one,
> as our source is publically accessible, and they can just steal the
> key.

Or for some commercial entity to "leverage" the XBMC key (which is
in their source, base64 encoded). Not that any reputable commercial
entity would do that :-)

As the weather has taught us, things will change. So too will
the various licensing and apis change over time. NBC Universal
(and the other partners that own TWC) do have a strong history
of maximizing their ROI.

If I was a betting person (maybe I'll throw a quarter into the slot
machine when I am in Vegas in two weeks), I would bet that in
two years the licensing for weather will be different, and not in
a way to make things cheaper for the consumer.

Gary
_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users [at] mythtv
http://www.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Index | Next | Previous | View Threaded

Interested in having your list archived? Contact Gossamer Threads