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MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market

 

 

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fretinvin at gmail

Feb 23, 2012, 6:03 AM

Post #1 of 83 (3689 views)
Permalink
MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market

Hi!

I have yesterday released the first version of my hobby-project, a mythtv
frontend for Android.

It uses protocol version 56 (mythtv 0.23). It still needs some work to be
stable but basic functionality is there and if you treat it nice it works ;)

You can get more info and install it from.
https://market.android.com/details?id=se.tinelin.android

Good luck and have fun!
/Fredrik


dbadia at gmail

Feb 23, 2012, 6:16 AM

Post #2 of 83 (3648 views)
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Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

Is this project open source? I ask because I am on .24 and would like to
help bring it up to date by adding 24 and 25 support

Dave


fretinvin at gmail

Feb 23, 2012, 6:32 AM

Post #3 of 83 (3625 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On 23 February 2012 15:16, Dave Badia <dbadia [at] gmail> wrote:

> Is this project open source? I ask because I am on .24 and would like to
> help bring it up to date by adding 24 and 25 support
>

No, it is not open source. It is not unlikely though that it will be
released as open source some day, but currently it is closed...

/Fredrik


> Dave
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://www.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>


lists at glidos

Feb 23, 2012, 6:41 AM

Post #4 of 83 (3622 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On 23/02/2012 14:32, - - wrote:
> On 23 February 2012 15:16, Dave Badia <dbadia [at] gmail
> <mailto:dbadia [at] gmail>> wrote:
>
> Is this project open source? I ask because I am on .24 and would
> like to help bring it up to date by adding 24 and 25 support
>
>
> No, it is not open source. It is not unlikely though that it will be
> released as open source some day, but currently it is closed...

Is this written from scratch then, not based on the MythTV source?

Paul.
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fretinvin at gmail

Feb 23, 2012, 6:56 AM

Post #5 of 83 (3627 views)
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Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On 23 February 2012 15:41, Paul Gardiner <lists [at] glidos> wrote:

> On 23/02/2012 14:32, - - wrote:
> > On 23 February 2012 15:16, Dave Badia <dbadia [at] gmail
> > <mailto:dbadia [at] gmail>> wrote:
> >
> > Is this project open source? I ask because I am on .24 and would
> > like to help bring it up to date by adding 24 and 25 support
> >
> >
> > No, it is not open source. It is not unlikely though that it will be
> > released as open source some day, but currently it is closed...
>
> Is this written from scratch then, not based on the MythTV source?
>

Yes, written from scratch inspired by the protocol guide at:
http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Myth_Protocol/Guide

/Fredrik


>
> Paul.
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://www.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>


ron at ronfrazier

Feb 23, 2012, 8:04 AM

Post #6 of 83 (3633 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 9:03 AM, - - <fretinvin [at] gmail> wrote:
> I have yesterday released the first version of my hobby-project, a mythtv
> frontend for Android.
>
> It uses protocol version 56 (mythtv 0.23).

Which means it won't work with 0.24 or 0.25 backends, correct? If so,
you should really make this clear on your market page before you get a
bunch of 1 star ratings from people saying how much your app sucks
because it didn't work on their system.

--
Ron Frazier
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lists at glidos

Feb 23, 2012, 8:06 AM

Post #7 of 83 (3618 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On 23/02/2012 14:56, - - wrote:
> Yes, written from scratch inspired by the protocol guide at:
> http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Myth_Protocol/Guide

Impressive. I too hope it handles 0.24 one day.

P.
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fretinvin at gmail

Feb 23, 2012, 8:10 AM

Post #8 of 83 (3624 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On 23 February 2012 17:04, Ronald Frazier <ron [at] ronfrazier> wrote:

> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 9:03 AM, - - <fretinvin [at] gmail> wrote:
> > I have yesterday released the first version of my hobby-project, a mythtv
> > frontend for Android.
> >
> > It uses protocol version 56 (mythtv 0.23).
>
> Which means it won't work with 0.24 or 0.25 backends, correct? If so,
> you should really make this clear on your market page before you get a
> bunch of 1 star ratings from people saying how much your app sucks
> because it didn't work on their system.
>
>
I would like to have it supporting multiple backend versions but I don't
know how. Is there a way? The only thing I have seen regarding this is that
you should not "probe" the backend for versions... Is there a way to tell
the the backend to be backwards-compatible?



> --
> Ron Frazier
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://www.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>


lists at glidos

Feb 23, 2012, 8:17 AM

Post #9 of 83 (3642 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On 23/02/2012 16:10, - - wrote:
>
>
> On 23 February 2012 17:04, Ronald Frazier <ron [at] ronfrazier
> <mailto:ron [at] ronfrazier>> wrote:
>
> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 9:03 AM, - - <fretinvin [at] gmail
> <mailto:fretinvin [at] gmail>> wrote:
> > I have yesterday released the first version of my hobby-project,
> a mythtv
> > frontend for Android.
> >
> > It uses protocol version 56 (mythtv 0.23).
>
> Which means it won't work with 0.24 or 0.25 backends, correct? If so,
> you should really make this clear on your market page before you get a
> bunch of 1 star ratings from people saying how much your app sucks
> because it didn't work on their system.
>
>
> I would like to have it supporting multiple backend versions but I don't
> know how. Is there a way? The only thing I have seen regarding this is
> that you should not "probe" the backend for versions... Is there a way
> to tell the the backend to be backwards-compatible?

Would probably have to be a user setting.

Paul.
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tom at redpepperracing

Feb 23, 2012, 8:28 AM

Post #10 of 83 (3605 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 11:10 AM, - - <fretinvin [at] gmail> wrote:
>
>
> On 23 February 2012 17:04, Ronald Frazier <ron [at] ronfrazier> wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 9:03 AM, - - <fretinvin [at] gmail> wrote:
>> > I have yesterday released the first version of my hobby-project, a
>> > mythtv
>> > frontend for Android.
>> >
>> > It uses protocol version 56 (mythtv 0.23).
>>
>> Which means it won't work with 0.24 or 0.25 backends, correct? If so,
>> you should really make this clear on your market page before you get a
>> bunch of 1 star ratings from people saying how much your app sucks
>> because it didn't work on their system.
>>
>
> I would like to have it supporting multiple backend versions but I don't
> know how. Is there a way? The only thing I have seen regarding this is that
> you should not "probe" the backend for versions... Is there a way to tell
> the the backend to be backwards-compatible?

>From the Wiki page:

=========================
Saying Hello

A Myth TV backend typically runs on port 6543 and the first thing you
will need to do when you connect, is tell Myth the protocol version
that you speak. This is done by sending the MYTH_PROTO_VERSION
command. The only argument to this command is the version.
Here's the catch. If you send a version that is different than what
the server is currently running, then it will reject you. When you are
rejected, *** Myth does tell you what version you need to be at in
order for the backend to talk to you***
=========================

So in your app, send the 'MYTH_PROTO_VERSION' command, parse the
response, then have your app branch as appropriate for the version it
tells you it needs, and then resend the proper 'MYTH_PROTO_VERSION'
command. Of course, if you don't support the version being returned,
then you need to exit.

Tom
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ron at ronfrazier

Feb 23, 2012, 8:33 AM

Post #11 of 83 (3603 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 11:10 AM, - - <fretinvin [at] gmail> wrote:
> I would like to have it supporting multiple backend versions but I don't
> know how. Is there a way? The only thing I have seen regarding this is that
> you should not "probe" the backend for versions... Is there a way to tell
> the the backend to be backwards-compatible?

No, as I recall neither the frontend nor backend are forward or
backward compatible. They must always match protocol versions exactly.
Other myth-compatible software maintains compatability by supporting
multiple protocols and then using whichever one is supported by the
backend.

You said not to probe for backend versions, but that's not really
true. The guide you link to says that when you say hello by telling it
your protocol version, it will reject you but tell you what version it
does support. You can then reconnect using a different protocol IF YOU
HAVE CODED SUPPORT FOR THAT PROTOCOL. The main point there is, don't
just assume the protocol is similar enough and say that you support
version X+1 when you really only truly support version X.

I used to run a couple of hauppauge media MVP devices, and they had
myth compatible firmware that ran on them. As I recall, that's exactly
how they handled supporting multiple version. They would connect to
myth and identify as supporting a specific version and then reconnect
using the appropriate supported protocol once it knew what the backend
was using.




--
Ron Frazier
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raymond at wagnerrp

Feb 23, 2012, 10:33 AM

Post #12 of 83 (3596 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On 2/23/2012 11:04, Ronald Frazier wrote:
> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 9:03 AM, - -<fretinvin [at] gmail> wrote:
>> I have yesterday released the first version of my hobby-project, a mythtv
>> frontend for Android.
>>
>> It uses protocol version 56 (mythtv 0.23).
> Which means it won't work with 0.24 or 0.25 backends, correct?

It also means it won't work on properly maintained 0.23 backends
either. The fixes/0.23 branch received a bugfix, correcting the backend
protocol to resolve some issues that would prevent deletion of files
under certain circumstances, incurring a version bump to 23056. While
this is a trivial change that likely requires only the change of one
string and a recompile, it does segregate the available market against
an app designed only for a single protocol version, and the selection of
the old protocol means it will be incompatible with the bulk of 0.23
users' systems.

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Category:Myth_Protocol#List_of_proto_bumps
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glemsom at gmail

Feb 23, 2012, 10:52 AM

Post #13 of 83 (3595 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On 23 February 2012 19:33, Raymond Wagner <raymond [at] wagnerrp> wrote:
> On 2/23/2012 11:04, Ronald Frazier wrote:
>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 9:03 AM, - -<fretinvin [at] gmail>  wrote:
>>> I have yesterday released the first version of my hobby-project, a mythtv
>>> frontend for Android.
>>>
>>> It uses protocol version 56 (mythtv 0.23).
>> Which means it won't work with 0.24 or 0.25 backends, correct?
>
> It also means it won't work on properly maintained 0.23 backends
> either.  The fixes/0.23 branch received a bugfix, correcting the backend
> protocol to resolve some issues that would prevent deletion of files
> under certain circumstances, incurring a version bump to 23056.  While
> this is a trivial change that likely requires only the change of one
> string and a recompile, it does segregate the available market against
> an app designed only for a single protocol version, and the selection of
> the old protocol means it will be incompatible with the bulk of 0.23
> users' systems.
>
> http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Category:Myth_Protocol#List_of_proto_bumps
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://www.mythtv.org/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Having a good frontend on Android would make tablets A LOT more usefull! :D
Currently we have the option to stream by upnp - which isn't really
that usefull anyway...

Make this OpenSource, and I could imagine a lot of other people would
be happy to work on this project!
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raymond at wagnerrp

Feb 23, 2012, 10:55 AM

Post #14 of 83 (3604 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On 2/23/2012 11:33, Ronald Frazier wrote:
> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 11:10 AM, - -<fretinvin [at] gmail> wrote:
>> I would like to have it supporting multiple backend versions but I don't
>> know how. Is there a way? The only thing I have seen regarding this is that
>> you should not "probe" the backend for versions... Is there a way to tell
>> the the backend to be backwards-compatible?
> No, as I recall neither the frontend nor backend are forward or
> backward compatible. They must always match protocol versions exactly.
> Other myth-compatible software maintains compatability by supporting
> multiple protocols and then using whichever one is supported by the
> backend.
>
> You said not to probe for backend versions, but that's not really
> true. The guide you link to says that when you say hello by telling it
> your protocol version, it will reject you but tell you what version it
> does support. You can then reconnect using a different protocol IF YOU
> HAVE CODED SUPPORT FOR THAT PROTOCOL. The main point there is, don't
> just assume the protocol is similar enough and say that you support
> version X+1 when you really only truly support version X.
>
> I used to run a couple of hauppauge media MVP devices, and they had
> myth compatible firmware that ran on them. As I recall, that's exactly
> how they handled supporting multiple version. They would connect to
> myth and identify as supporting a specific version and then reconnect
> using the appropriate supported protocol once it knew what the backend
> was using.

Exactly. The correct version response from the backend is there
specifically for that reason. Just because the first party protocol
libraries choose not to support more than a protocol version at a time
does not mean third party libraries are denied from doing so. The
`mythbox` plugin for XBMC is a good example of how to do this properly.
They have a base version and communication class they use to attempt
connecting. If there is a mismatch, they have an array of further
protocol versions implemented as subclasses to that base, with modified
commands and data processing to correctly communicate with the backend.
If there is not a class supporting the protocol version returned by the
backend, it aborts.

On the other hand, `mythbox` only provides the content lists for XBMC,
while XBMC has its own internal support for streaming from the backend,
provided by libcmyth. Libcmyth is an example of how not to do things,
attempting some bogus version number, and then parroting back whatever
version the backend responds with. Just prior to the 0.24 release, I
added an identifier token to the version check. The correct version is
returned upon an error, but the token is not. The client must send the
proper token matched to that version.

In theory, that would mean any client needs to be properly updated for
the new version. In practice, the client could just be recompiled with
the new token, blind to whatever protocol changes incurred it. Or the
client could take a user selectable value. Or the client could pull the
proper tokens from some web service, or scrape the protocol
documentation on the wiki itself. The token check was simply added to
make bypassing the version check more of an annoyance, and hopefully
suggest to any developer otherwise wanting to do so that it is a bad
idea. There is no good reason to do so. Someone might claim it is
useful for development purposes, but for that, there is a compile flag
in MythTV that disables the version check entirely.
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raymond at wagnerrp

Feb 23, 2012, 11:20 AM

Post #15 of 83 (3604 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On 2/23/2012 13:52, Glenn Sommer wrote:
> Make this OpenSource, and I could imagine a lot of other people would
> be happy to work on this project!

Experience indicates otherwise. While the MythTV user base estimated in
the tens of thousands, the number of users who participate on the
mailing list, wiki, or submit tickets to trac are in the low single
digit percent. Users who submit patches to trac are significantly lower
still, although admittedly, the often slow turn around time on feature
patches provides a disincentive towards doing so.

One of the non-developers who has been helping with the audio framework
writes MythDroid, supporting several backend versions, and allowing
streaming playback through a separate transcoding daemon that runs along
side mythbackend. Right now, he's only got two other people who have
committed anything.

For better or worse, the open source community suffers from an inability
to maintain code. Maintaining code is boring. If it's your own code,
you've become a better programmer since you wrote it, so you think it's
garbage and want to rewrite it. If it's someone else's code, you have
your own very different style of programming, so you think it's garbage
and want to rewrite it. Since you're not being paid otherwise, you do
what you want. The fact that this program exists in the first place is
indicative of this. To the author's defense, I have no desire to learn
Java, and would have done the same thing.
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mrand at pobox

Feb 23, 2012, 2:47 PM

Post #16 of 83 (3580 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:20 PM, Raymond Wagner <raymond [at] wagnerrp> wrote:
> On 2/23/2012 13:52, Glenn Sommer wrote:
>> Make this OpenSource, and I could imagine a lot of other people would
>> be happy to work on this project!
>
> Experience indicates otherwise. While the MythTV user base estimated in
> the tens of thousands, the number of users who participate on the
> mailing list, wiki, or submit tickets to trac are in the low single
> digit percent.

I would have been happy to contribute over the past many years if not
for the complexity of the code (threaded QT / C++). Yes, I realize
that QT and C++ leverage is how the core developers have managed to
develop the amazing application that we have today - so it is
something of a catch-22. I don't have data to back it up, but it
would not surprise me at all if there were more people like me than
number of people that have contributed thus far.

> Users who submit patches to trac are significantly lower
> still, although admittedly, the often slow turn around time on feature
> patches provides a disincentive towards doing so.

Agreed. From personal experience, it even affects motivation on
submitting bug reports - which in some ways is worse for the project
than the lack of developers.

Marc
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raymond at wagnerrp

Feb 23, 2012, 4:18 PM

Post #17 of 83 (3583 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On 2/23/2012 17:47, Marc Randolph wrote:
> I would have been happy to contribute over the past many years if not
> for the complexity of the code (threaded QT / C++).

I'm not sure if I believe that. Typed languages are going to be
inherently more difficult to architect than untyped languages, but in a
lot of cases, the Qt framework makes that fairly painless. Dealing with
segmentation faults is annoying, but with the fancy constructors and
destructors handling much of that in C++, you generally never run into
such issues until you start allocating "new" instances of things.
Threading is a pain, but a lot of things are event driven rather than
thread driven, and a lot more are going to be largely isolated, and
don't have to deal with the locking and communication issues that
typically cause threaded code to be difficult.

Simple things in C++ are going to be fairly easy to do, just like any
other language. Similarly, complex things in C++ are going to be
difficult to do, but that holds true for any other language. There are
plenty of low hanging bits that someone with a modest programming
background could start into. There is just the stigma that "C++ is
hard" that scares people away.
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jam at tigger

Feb 23, 2012, 5:17 PM

Post #18 of 83 (3574 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On 24/02/2012, at 6:59 AM, mythtv-users-request [at] mythtv wrote:

>>> Make this OpenSource, and I could imagine a lot of other people would
>>> be happy to work on this project!
>>
>> Experience indicates otherwise. ?While the MythTV user base estimated in
>> the tens of thousands, the number of users who participate on the
>> mailing list, wiki, or submit tickets to trac are in the low single
>> digit percent.
>
> I would have been happy to contribute over the past many years if not
> for the complexity of the code (threaded QT / C++). Yes, I realize
> that QT and C++ leverage is how the core developers have managed to
> develop the amazing application that we have today - so it is
> something of a catch-22. I don't have data to back it up, but it
> would not surprise me at all if there were more people like me than
> number of people that have contributed thus far.
>
>> Users who submit patches to trac are significantly lower
>> still, although admittedly, the often slow turn around time on feature
>> patches provides a disincentive towards doing so.
>
> Agreed. From personal experience, it even affects motivation on
> submitting bug reports - which in some ways is worse for the project
> than the lack of developers.

Saying this another way:

I open a ticket saying something is wrong

The ticket is closed saying you idiot, you are wasting my precious time with your stupid utterings (and to be fair not everybody behaves like this - thanks to those who don't)
Now me: I've found something wrong, I braved the trac, feedback et al gauntlet because I think it may be of aid to everyone ...
so I go away chastened never to return

James
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skd5aner at gmail

Feb 23, 2012, 5:25 PM

Post #19 of 83 (3577 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 9:56 AM, - - <fretinvin [at] gmail> wrote:
>
>
> On 23 February 2012 15:41, Paul Gardiner <lists [at] glidos> wrote:
>>
>> On 23/02/2012 14:32, - - wrote:
>> > On 23 February 2012 15:16, Dave Badia <dbadia [at] gmail
>> > <mailto:dbadia [at] gmail>> wrote:
>> >
>> > Is this project open source? I ask because I am on .24 and would
>> > like to help bring it up to date by adding 24 and 25 support
>> >
>> >
>> > No, it is not open source. It is not unlikely though that it will be
>> > released as open source some day, but currently it is closed...
>>
>> Is this written from scratch then, not based on the MythTV source?
>
>
> Yes, written from scratch inspired by the protocol guide at:
> http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Myth_Protocol/Guide
>
> /Fredrik
>
>>
>>
>> Paul.


Nice work - I've got a few android devices and have been wishing for a
more integrated mythtv experience on Android.

However, at this point I would suggest you strongly consider getting
it to run on soon-to-be-released 0.25 (current development branch) and
leverage the Services API and HLS (HTTP live streaming) capabilities -
http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Services_API . You'd probably be way better
off just forgetting about supporting 0.24 and definitely 0.23 as the
user base is probably smaller and you'll just frustrate people who are
using any different version of the protocol you've chosen to use.

The services API is basically replacing MythXML from here on out and
is written to be more stable for 3'rd party consumption than
MythProtocol. I'm very surprised that I'm the first to come to this
thread and suggest this... projects like yours is exactly why it was
created in the first place.

Anyway... since 0.25 will be about in approx 2 months, you'd have some
time to work on it, and perhaps and get it ready by release. One of
the mythtv developers took on a side project of creating an iOS app
that leverages the API heavily to interact with the backend &
frontend, and even stream recordings and videos. Check out
http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/496645#496645 and
http://vimeo.com/32063038 for more details. I'd sure like to see
something of equal sorts for android.

Thanks!
Matt
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gaberubin at gmail

Feb 23, 2012, 5:30 PM

Post #20 of 83 (3574 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 5:25 PM, Matt S. <skd5aner [at] gmail> wrote:
> Anyway... since 0.25 will be about in approx 2 months, you'd have some
> time to work on it, and perhaps and get it ready by release. One of
> the mythtv developers took on a side project of creating an iOS app
> that leverages the API heavily to interact with the backend &
> frontend, and even stream recordings and videos. Check out
> http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/496645#496645 and
> http://vimeo.com/32063038 for more details. I'd sure like to see
> something of equal sorts for android.
>

And that developer is now one of the two Torc developers. I don't
want to make assumptions, but that would imply to me that he is no
longer doing development for myth. Maybe others can speak to it, but
does that mean this iOS project is dead with respect to myth?
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skd5aner at gmail

Feb 23, 2012, 5:38 PM

Post #21 of 83 (3581 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 8:30 PM, Gabe Rubin <gaberubin [at] gmail> wrote:
> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 5:25 PM, Matt S. <skd5aner [at] gmail> wrote:
>> Anyway... since 0.25 will be about in approx 2 months, you'd have some
>> time to work on it, and perhaps and get it ready by release. One of
>> the mythtv developers took on a side project of creating an iOS app
>> that leverages the API heavily to interact with the backend &
>> frontend, and even stream recordings and videos. Check out
>> http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users/496645#496645 and
>> http://vimeo.com/32063038 for more details. I'd sure like to see
>> something of equal sorts for android.
>>
>
> And that developer is now one of the two Torc developers. I don't
> want to make assumptions, but that would imply to me that he is no
> longer doing development for myth. Maybe others can speak to it, but
> does that mean this iOS project is dead with respect to myth?

Correct, but probably not a relevant question for this thread. That
said, the torc developers are aiming to make their "frontend" client
compatible with mythbackend 0.25... it might be a reasonable
assumption that /if/ Robert's iOS app is released as a feature for
torc, that it may likely work with the next release of mythtv as well.
Basically, the moral of the story is... If it does... it does... if
it doesn't, it doesn't.

... still not really relavent to Fredrik's effort of getting a client
working for android. :-)

Matt
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gaberubin at gmail

Feb 23, 2012, 5:49 PM

Post #22 of 83 (3576 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 5:38 PM, Matt S. <skd5aner [at] gmail> wrote:
> ... still not really relavent to Fredrik's effort of getting a client
> working for android. :-)

Good point. I should not have cluttered this thread with that
question, and I suppose I can simply ask the developer directly.
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ctreleaven at cogeco

Feb 23, 2012, 5:53 PM

Post #23 of 83 (3583 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

At 9:17 AM +0800 2/24/12, James Linder wrote:
>On 24/02/2012, at 6:59 AM, mythtv-users-request [at] mythtv wrote:
>
>>>> Make this OpenSource, and I could imagine a lot of other people would
>>>> be happy to work on this project!
>>>
>>> Experience indicates otherwise. ?While the MythTV user base estimated in
>>> the tens of thousands, the number of users who participate on the
>>> mailing list, wiki, or submit tickets to trac are in the low single
>>> digit percent.
>>
>> I would have been happy to contribute over the past many years if not
>> for the complexity of the code (threaded QT / C++). Yes, I realize
>> that QT and C++ leverage is how the core developers have managed to
>> develop the amazing application that we have today - so it is
>> something of a catch-22. I don't have data to back it up, but it
>> would not surprise me at all if there were more people like me than
>> number of people that have contributed thus far.
>>
>>> Users who submit patches to trac are significantly lower
>>> still, although admittedly, the often slow turn around time on feature
>>> patches provides a disincentive towards doing so.
>>
>> Agreed. From personal experience, it even affects motivation on
>> submitting bug reports - which in some ways is worse for the project
>> than the lack of developers.
>
>Saying this another way:
>
>I open a ticket saying something is wrong
>
>The ticket is closed saying you idiot, you are wasting my precious time with your stupid utterings (and to be fair not everybody behaves like this - thanks to those who don't)
>Now me: I've found something wrong, I braved the trac, feedback et al gauntlet because I think it may be of aid to everyone ...
>so I go away chastened never to return

Well, it didn't work, did it! You're still here!! (Just joking.)

In my experience, the developers can be a bit crusty; most often when someone ignores the feedback they've been given. _I_ can get a bit crusty at times (and probably for less reason) so I'm certainly in no position to throw stones.

MythTV is an ASTONISHING piece of software. Superior recording rules compared to everything else out there, commercial or otherwise. Support for TV standards around the world. Myriad entertainment features, etc, etc.

Pick something close to home for me--runs on Mac OS X. The only other cross-platform product I know of is SageTV and I believe the Mac client has been abandoned. Yet I'm running backend and frontend under OS X on a 5 year old Mini. It is far _more_ stable than the Mac-only solution I used to use (EyeTV). Are there glitches? Yes. I've found the developers ready to put _their_ time into solving _my_ problems if I put time into isolating the circumstances that lead to the problem and make it easier for them to find and fix it.

It seems to me that a lot of the big open source projects have a 'deep-pockets' sponsor funding the work. Maybe it would be a good thing if Myth found such a sponsor. Until then, if the community wants the project to be something more, then the community should get off its duff and start helping to make it happen.

Craig
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gary.buhrmaster at gmail

Feb 23, 2012, 7:12 PM

Post #24 of 83 (3561 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 01:53, Craig Treleaven <ctreleaven [at] cogeco> wrote:

> Maybe it would be a good thing if Myth found such a sponsor.

"deep pocket" sponsors (unless you happen to be independently
wealthy, are you?) tend to be those that see a way to make
money on the investment (usually selling support or services).
I suspect it would be hard these days to go to Sand Hill Rd and
find a venture capitalist willing to fund a new company whose
goal was to sell support/services for MythTV, and contribute to
the development (the days of a business plan created on a
napkin over lunch with VCs and funded that afternoon are
long long over).

> Until then, if the community wants the project to be something
> more, then the community should get off its duff and start
> helping to make it happen.

Agreed.
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raymond at wagnerrp

Feb 23, 2012, 8:14 PM

Post #25 of 83 (3572 views)
Permalink
Re: MythTV Frontend for Android released on Market [In reply to]

On 2/23/2012 22:12, Gary Buhrmaster wrote:
> On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 01:53, Craig Treleaven<ctreleaven [at] cogeco> wrote:
>
>> Maybe it would be a good thing if Myth found such a sponsor.
> "deep pocket" sponsors (unless you happen to be independently
> wealthy, are you?) tend to be those that see a way to make
> money on the investment (usually selling support or services).
> I suspect it would be hard these days to go to Sand Hill Rd and
> find a venture capitalist willing to fund a new company whose
> goal was to sell support/services for MythTV, and contribute to
> the development (the days of a business plan created on a
> napkin over lunch with VCs and funded that afternoon are
> long long over).

There is some of that going on. I Cringley did a piece in 2005 about a
cable system in Canada using MythTV for its distribution network, and
licensing television straight off the satellite feeds. The ASI support
put into 0.25 was contracted work for what I can only assume is a
similar purpose. Pluto Home contracted the addition of the frontend
control socket. Digital Nirvana pushed the mythccextractor application
upstream to us, likely as part of a tool to perform text searches and
produce video clips for new services and the like. Silicon Dust has
been pushing patches for improved support of their devices for almost
two years now, beginning with the initial support of the Prime back in
April 2010. There are rumors of hotels and schools and hospitals
running custom versions, and enough traffic on the mailing list to that
effect that odds are someone is actually doing it. On top of that, you
have OSUOSL providing rackspace for our server, and Silicon Mechanics
has provided hardware in the past.

We just don't have any large backers paying for salary engineers to
further the development of MythTV.
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