Mailing List Archive: MythTV: Users

Rebuild with new frontend and upgraded backend.

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mcdent at gmail

Nov 26, 2009, 2:01 PM

Post #1 of 5 (845 views)
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Rebuild with new frontend and upgraded backend.

Hi,
I'm looking for advice and opinions on the best way to proceed with my upgrade.

Presently I have a combined fe/be running Ubuntu 8.04. MythTV 0.21 is
installed on here and seems to be working well apart from the odd
lockup of the PC.
I've had some disk errors in the past on this system and it caused
some file system corruption which mostly I was able to fix but it did
leave some things
broken, i.e. entire directories ended up becoming files, /etc/apache
was one of these!
Anyway I've ran with it like this for over a year.

Recently I wanted to move this large and slightly noisy box in to the
garage and use a dedicated Acer Revo frontend in the lounge.

So after some great advice and reading on this list I bought one of
the Linux Acer Revo 3610 Atom 330's. I bought a new 1TB disk for the
back end too.
I also want to add a dual USB tuner which I have bought.

I'm wondering what the best way to approach this is. Do I:-

a) Attempt to upgrade the 8.04 backend to 8.10 to 9.04 and 9.10 then
install 9.10 on the Revo?
b) Attempt to backup the Myth database and files on the backend and do
a clean install of 9.10 on it, and install 9.10 on the Revo
c) Wipe the whole backend and install 9.10 and start fresh with 0.22 on both
d) Something else?

If I go with a) I guess I will have to upgrade Myth as in b) anyway.
I've read about a few problems with the upgrade on the list, thats why
I wonder if I should
cut my losses and go for a fresh Myth install like c) ?

Anyway I value the opinions of you guys :)

Thanks
Mike
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knowledgejunkie at gmail

Nov 26, 2009, 11:26 PM

Post #2 of 5 (789 views)
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Re: Rebuild with new frontend and upgraded backend. [In reply to]

2009/11/26 Mike Dent <mcdent [at] gmail>:

> So after some great advice and reading on this list I bought one of
> the Linux Acer Revo 3610 Atom 330's. I bought a new 1TB disk for the
> back end too.
> I also want to add a dual USB tuner which I have bought.
>
> I'm wondering what the best way to approach this is. Do I:-
>
> a) Attempt to upgrade the 8.04 backend to 8.10 to 9.04 and 9.10 then
> install 9.10 on the Revo?
> b) Attempt to backup the Myth database and files on the backend and do
> a clean install of 9.10 on it, and install 9.10 on the Revo
> c) Wipe the whole backend and install 9.10 and start fresh with 0.22 on both
> d) Something else?
>
> If I go with a) I guess I will have to upgrade Myth as in b) anyway.
> I've read about a few problems with the upgrade on the list, thats why
> I wonder if I should
> cut my losses and go for a fresh Myth install like c) ?

How important is your recording history (and to a lesser degree,
recording rules to you)? To me at least, that would dictate whether I
continued to use the existing database or started completely afresh. I
would almost always choose option (b) unless the DB was completely
lost, as it is a chance to clear out accumulated cruft (and in your
case, potentially bad files due to your disk issues) yet keep MythTV's
equivalent of a London cabbie's "knowledge".

Is the new 1TB drive purely for recordings? If you are keeping the
drive that previously had errors, are you happy that it is now error
free, or will you be removing it from the backend entirely? If it's a
keeper, check it with the manufacturers relevant diagnostics tool
(likely included on the Ultimate Boot CD).

I've also just built a Revo 3610 on Fedora 12 to replace a 5yr old
Asus Pundit-R frontend, but with 0.21-fixes for the time being until I
get around to upgrading the master backend. No issues so far to report
except:

i) the nouveau driver did not configure out-of-the-box for Xv support,
so I installed the binary nvidia driver, even though I won't initially
be making use of VDPAU
ii) I configured Myth audio to use ALSA:front and control the master
mixer control, as it will be using the analog out with speakers
iii) almost having a Larry David moment when trying to open the DVB-T
tuner packaging

The first two items may be Fedora 12 specific (or just specific to my
install). I am able to watch SD recordings over the 11g wifi
connection without any trouble. It'll be hardwired into the gigabit
network later today when I "retire" the Pundit to a spare room. I
picked up one of the Ł25 dual DVB-T tuners from Maplin (Vedi branded,
704J model) which was detected fine running the stock 2.6.31 F12
kernel, but requires the installation of firmware. I'll test it later
on today in kaffeine to see how well the tuners work out-of-the-box,
but I'm interested in seeing how well the 3610 works overall as a
combined SDTV Mythbox and at Ł25 the dual tuner was too good an offer
to refuse.

Cheers,
Nick

--
Nick Morrott

MythTV Official wiki: http://mythtv.org/wiki/
MythTV users list archive: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/users

"An investment in knowledge always pays the best interest." - Benjamin Franklin
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mcdent at gmail

Nov 27, 2009, 3:48 AM

Post #3 of 5 (772 views)
Permalink

Re: Rebuild with new frontend and upgraded backend. [In reply to]

2009/11/27 Nick Morrott <knowledgejunkie [at] gmail>:
> 2009/11/26 Mike Dent <mcdent [at] gmail>:
>
>> So after some great advice and reading on this list I bought one of
>> the Linux Acer Revo 3610 Atom 330's. I bought a new 1TB disk for the
>> back end too.
>> I also want to add a dual USB tuner which I have bought.
>>
>> I'm wondering what the best way to approach this is. Do I:-
>>
>> a) Attempt to upgrade the 8.04 backend to 8.10 to 9.04 and 9.10 then
>> install 9.10 on the Revo?
>> b) Attempt to backup the Myth database and files on the backend and do
>> a clean install of 9.10 on it, and install 9.10 on the Revo
>> c) Wipe the whole backend and install 9.10 and start fresh with 0.22 on both
>> d) Something else?
>>
>> If I go with a) I guess I will have to upgrade Myth as in b) anyway.
>> I've read about a few problems with the upgrade on the list, thats why
>> I wonder if I should
>> cut my losses and go for a fresh Myth install like c) ?
>
> How important is your recording history (and to a lesser degree,
> recording rules to you)? To me at least, that would dictate whether I
> continued to use the existing database or started completely afresh. I
> would almost always choose option (b) unless the DB was completely
> lost, as it is a chance to clear out accumulated cruft (and in your
> case, potentially bad files due to your disk issues) yet keep MythTV's
> equivalent of a London cabbie's "knowledge".
>
> Is the new 1TB drive purely for recordings? If you are keeping the
> drive that previously had errors, are you happy that it is now error
> free, or will you be removing it from the backend entirely? If it's a
> keeper, check it with the manufacturers relevant diagnostics tool
> (likely included on the Ultimate Boot CD).
>
> I've also just built a Revo 3610 on Fedora 12 to replace a 5yr old
> Asus Pundit-R frontend, but with 0.21-fixes for the time being until I
> get around to upgrading the master backend. No issues so far to report
> except:
>
> i) the nouveau driver did not configure out-of-the-box for Xv support,
> so I installed the binary nvidia driver, even though I won't initially
> be making use of VDPAU
> ii) I configured Myth audio to use ALSA:front and control the master
> mixer control, as it will be using the analog out with speakers
> iii) almost having a Larry David moment when trying to open the DVB-T
> tuner packaging
>
> The first two items may be Fedora 12 specific (or just specific to my
> install). I am able to watch SD recordings over the 11g wifi
> connection without any trouble. It'll be hardwired into the gigabit
> network later today when I "retire" the Pundit to a spare room. I
> picked up one of the Ł25 dual DVB-T tuners from Maplin (Vedi branded,
> 704J model) which was detected fine running the stock 2.6.31 F12
> kernel, but requires the installation of firmware. I'll test it later
> on today in kaffeine to see how well the tuners work out-of-the-box,
> but I'm interested in seeing how well the 3610 works overall as a
> combined SDTV Mythbox and at Ł25 the dual tuner was too good an offer
> to refuse.
>
> Cheers,
> Nick
>
> --
> Nick Morrott

Thanks for your great reply Nick.

I'm wondering if I should do as you suggest, backup dbase etc and do a
fresh install.
What kind of performance hit would I see by keeping the recordings and
operating system on the same physical
disk? I've seen people say this is a "no no".

If I won't loose much performance, I could use my new 1TB disk for the
install and recordings.
Then once I have restored things from the 'old' disks, I could check
these thoroughly and if they are ok I can
add them to the system for additional recording space etc.

Thanks
Mike
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mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users [at] mythtv
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

mtdean at thirdcontact

Nov 27, 2009, 10:00 AM

Post #4 of 5 (749 views)
Permalink

Re: Rebuild with new frontend and upgraded backend. [In reply to]

On 11/27/2009 06:48 AM, Mike Dent wrote:
> 2009/11/27 Nick Morrott:
>
>> 2009/11/26 Mike Dent:
>>
>>> So after some great advice and reading on this list I bought one of
>>> the Linux Acer Revo 3610 Atom 330's. I bought a new 1TB disk for the
>>> back end too.
>>> I also want to add a dual USB tuner which I have bought.
>>>
>>> I'm wondering what the best way to approach this is. Do I:-
>>>
>>> a) Attempt to upgrade the 8.04 backend to 8.10 to 9.04 and 9.10 then
>>> install 9.10 on the Revo?
>>> b) Attempt to backup the Myth database and files on the backend and do
>>> a clean install of 9.10 on it, and install 9.10 on the Revo
>>> c) Wipe the whole backend and install 9.10 and start fresh with 0.22 on both
>>> d) Something else?
>>>
>>> If I go with a) I guess I will have to upgrade Myth as in b) anyway.
>>> I've read about a few problems with the upgrade on the list, thats why
>>> I wonder if I should
>>> cut my losses and go for a fresh Myth install like c) ?
>>>
>> How important is your recording history (and to a lesser degree,
>> recording rules to you)? To me at least, that would dictate whether I
>> continued to use the existing database or started completely afresh.

IMHO, there's no reason to start with a new database. Especially if you
have existing recordings you plan to keep.

>> I
>> would almost always choose option (b) unless the DB was completely
>> lost,

Right, a broken DB is the only real reason to start new--and even then,
you should be able to use a partial restore to restore the
not-recreatable data.

Starting with a new distro install (versus upgrade), though, is a whole
different matter I'll leave to others with more knowledge/experience
(such as Nick).

> I'm wondering if I should do as you suggest, backup dbase etc and do a
> fresh install.
> What kind of performance hit would I see by keeping the recordings and
> operating system on the same physical
> disk?

Same disk isn't that much of a problem. Same file system is bad.

> I've seen people say this is a "no no".
>
> If I won't loose much performance, I could use my new 1TB disk for the
> install and recordings.
> Then once I have restored things from the 'old' disks, I could check
> these thoroughly and if they are ok I can
> add them to the system for additional recording space etc.

Having separate disks is always nice. Generally, I use my smallest
drive as the drive containing the partition containing the root file
system and the file system with the DB data. Then, whatever "extra"
space I have I use as a partition with a separate file system mounted
such that one of its subdirectories is the last directory in my storage
group directory list and then I just keep it full (i.e. move other
recordings to that directory to fill the hard drive) so it's never
really used as a recording drive--just a playback drive.

If you have an old 13GB HDD or whatever, you could set it up as the root
file system and DB file system, then use the 1TB for recordings, then
after checking your other drives, either move the new install on the
10GB to another drive or just keep using it.

If not, at least make sure you either partition the 1TB drive to get
different file systems or at least plan to move the root/DB off the 1TB
drive as soon as possible.

Just my opinion/recommendation. FWIW.

Mike
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mythtv-users mailing list
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mcdent at gmail

Nov 27, 2009, 10:26 AM

Post #5 of 5 (751 views)
Permalink

Re: Rebuild with new frontend and upgraded backend. [In reply to]

2009/11/27 Michael T. Dean <mtdean [at] thirdcontact>:
> On 11/27/2009 06:48 AM, Mike Dent wrote:
>>
>> 2009/11/27 Nick Morrott:
>>
>>>
>>> 2009/11/26 Mike Dent:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> So after some great advice and reading on this list I bought one of
>>>> the Linux Acer Revo 3610 Atom 330's. I bought a new 1TB disk for the
>>>> back end too.
>>>> I also want to add a dual USB tuner which I have bought.
>>>>
>>>> I'm wondering what the best way to approach this is. Do I:-
>>>>
>>>> a) Attempt to upgrade the 8.04 backend to 8.10 to 9.04 and 9.10 then
>>>> install 9.10 on the Revo?
>>>> b) Attempt to backup the Myth database and files on the backend and do
>>>> a clean install of 9.10 on it, and install 9.10 on the Revo
>>>> c) Wipe the whole backend and install 9.10 and start fresh with 0.22 on
>>>> both
>>>> d) Something else?
>>>>
>>>> If I go with a) I guess I will have to upgrade Myth as in b) anyway.
>>>> I've read about a few problems with the upgrade on the list, thats why
>>>> I wonder if I should
>>>> cut my losses and go for a fresh Myth install like c) ?
>>>>
>>>
>>> How important is your recording history (and to a lesser degree,
>>> recording rules to you)? To me at least, that would dictate whether I
>>> continued to use the existing database or started completely afresh.
>
> IMHO, there's no reason to start with a new database. Especially if you
> have existing recordings you plan to keep.
>
>>> I
>>> would almost always choose option (b) unless the DB was completely
>>> lost,
>
> Right, a broken DB is the only real reason to start new--and even then, you
> should be able to use a partial restore to restore the not-recreatable data.
>
> Starting with a new distro install (versus upgrade), though, is a whole
> different matter I'll leave to others with more knowledge/experience (such
> as Nick).
>
>> I'm wondering if I should do as you suggest, backup dbase etc and do a
>> fresh install.
>> What kind of performance hit would I see by keeping the recordings and
>> operating system on the same physical
>> disk?
>
> Same disk isn't that much of a problem. Same file system is bad.

Yes, that's what I planned, I will put the recordings on it's own partition.
Thanks.

Mike

>
>> I've seen people say this is a "no no".
>>
>> If I won't loose much performance, I could use my new 1TB disk for the
>> install and recordings.
>> Then once I have restored things from the 'old' disks, I could check
>> these thoroughly and if they are ok I can
>> add them to the system for additional recording space etc.
>
> Having separate disks is always nice. Generally, I use my smallest drive as
> the drive containing the partition containing the root file system and the
> file system with the DB data. Then, whatever "extra" space I have I use as
> a partition with a separate file system mounted such that one of its
> subdirectories is the last directory in my storage group directory list and
> then I just keep it full (i.e. move other recordings to that directory to
> fill the hard drive) so it's never really used as a recording drive--just a
> playback drive.
>
> If you have an old 13GB HDD or whatever, you could set it up as the root
> file system and DB file system, then use the 1TB for recordings, then after
> checking your other drives, either move the new install on the 10GB to
> another drive or just keep using it.
>
> If not, at least make sure you either partition the 1TB drive to get
> different file systems or at least plan to move the root/DB off the 1TB
> drive as soon as possible.
>
> Just my opinion/recommendation. FWIW.
>
> Mike
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
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