Mailing List Archive: MythTV: Users

pcHDTV and HDTV

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brandon at luniac

Aug 25, 2003, 11:18 PM

Post #1 of 28 (3531 views)
Permalink

pcHDTV and HDTV

The new pcHDTV came out just the other day as you guys probably saw. I
read where mythTV got some preliminary support for it, and I am
wondering how that is coming. Also, what hardware is need to output at
HDTV resolutions? I've been lurking for a few days and noticed that
Jarod has an HDTV. How is the performance? And has anyone had a chance
to actually try the pcHDTV card?

Thanks,
Brandon

bbeattie-maillist at linkexplorer

Aug 26, 2003, 10:44 AM

Post #2 of 28 (3502 views)
Permalink

Re: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

I have a card, but I'm also the one who wrote the basic support so I'm
biast. ;-) You can watch HDTV, change channels, seek backwards (Forward
may have a bug that I'm checking into). The main problem we're facing
is you have to use an NTSC TV program guide for HDTV, and shows do not
always match from NTSC to ATSC/HDTV. Once a grabtv for hdtv is written
to parse html on titantv.com and fill a myth database with information I
consider that most of the final goal. Fixing bugs and handling no/poor
ATSC signals is another feature. But it does work.

For hardware, I don't like hardware decoding as you can't do video
overlay for OSD. You will need about a 2.4Ghz+ system to be safe
(Although 1.8Ghz is enough to just play a HD stream). If you use
hardware decoding a 1.2-1.4 ghz should be fine. The performance needs
to be improved in MythTV. Another issue at times (How myth does it's
scaling I believe).

--Brandon

On Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 11:18:02PM -0700, Brandon Bremen wrote:
> The new pcHDTV came out just the other day as you guys probably saw. I
> read where mythTV got some preliminary support for it, and I am
> wondering how that is coming. Also, what hardware is need to output at
> HDTV resolutions? I've been lurking for a few days and noticed that
> Jarod has an HDTV. How is the performance? And has anyone had a chance
> to actually try the pcHDTV card?
>
> Thanks,
> Brandon
>

> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

bfoddy at visi

Aug 26, 2003, 1:28 PM

Post #3 of 28 (3505 views)
Permalink

Re: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

This is encouraging. I've been waiting for a card like this for many
months now. Now that is available and a known commodity, I can start
planning a machine around it.

One question I haven't done much research on, not directly related to
the card but never the less very important...
What output options are there to drive from a graphics card to a HDTV
using component cables? My HDTV doesn't have DVI inputs, so I need
either a card or converter with component outputs. If its a native
video card, then I assume it has to be running in the native
1920x1080 interlaced mode? Etc, etc, etc. Again, it may not
be a big issue, I've just haven't done the research yet.

Thanks,
Brian

On Tue, 26 Aug 2003, Brandon Beattie wrote:

> I have a card, but I'm also the one who wrote the basic support so I'm
> biast. ;-) You can watch HDTV, change channels, seek backwards (Forward
> may have a bug that I'm checking into). The main problem we're facing
> is you have to use an NTSC TV program guide for HDTV, and shows do not
> always match from NTSC to ATSC/HDTV. Once a grabtv for hdtv is written
> to parse html on titantv.com and fill a myth database with information I
> consider that most of the final goal. Fixing bugs and handling no/poor
> ATSC signals is another feature. But it does work.
>
> For hardware, I don't like hardware decoding as you can't do video
> overlay for OSD. You will need about a 2.4Ghz+ system to be safe
> (Although 1.8Ghz is enough to just play a HD stream). If you use
> hardware decoding a 1.2-1.4 ghz should be fine. The performance needs
> to be improved in MythTV. Another issue at times (How myth does it's
> scaling I believe).
>
> --Brandon
>
> On Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 11:18:02PM -0700, Brandon Bremen wrote:
> > The new pcHDTV came out just the other day as you guys probably saw. I
> > read where mythTV got some preliminary support for it, and I am
> > wondering how that is coming. Also, what hardware is need to output at
> > HDTV resolutions? I've been lurking for a few days and noticed that
> > Jarod has an HDTV. How is the performance? And has anyone had a chance
> > to actually try the pcHDTV card?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Brandon
> >
>
> > _______________________________________________
> > mythtv-users mailing list
> > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> > http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>

schloer.jason at tangoinc

Aug 26, 2003, 1:59 PM

Post #4 of 28 (3487 views)
Permalink

RE: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

I've done some of the research, but no real world testing. AVForum is a
good place to try to find people who've done it. In fact there's diy
instructions for making a component converter there(though I haven't
been brave enough to try it yet) If you're building a box around it and
want widescreen, my suggestion would be for an NVIDIA MX series card,
since they support widescreen resolutions and have acceleration for MPEG
files(which is currently being worked into Myth). Once XVMC is fully
enabled in Myth a rather slow 1.2 Ghz machine should be able to do 1080i
no problem. I'd love tohear other people's take on this though.
Especially anyone running a VGA to component converter into a widescreen
HDTV. I'd love to know what's needed to ensure there are no black
borders. Anyway, keep us all informed on what you find out and I'll do
the same when I finally break down and buy a converter myself.

Jason Schloer

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Brian Foddy
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2003 4:29 PM
To: Discussion about mythtv
Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV

This is encouraging. I've been waiting for a card like this for many
months now. Now that is available and a known commodity, I can start
planning a machine around it.

One question I haven't done much research on, not directly related to
the card but never the less very important...
What output options are there to drive from a graphics card to a HDTV
using component cables? My HDTV doesn't have DVI inputs, so I need
either a card or converter with component outputs. If its a native
video card, then I assume it has to be running in the native
1920x1080 interlaced mode? Etc, etc, etc. Again, it may not
be a big issue, I've just haven't done the research yet.

Thanks,
Brian

On Tue, 26 Aug 2003, Brandon Beattie wrote:

> I have a card, but I'm also the one who wrote the basic support so I'm
> biast. ;-) You can watch HDTV, change channels, seek backwards
(Forward
> may have a bug that I'm checking into). The main problem we're facing
> is you have to use an NTSC TV program guide for HDTV, and shows do not
> always match from NTSC to ATSC/HDTV. Once a grabtv for hdtv is
written
> to parse html on titantv.com and fill a myth database with information
I
> consider that most of the final goal. Fixing bugs and handling
no/poor
> ATSC signals is another feature. But it does work.
>
> For hardware, I don't like hardware decoding as you can't do video
> overlay for OSD. You will need about a 2.4Ghz+ system to be safe
> (Although 1.8Ghz is enough to just play a HD stream). If you use
> hardware decoding a 1.2-1.4 ghz should be fine. The performance needs
> to be improved in MythTV. Another issue at times (How myth does it's
> scaling I believe).
>
> --Brandon
>
> On Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 11:18:02PM -0700, Brandon Bremen wrote:
> > The new pcHDTV came out just the other day as you guys probably saw.
I
> > read where mythTV got some preliminary support for it, and I am
> > wondering how that is coming. Also, what hardware is need to output
at
> > HDTV resolutions? I've been lurking for a few days and noticed that
> > Jarod has an HDTV. How is the performance? And has anyone had a
chance
> > to actually try the pcHDTV card?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Brandon
> >
>
> > _______________________________________________
> > mythtv-users mailing list
> > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> > http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>

steele at xtcp

Aug 26, 2003, 2:12 PM

Post #5 of 28 (3501 views)
Permalink

RE: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

I'm running MythTV to a Sony Widescreen Tube using an Audio Authority
vga->Component Video transcoder in 720p exclusively, the picture quality is
superb. You don't need DVI out for a decent picture.
While these may not be cheap... if you want HDTV you don't want to ruin it
with inferior output either.

vga transcoder:
https://www.dcpuraty.com/store/Product_Details.asp?ProductCode=9A60

Steele Price
CTO
Digital Dreamshop
http://xtcp.net

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv]On Behalf Of Brian Foddy
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2003 1:29 PM
To: Discussion about mythtv
Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV

This is encouraging. I've been waiting for a card like this for many
months now. Now that is available and a known commodity, I can start
planning a machine around it.

One question I haven't done much research on, not directly related to
the card but never the less very important...
What output options are there to drive from a graphics card to a HDTV
using component cables? My HDTV doesn't have DVI inputs, so I need
either a card or converter with component outputs. If its a native
video card, then I assume it has to be running in the native
1920x1080 interlaced mode? Etc, etc, etc. Again, it may not
be a big issue, I've just haven't done the research yet.

Thanks,
Brian

On Tue, 26 Aug 2003, Brandon Beattie wrote:

> I have a card, but I'm also the one who wrote the basic support so I'm
> biast. ;-) You can watch HDTV, change channels, seek backwards (Forward
> may have a bug that I'm checking into). The main problem we're facing
> is you have to use an NTSC TV program guide for HDTV, and shows do not
> always match from NTSC to ATSC/HDTV. Once a grabtv for hdtv is written
> to parse html on titantv.com and fill a myth database with information I
> consider that most of the final goal. Fixing bugs and handling no/poor
> ATSC signals is another feature. But it does work.
>
> For hardware, I don't like hardware decoding as you can't do video
> overlay for OSD. You will need about a 2.4Ghz+ system to be safe
> (Although 1.8Ghz is enough to just play a HD stream). If you use
> hardware decoding a 1.2-1.4 ghz should be fine. The performance needs
> to be improved in MythTV. Another issue at times (How myth does it's
> scaling I believe).
>
> --Brandon
>
> On Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 11:18:02PM -0700, Brandon Bremen wrote:
> > The new pcHDTV came out just the other day as you guys probably saw. I
> > read where mythTV got some preliminary support for it, and I am
> > wondering how that is coming. Also, what hardware is need to output at
> > HDTV resolutions? I've been lurking for a few days and noticed that
> > Jarod has an HDTV. How is the performance? And has anyone had a chance
> > to actually try the pcHDTV card?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Brandon
> >
>
> > _______________________________________________
> > mythtv-users mailing list
> > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> > http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>

mark.carline at btinternet

Aug 26, 2003, 2:18 PM

Post #6 of 28 (3485 views)
Permalink

RE: pcHDTV and HDTV & CUSTOM RESOLUTIONS [In reply to]

Hey !

Anyone tried looking at "powerstrip".

It allows custom resolutions from your PC to things like HDTV ?

Guess this would be what we need for mythtv but we need a linux version
?

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Jason Schloer
Sent: 26 August 2003 21:59
To: 'Discussion about mythtv'
Subject: RE: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV

I've done some of the research, but no real world testing. AVForum is a
good place to try to find people who've done it. In fact there's diy
instructions for making a component converter there(though I haven't
been brave enough to try it yet) If you're building a box around it and
want widescreen, my suggestion would be for an NVIDIA MX series card,
since they support widescreen resolutions and have acceleration for MPEG
files(which is currently being worked into Myth). Once XVMC is fully
enabled in Myth a rather slow 1.2 Ghz machine should be able to do 1080i
no problem. I'd love tohear other people's take on this though.
Especially anyone running a VGA to component converter into a widescreen
HDTV. I'd love to know what's needed to ensure there are no black
borders. Anyway, keep us all informed on what you find out and I'll do
the same when I finally break down and buy a converter myself.

Jason Schloer

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Brian Foddy
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2003 4:29 PM
To: Discussion about mythtv
Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV

This is encouraging. I've been waiting for a card like this for many
months now. Now that is available and a known commodity, I can start
planning a machine around it.

One question I haven't done much research on, not directly related to
the card but never the less very important...
What output options are there to drive from a graphics card to a HDTV
using component cables? My HDTV doesn't have DVI inputs, so I need
either a card or converter with component outputs. If its a native
video card, then I assume it has to be running in the native
1920x1080 interlaced mode? Etc, etc, etc. Again, it may not
be a big issue, I've just haven't done the research yet.

Thanks,
Brian

On Tue, 26 Aug 2003, Brandon Beattie wrote:

> I have a card, but I'm also the one who wrote the basic support so I'm
> biast. ;-) You can watch HDTV, change channels, seek backwards
(Forward
> may have a bug that I'm checking into). The main problem we're facing
> is you have to use an NTSC TV program guide for HDTV, and shows do not
> always match from NTSC to ATSC/HDTV. Once a grabtv for hdtv is
written
> to parse html on titantv.com and fill a myth database with information
I
> consider that most of the final goal. Fixing bugs and handling
no/poor
> ATSC signals is another feature. But it does work.
>
> For hardware, I don't like hardware decoding as you can't do video
> overlay for OSD. You will need about a 2.4Ghz+ system to be safe
> (Although 1.8Ghz is enough to just play a HD stream). If you use
> hardware decoding a 1.2-1.4 ghz should be fine. The performance needs
> to be improved in MythTV. Another issue at times (How myth does it's
> scaling I believe).
>
> --Brandon
>
> On Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 11:18:02PM -0700, Brandon Bremen wrote:
> > The new pcHDTV came out just the other day as you guys probably saw.
I
> > read where mythTV got some preliminary support for it, and I am
> > wondering how that is coming. Also, what hardware is need to output
at
> > HDTV resolutions? I've been lurking for a few days and noticed that
> > Jarod has an HDTV. How is the performance? And has anyone had a
chance
> > to actually try the pcHDTV card?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Brandon
> >
>
> > _______________________________________________
> > mythtv-users mailing list
> > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> > http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>

steele at xtcp

Aug 26, 2003, 2:24 PM

Post #7 of 28 (3494 views)
Permalink

RE: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

set proper modelines and possibly adjust your TV in Service mode to
reduce/increase overscan and there are no black borders, the biggest problem
I have is in 720p, My Sony had WAY too much overscan (like 30 pixels per
side) and I still need to adjust that out in service mode, but in the short
term, I just made settings to Xine and MythTV to use a borderless window
mode instead of fullscreen. I don't notice any real difference except the
size is now perfect with 2 pixels of overscan.

You can spend a week trying to find information on AVForum, I think I spent
even more, and it's 99% windows based using powerstrip. I have all the
modelines needed for any standard broadcast resolution and will have them up
on my website in a day or 2. These were the most difficult thing to find,
modelines that actually worked and didn't destroy the tube by setting a vga
refresh rate.

I tested alot of different resolutions, 1080i, 720p, 480p, etc. and decided
that 720p was by far the best looking and most consistent. there is great
debate over 1080i vs. 720p, but if you want to see any text from your
computer, you won't be wanting interlaced anything.

Steele Price
CTO
Digital Dreamshop
http://xtcp.net

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv]On Behalf Of Jason Schloer
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2003 1:59 PM
To: 'Discussion about mythtv'
Subject: RE: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV

I've done some of the research, but no real world testing. AVForum is a
good place to try to find people who've done it. In fact there's diy
instructions for making a component converter there(though I haven't
been brave enough to try it yet) If you're building a box around it and
want widescreen, my suggestion would be for an NVIDIA MX series card,
since they support widescreen resolutions and have acceleration for MPEG
files(which is currently being worked into Myth). Once XVMC is fully
enabled in Myth a rather slow 1.2 Ghz machine should be able to do 1080i
no problem. I'd love tohear other people's take on this though.
Especially anyone running a VGA to component converter into a widescreen
HDTV. I'd love to know what's needed to ensure there are no black
borders. Anyway, keep us all informed on what you find out and I'll do
the same when I finally break down and buy a converter myself.

Jason Schloer

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Brian Foddy
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2003 4:29 PM
To: Discussion about mythtv
Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV

This is encouraging. I've been waiting for a card like this for many
months now. Now that is available and a known commodity, I can start
planning a machine around it.

One question I haven't done much research on, not directly related to
the card but never the less very important...
What output options are there to drive from a graphics card to a HDTV
using component cables? My HDTV doesn't have DVI inputs, so I need
either a card or converter with component outputs. If its a native
video card, then I assume it has to be running in the native
1920x1080 interlaced mode? Etc, etc, etc. Again, it may not
be a big issue, I've just haven't done the research yet.

Thanks,
Brian

On Tue, 26 Aug 2003, Brandon Beattie wrote:

> I have a card, but I'm also the one who wrote the basic support so I'm
> biast. ;-) You can watch HDTV, change channels, seek backwards
(Forward
> may have a bug that I'm checking into). The main problem we're facing
> is you have to use an NTSC TV program guide for HDTV, and shows do not
> always match from NTSC to ATSC/HDTV. Once a grabtv for hdtv is
written
> to parse html on titantv.com and fill a myth database with information
I
> consider that most of the final goal. Fixing bugs and handling
no/poor
> ATSC signals is another feature. But it does work.
>
> For hardware, I don't like hardware decoding as you can't do video
> overlay for OSD. You will need about a 2.4Ghz+ system to be safe
> (Although 1.8Ghz is enough to just play a HD stream). If you use
> hardware decoding a 1.2-1.4 ghz should be fine. The performance needs
> to be improved in MythTV. Another issue at times (How myth does it's
> scaling I believe).
>
> --Brandon
>
> On Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 11:18:02PM -0700, Brandon Bremen wrote:
> > The new pcHDTV came out just the other day as you guys probably saw.
I
> > read where mythTV got some preliminary support for it, and I am
> > wondering how that is coming. Also, what hardware is need to output
at
> > HDTV resolutions? I've been lurking for a few days and noticed that
> > Jarod has an HDTV. How is the performance? And has anyone had a
chance
> > to actually try the pcHDTV card?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Brandon
> >
>
> > _______________________________________________
> > mythtv-users mailing list
> > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> > http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>

schloer.jason at tangoinc

Aug 26, 2003, 2:33 PM

Post #8 of 28 (3506 views)
Permalink

RE: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

Does the AA converter have adjustments for width and height, etc? Does
the screen go completely to the edges? I also have a sony and can only
use the widescreen modes(wide zoom, zoom, etc) for standard definition
signals, is that the case here as well? If so, for standard definition
signals are you watching with black bars on the sides or is it stretched
to fill the screen? Sorry to bug you with all these questions, but it's
something I'm very interested in. Thanks,

Jason Schloer

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Steele Price
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2003 5:12 PM
To: Discussion about mythtv
Subject: RE: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV

I'm running MythTV to a Sony Widescreen Tube using an Audio Authority
vga->Component Video transcoder in 720p exclusively, the picture quality
is
superb. You don't need DVI out for a decent picture.
While these may not be cheap... if you want HDTV you don't want to ruin
it
with inferior output either.

vga transcoder:
https://www.dcpuraty.com/store/Product_Details.asp?ProductCode=9A60

Steele Price
CTO
Digital Dreamshop
http://xtcp.net

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv]On Behalf Of Brian Foddy
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2003 1:29 PM
To: Discussion about mythtv
Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV

This is encouraging. I've been waiting for a card like this for many
months now. Now that is available and a known commodity, I can start
planning a machine around it.

One question I haven't done much research on, not directly related to
the card but never the less very important...
What output options are there to drive from a graphics card to a HDTV
using component cables? My HDTV doesn't have DVI inputs, so I need
either a card or converter with component outputs. If its a native
video card, then I assume it has to be running in the native
1920x1080 interlaced mode? Etc, etc, etc. Again, it may not
be a big issue, I've just haven't done the research yet.

Thanks,
Brian

On Tue, 26 Aug 2003, Brandon Beattie wrote:

> I have a card, but I'm also the one who wrote the basic support so I'm
> biast. ;-) You can watch HDTV, change channels, seek backwards
(Forward
> may have a bug that I'm checking into). The main problem we're facing
> is you have to use an NTSC TV program guide for HDTV, and shows do not
> always match from NTSC to ATSC/HDTV. Once a grabtv for hdtv is
written
> to parse html on titantv.com and fill a myth database with information
I
> consider that most of the final goal. Fixing bugs and handling
no/poor
> ATSC signals is another feature. But it does work.
>
> For hardware, I don't like hardware decoding as you can't do video
> overlay for OSD. You will need about a 2.4Ghz+ system to be safe
> (Although 1.8Ghz is enough to just play a HD stream). If you use
> hardware decoding a 1.2-1.4 ghz should be fine. The performance needs
> to be improved in MythTV. Another issue at times (How myth does it's
> scaling I believe).
>
> --Brandon
>
> On Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 11:18:02PM -0700, Brandon Bremen wrote:
> > The new pcHDTV came out just the other day as you guys probably saw.
I
> > read where mythTV got some preliminary support for it, and I am
> > wondering how that is coming. Also, what hardware is need to output
at
> > HDTV resolutions? I've been lurking for a few days and noticed that
> > Jarod has an HDTV. How is the performance? And has anyone had a
chance
> > to actually try the pcHDTV card?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Brandon
> >
>
> > _______________________________________________
> > mythtv-users mailing list
> > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> > http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>

bbeattie-maillist at linkexplorer

Aug 26, 2003, 2:42 PM

Post #9 of 28 (3526 views)
Permalink

Re: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

Rule 1 for display device/resolution/(interlaced/progressive) is your
computer should be displaying whatever your true HDTV's native
resolution is. Most devices are 720P for HDTV's. Also, 1080i HDTV's
are often 1920x540, not 1920x1080. There are several cards, mostly ATI,
that allow you to hook component video cables onto them. If your HDTV
has a 15 D-Sub (VGA) connector just use that and any video card. I know
of few HDTV's that only have component video connections.

--Brandon

On Tue, Aug 26, 2003 at 03:28:32PM -0500, Brian Foddy wrote:
> This is encouraging. I've been waiting for a card like this for many
> months now. Now that is available and a known commodity, I can start
> planning a machine around it.
>
> One question I haven't done much research on, not directly related to
> the card but never the less very important...
> What output options are there to drive from a graphics card to a HDTV
> using component cables? My HDTV doesn't have DVI inputs, so I need
> either a card or converter with component outputs. If its a native
> video card, then I assume it has to be running in the native
> 1920x1080 interlaced mode? Etc, etc, etc. Again, it may not
> be a big issue, I've just haven't done the research yet.
>
> Thanks,
> Brian
>
> On Tue, 26 Aug 2003, Brandon Beattie wrote:
>
> > I have a card, but I'm also the one who wrote the basic support so I'm
> > biast. ;-) You can watch HDTV, change channels, seek backwards (Forward
> > may have a bug that I'm checking into). The main problem we're facing
> > is you have to use an NTSC TV program guide for HDTV, and shows do not
> > always match from NTSC to ATSC/HDTV. Once a grabtv for hdtv is written
> > to parse html on titantv.com and fill a myth database with information I
> > consider that most of the final goal. Fixing bugs and handling no/poor
> > ATSC signals is another feature. But it does work.
> >
> > For hardware, I don't like hardware decoding as you can't do video
> > overlay for OSD. You will need about a 2.4Ghz+ system to be safe
> > (Although 1.8Ghz is enough to just play a HD stream). If you use
> > hardware decoding a 1.2-1.4 ghz should be fine. The performance needs
> > to be improved in MythTV. Another issue at times (How myth does it's
> > scaling I believe).
> >
> > --Brandon
> >
> > On Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 11:18:02PM -0700, Brandon Bremen wrote:
> > > The new pcHDTV came out just the other day as you guys probably saw. I
> > > read where mythTV got some preliminary support for it, and I am
> > > wondering how that is coming. Also, what hardware is need to output at
> > > HDTV resolutions? I've been lurking for a few days and noticed that
> > > Jarod has an HDTV. How is the performance? And has anyone had a chance
> > > to actually try the pcHDTV card?
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > Brandon
> > >
> >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > mythtv-users mailing list
> > > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> > > http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> >
> >
>

> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

bbeattie-maillist at linkexplorer

Aug 26, 2003, 2:48 PM

Post #10 of 28 (3521 views)
Permalink

Re: pcHDTV and HDTV & CUSTOM RESOLUTIONS [In reply to]

http://www.sllug.org/how-to/linux-htpc/video_card_configuration.html

In my Linux-HTPC, I have a list of all modelines for HDTV and other
video formats. To create your own custom I recommend "videogen".
Google for it and you'll find it. powerstrip also creates X modelines,
but I have provided 99% of any that people may want.

--Brandon

On Tue, Aug 26, 2003 at 10:18:34PM +0100, mark.carline wrote:
> Hey !
>
> Anyone tried looking at "powerstrip".
>
> It allows custom resolutions from your PC to things like HDTV ?
>
> Guess this would be what we need for mythtv but we need a linux version
> ?
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
> [mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Jason Schloer
> Sent: 26 August 2003 21:59
> To: 'Discussion about mythtv'
> Subject: RE: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV
>
>
> I've done some of the research, but no real world testing. AVForum is a
> good place to try to find people who've done it. In fact there's diy
> instructions for making a component converter there(though I haven't
> been brave enough to try it yet) If you're building a box around it and
> want widescreen, my suggestion would be for an NVIDIA MX series card,
> since they support widescreen resolutions and have acceleration for MPEG
> files(which is currently being worked into Myth). Once XVMC is fully
> enabled in Myth a rather slow 1.2 Ghz machine should be able to do 1080i
> no problem. I'd love tohear other people's take on this though.
> Especially anyone running a VGA to component converter into a widescreen
> HDTV. I'd love to know what's needed to ensure there are no black
> borders. Anyway, keep us all informed on what you find out and I'll do
> the same when I finally break down and buy a converter myself.
>
> Jason Schloer
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
> [mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Brian Foddy
> Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2003 4:29 PM
> To: Discussion about mythtv
> Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV
>
> This is encouraging. I've been waiting for a card like this for many
> months now. Now that is available and a known commodity, I can start
> planning a machine around it.
>
> One question I haven't done much research on, not directly related to
> the card but never the less very important...
> What output options are there to drive from a graphics card to a HDTV
> using component cables? My HDTV doesn't have DVI inputs, so I need
> either a card or converter with component outputs. If its a native
> video card, then I assume it has to be running in the native
> 1920x1080 interlaced mode? Etc, etc, etc. Again, it may not
> be a big issue, I've just haven't done the research yet.
>
> Thanks,
> Brian
>
> On Tue, 26 Aug 2003, Brandon Beattie wrote:
>
> > I have a card, but I'm also the one who wrote the basic support so I'm
> > biast. ;-) You can watch HDTV, change channels, seek backwards
> (Forward
> > may have a bug that I'm checking into). The main problem we're facing
> > is you have to use an NTSC TV program guide for HDTV, and shows do not
> > always match from NTSC to ATSC/HDTV. Once a grabtv for hdtv is
> written
> > to parse html on titantv.com and fill a myth database with information
> I
> > consider that most of the final goal. Fixing bugs and handling
> no/poor
> > ATSC signals is another feature. But it does work.
> >
> > For hardware, I don't like hardware decoding as you can't do video
> > overlay for OSD. You will need about a 2.4Ghz+ system to be safe
> > (Although 1.8Ghz is enough to just play a HD stream). If you use
> > hardware decoding a 1.2-1.4 ghz should be fine. The performance needs
> > to be improved in MythTV. Another issue at times (How myth does it's
> > scaling I believe).
> >
> > --Brandon
> >
> > On Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 11:18:02PM -0700, Brandon Bremen wrote:
> > > The new pcHDTV came out just the other day as you guys probably saw.
> I
> > > read where mythTV got some preliminary support for it, and I am
> > > wondering how that is coming. Also, what hardware is need to output
> at
> > > HDTV resolutions? I've been lurking for a few days and noticed that
> > > Jarod has an HDTV. How is the performance? And has anyone had a
> chance
> > > to actually try the pcHDTV card?
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > Brandon
> > >
> >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > mythtv-users mailing list
> > > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> > > http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> >
> >
>
>
>
>

> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

steele at xtcp

Aug 26, 2003, 3:01 PM

Post #11 of 28 (3534 views)
Permalink

RE: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

I must have bought the wrong DVI cable because I had all sorts of trouble
getting DVI out to work. I got only green and blue out using a DVI-I cable.
I wasn't going to go out and get another $50 cable just to see if it worked
since I already had the transcoder. But for crispness of display, I saw no
real difference between the two.

You can set an interlaced 1080i modeline in XFree86 and it will translate it
to 560 for you so I'm not sure what you mean there.

Here are my active modelines if anyone needs them.

Section "Monitor"
Identifier "Sony 34XBR800"
HorizSync 28-75
VertRefresh 50-72
# Modeline "1080i" 74.25 1920 1960 2008 2200 1080 1090 1110
1125 +vsync -hsync interlace
ModeLine "720p" 74.25 1280 1328 1384 1666 720 722 728 766
# nice widescreen gaming resolution
Modeline "1000x600" 65.880 1000 1176 1216 1464 600 652 657
750 -hsync -vsync
Modeline "540p" 40.806 960 1036 1116 1216 540 550 551 563
+hsync +vsync
ModeLine "480p" 32.432 720 736 800 858 480 484 492 525
EndSection

Section "Screen"
Identifier "Radeon 7200"
Device "Generic Video Card"
Monitor "Sony 34XBR800"
DefaultDepth 24
SubSection "Display"
# replaced all the defaults with custom timings
#Modes "1024x768" "800x600" "640x480"
Depth 24
Modes "720p" "1000x600" "540p" "480p"
EndSubSection
EndSection

I have commented out 1080i because I never use it/didn't like it.
If you use the "interlace" keyword it does the translation for you into 540.
+-xsync definately make a difference, and you should try making small
changes with xvidtune, but be very careful and only make small changes, if
you get some things to over/underscan better for you then take them and
apply them to your modeline settings.

Steele Price
CTO
Digital Dreamshop
http://xtcp.net

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv]On Behalf Of Brandon Beattie
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2003 2:43 PM
To: Discussion about mythtv
Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV

Rule 1 for display device/resolution/(interlaced/progressive) is your
computer should be displaying whatever your true HDTV's native
resolution is. Most devices are 720P for HDTV's. Also, 1080i HDTV's
are often 1920x540, not 1920x1080. There are several cards, mostly ATI,
that allow you to hook component video cables onto them. If your HDTV
has a 15 D-Sub (VGA) connector just use that and any video card. I know
of few HDTV's that only have component video connections.

--Brandon

On Tue, Aug 26, 2003 at 03:28:32PM -0500, Brian Foddy wrote:
> This is encouraging. I've been waiting for a card like this for many
> months now. Now that is available and a known commodity, I can start
> planning a machine around it.
>
> One question I haven't done much research on, not directly related to
> the card but never the less very important...
> What output options are there to drive from a graphics card to a HDTV
> using component cables? My HDTV doesn't have DVI inputs, so I need
> either a card or converter with component outputs. If its a native
> video card, then I assume it has to be running in the native
> 1920x1080 interlaced mode? Etc, etc, etc. Again, it may not
> be a big issue, I've just haven't done the research yet.
>
> Thanks,
> Brian
>
> On Tue, 26 Aug 2003, Brandon Beattie wrote:
>
> > I have a card, but I'm also the one who wrote the basic support so I'm
> > biast. ;-) You can watch HDTV, change channels, seek backwards (Forward
> > may have a bug that I'm checking into). The main problem we're facing
> > is you have to use an NTSC TV program guide for HDTV, and shows do not
> > always match from NTSC to ATSC/HDTV. Once a grabtv for hdtv is written
> > to parse html on titantv.com and fill a myth database with information I
> > consider that most of the final goal. Fixing bugs and handling no/poor
> > ATSC signals is another feature. But it does work.
> >
> > For hardware, I don't like hardware decoding as you can't do video
> > overlay for OSD. You will need about a 2.4Ghz+ system to be safe
> > (Although 1.8Ghz is enough to just play a HD stream). If you use
> > hardware decoding a 1.2-1.4 ghz should be fine. The performance needs
> > to be improved in MythTV. Another issue at times (How myth does it's
> > scaling I believe).
> >
> > --Brandon
> >
> > On Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 11:18:02PM -0700, Brandon Bremen wrote:
> > > The new pcHDTV came out just the other day as you guys probably saw. I
> > > read where mythTV got some preliminary support for it, and I am
> > > wondering how that is coming. Also, what hardware is need to output at
> > > HDTV resolutions? I've been lurking for a few days and noticed that
> > > Jarod has an HDTV. How is the performance? And has anyone had a chance
> > > to actually try the pcHDTV card?
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > Brandon
> > >
> >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > mythtv-users mailing list
> > > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> > > http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> >
> >
>

> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

steele at xtcp

Aug 26, 2003, 3:03 PM

Post #12 of 28 (3488 views)
Permalink

RE: pcHDTV and HDTV & CUSTOM RESOLUTIONS [In reply to]

What's the point, you don't need powerstrip on linux, powerstrip only makes
modelines for windows and sticks them in the registry...

I have MUCH better results from modelines than I ever got out of powerstrip.

Steele Price
CTO
Digital Dreamshop
http://xtcp.net

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv]On Behalf Of mark.carline
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2003 2:19 PM
To: 'Discussion about mythtv'
Subject: RE: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV & CUSTOM RESOLUTIONS

Hey !

Anyone tried looking at "powerstrip".

It allows custom resolutions from your PC to things like HDTV ?

Guess this would be what we need for mythtv but we need a linux version
?

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Jason Schloer
Sent: 26 August 2003 21:59
To: 'Discussion about mythtv'
Subject: RE: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV

I've done some of the research, but no real world testing. AVForum is a
good place to try to find people who've done it. In fact there's diy
instructions for making a component converter there(though I haven't
been brave enough to try it yet) If you're building a box around it and
want widescreen, my suggestion would be for an NVIDIA MX series card,
since they support widescreen resolutions and have acceleration for MPEG
files(which is currently being worked into Myth). Once XVMC is fully
enabled in Myth a rather slow 1.2 Ghz machine should be able to do 1080i
no problem. I'd love tohear other people's take on this though.
Especially anyone running a VGA to component converter into a widescreen
HDTV. I'd love to know what's needed to ensure there are no black
borders. Anyway, keep us all informed on what you find out and I'll do
the same when I finally break down and buy a converter myself.

Jason Schloer

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Brian Foddy
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2003 4:29 PM
To: Discussion about mythtv
Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV

This is encouraging. I've been waiting for a card like this for many
months now. Now that is available and a known commodity, I can start
planning a machine around it.

One question I haven't done much research on, not directly related to
the card but never the less very important...
What output options are there to drive from a graphics card to a HDTV
using component cables? My HDTV doesn't have DVI inputs, so I need
either a card or converter with component outputs. If its a native
video card, then I assume it has to be running in the native
1920x1080 interlaced mode? Etc, etc, etc. Again, it may not
be a big issue, I've just haven't done the research yet.

Thanks,
Brian

On Tue, 26 Aug 2003, Brandon Beattie wrote:

> I have a card, but I'm also the one who wrote the basic support so I'm
> biast. ;-) You can watch HDTV, change channels, seek backwards
(Forward
> may have a bug that I'm checking into). The main problem we're facing
> is you have to use an NTSC TV program guide for HDTV, and shows do not
> always match from NTSC to ATSC/HDTV. Once a grabtv for hdtv is
written
> to parse html on titantv.com and fill a myth database with information
I
> consider that most of the final goal. Fixing bugs and handling
no/poor
> ATSC signals is another feature. But it does work.
>
> For hardware, I don't like hardware decoding as you can't do video
> overlay for OSD. You will need about a 2.4Ghz+ system to be safe
> (Although 1.8Ghz is enough to just play a HD stream). If you use
> hardware decoding a 1.2-1.4 ghz should be fine. The performance needs
> to be improved in MythTV. Another issue at times (How myth does it's
> scaling I believe).
>
> --Brandon
>
> On Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 11:18:02PM -0700, Brandon Bremen wrote:
> > The new pcHDTV came out just the other day as you guys probably saw.
I
> > read where mythTV got some preliminary support for it, and I am
> > wondering how that is coming. Also, what hardware is need to output
at
> > HDTV resolutions? I've been lurking for a few days and noticed that
> > Jarod has an HDTV. How is the performance? And has anyone had a
chance
> > to actually try the pcHDTV card?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Brandon
> >
>
> > _______________________________________________
> > mythtv-users mailing list
> > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> > http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>

steele at xtcp

Aug 26, 2003, 3:05 PM

Post #13 of 28 (3511 views)
Permalink

RE: pcHDTV and HDTV & CUSTOM RESOLUTIONS [In reply to]

Actually, I think I did use those as my starting point, but some of them
didn't work well for me, so I tweaked them for the XBR800.

Steele Price
CTO
Digital Dreamshop
http://xtcp.net

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv]On Behalf Of Brandon Beattie
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2003 2:48 PM
To: Discussion about mythtv
Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV & CUSTOM RESOLUTIONS

http://www.sllug.org/how-to/linux-htpc/video_card_configuration.html

In my Linux-HTPC, I have a list of all modelines for HDTV and other
video formats. To create your own custom I recommend "videogen".
Google for it and you'll find it. powerstrip also creates X modelines,
but I have provided 99% of any that people may want.

--Brandon

bbeattie-maillist at linkexplorer

Aug 26, 2003, 4:38 PM

Post #14 of 28 (3518 views)
Permalink

Re: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

You are using the wrong input color type. Find an option in your
display device menu that lets you toggle between RGB/Component (It may
be called something besides component) This toggles the display device
into RGB and YCrCb (or whatever that acronym is). DVI-I can be either
RGB(Used for VGA/computers) and YCrCb for component video.

--Brandon

On Tue, Aug 26, 2003 at 03:01:55PM -0700, Steele Price wrote:
> I must have bought the wrong DVI cable because I had all sorts of trouble
> getting DVI out to work. I got only green and blue out using a DVI-I cable.
> I wasn't going to go out and get another $50 cable just to see if it worked
> since I already had the transcoder. But for crispness of display, I saw no
> real difference between the two.
>
> You can set an interlaced 1080i modeline in XFree86 and it will translate it
> to 560 for you so I'm not sure what you mean there.
>
> Here are my active modelines if anyone needs them.
>
> Section "Monitor"
> Identifier "Sony 34XBR800"
> HorizSync 28-75
> VertRefresh 50-72
> # Modeline "1080i" 74.25 1920 1960 2008 2200 1080 1090 1110
> 1125 +vsync -hsync interlace
> ModeLine "720p" 74.25 1280 1328 1384 1666 720 722 728 766
> # nice widescreen gaming resolution
> Modeline "1000x600" 65.880 1000 1176 1216 1464 600 652 657
> 750 -hsync -vsync
> Modeline "540p" 40.806 960 1036 1116 1216 540 550 551 563
> +hsync +vsync
> ModeLine "480p" 32.432 720 736 800 858 480 484 492 525
> EndSection
>
> Section "Screen"
> Identifier "Radeon 7200"
> Device "Generic Video Card"
> Monitor "Sony 34XBR800"
> DefaultDepth 24
> SubSection "Display"
> # replaced all the defaults with custom timings
> #Modes "1024x768" "800x600" "640x480"
> Depth 24
> Modes "720p" "1000x600" "540p" "480p"
> EndSubSection
> EndSection
>
> I have commented out 1080i because I never use it/didn't like it.
> If you use the "interlace" keyword it does the translation for you into 540.
> +-xsync definately make a difference, and you should try making small
> changes with xvidtune, but be very careful and only make small changes, if
> you get some things to over/underscan better for you then take them and
> apply them to your modeline settings.
>
> Steele Price
> CTO
> Digital Dreamshop
> http://xtcp.net
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
> [mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv]On Behalf Of Brandon Beattie
> Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2003 2:43 PM
> To: Discussion about mythtv
> Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV
>
>
> Rule 1 for display device/resolution/(interlaced/progressive) is your
> computer should be displaying whatever your true HDTV's native
> resolution is. Most devices are 720P for HDTV's. Also, 1080i HDTV's
> are often 1920x540, not 1920x1080. There are several cards, mostly ATI,
> that allow you to hook component video cables onto them. If your HDTV
> has a 15 D-Sub (VGA) connector just use that and any video card. I know
> of few HDTV's that only have component video connections.
>
> --Brandon
>
> On Tue, Aug 26, 2003 at 03:28:32PM -0500, Brian Foddy wrote:
> > This is encouraging. I've been waiting for a card like this for many
> > months now. Now that is available and a known commodity, I can start
> > planning a machine around it.
> >
> > One question I haven't done much research on, not directly related to
> > the card but never the less very important...
> > What output options are there to drive from a graphics card to a HDTV
> > using component cables? My HDTV doesn't have DVI inputs, so I need
> > either a card or converter with component outputs. If its a native
> > video card, then I assume it has to be running in the native
> > 1920x1080 interlaced mode? Etc, etc, etc. Again, it may not
> > be a big issue, I've just haven't done the research yet.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Brian
> >
> > On Tue, 26 Aug 2003, Brandon Beattie wrote:
> >
> > > I have a card, but I'm also the one who wrote the basic support so I'm
> > > biast. ;-) You can watch HDTV, change channels, seek backwards (Forward
> > > may have a bug that I'm checking into). The main problem we're facing
> > > is you have to use an NTSC TV program guide for HDTV, and shows do not
> > > always match from NTSC to ATSC/HDTV. Once a grabtv for hdtv is written
> > > to parse html on titantv.com and fill a myth database with information I
> > > consider that most of the final goal. Fixing bugs and handling no/poor
> > > ATSC signals is another feature. But it does work.
> > >
> > > For hardware, I don't like hardware decoding as you can't do video
> > > overlay for OSD. You will need about a 2.4Ghz+ system to be safe
> > > (Although 1.8Ghz is enough to just play a HD stream). If you use
> > > hardware decoding a 1.2-1.4 ghz should be fine. The performance needs
> > > to be improved in MythTV. Another issue at times (How myth does it's
> > > scaling I believe).
> > >
> > > --Brandon
> > >
> > > On Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 11:18:02PM -0700, Brandon Bremen wrote:
> > > > The new pcHDTV came out just the other day as you guys probably saw. I
> > > > read where mythTV got some preliminary support for it, and I am
> > > > wondering how that is coming. Also, what hardware is need to output at
> > > > HDTV resolutions? I've been lurking for a few days and noticed that
> > > > Jarod has an HDTV. How is the performance? And has anyone had a chance
> > > > to actually try the pcHDTV card?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks,
> > > > Brandon
> > > >
> > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > mythtv-users mailing list
> > > > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> > > > http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> > >
> > >
> >
>
> > _______________________________________________
> > mythtv-users mailing list
> > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> > http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>

> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

steele at xtcp

Aug 26, 2003, 5:06 PM

Post #15 of 28 (3504 views)
Permalink

RE: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

ok, this sounds reasonable.
Is the toggle you are referring to on the TV Side? I found nothing on the
TV side to do this and I looked at (I think) every possible menu option, I
saw a reference on AVSForum that it requires a service mode change, I have
all the options for service mode, but haven't been brave enough to go in and
try it yet.

If this is a setting that I can set in XF86Config-4, then what is the
setting line?

I would like to try DVI modes to see if it reduces the HUGE overscan in 720p
mode.

I'm not really lazy, I have read a ton of things on the settings for this
specific TV set, I have just been too rediculous busy to try and mess with
it lately, but I'm planning to do some of this later in the week.

Thanks,

Steele Price
CTO
Digital Dreamshop
http://xtcp.net

-----Original Message-----
From: Brandon Beattie [mailto:bbeattie-maillist [at] linkexplorer]
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2003 4:39 PM
To: steele [at] xtcp; Discussion about mythtv
Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] pcHDTV and HDTV

You are using the wrong input color type. Find an option in your
display device menu that lets you toggle between RGB/Component (It may
be called something besides component) This toggles the display device
into RGB and YCrCb (or whatever that acronym is). DVI-I can be either
RGB(Used for VGA/computers) and YCrCb for component video.

--Brandon

<snip>

hick0088 at tc

Aug 26, 2003, 9:12 PM

Post #16 of 28 (3488 views)
Permalink

RE: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

On Tue, 2003-08-26 at 16:24, Steele Price wrote:
> I tested alot of different resolutions, 1080i, 720p, 480p, etc. and decided
> that 720p was by far the best looking and most consistent. there is great
> debate over 1080i vs. 720p, but if you want to see any text from your
> computer, you won't be wanting interlaced anything.

I've been thinking that a nice future feature of MythTV would be to
change output resolutions (with XF86VidMode or whatever) depending on
content type. Of course, whether someone would want to do this would
depend on the quality of the output device and whatever, but that would
theoretically always give you the best output.

I suspect the TV I want to get probably has a much better deinterlacer
than MythTV does, which is one reason why I've been thinking about it..

--
_ _ _ _ _ ___ _ _ _ ___ _ _ __ E pluribus unum
/ \/ \(_)| ' // ._\ / - \(_)/ ./| ' /(__
\_||_/|_||_|_\\___/ \_-_/|_|\__\|_|_\ __)
[ Mike Hicks | http://umn.edu/~hick0088/ | mailto:hick0088 [at] tc ]

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hick0088 at tc

Aug 26, 2003, 9:29 PM

Post #17 of 28 (3526 views)
Permalink

RE: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

On Tue, 2003-08-26 at 15:59, Jason Schloer wrote:
> I've done some of the research, but no real world testing. AVForum is a
> good place to try to find people who've done it. In fact there's diy
> instructions for making a component converter there(though I haven't
> been brave enough to try it yet) If you're building a box around it and
> want widescreen, my suggestion would be for an NVIDIA MX series card,
> since they support widescreen resolutions and have acceleration for MPEG
> files(which is currently being worked into Myth).

I just figured I should say that most reasonably good quality cards I've
seen on the market over the last 5 years have been able to do analog
output to 1920x1080 (often progressive) and higher. However, the number
of display devices that could handle that have been fairly limited, so
it might just be a blur when you get that high ;-)

I recall that DVI is designed to be able to carry a 1080i signal, though
progressive scan rates only go up to about 1280x1024. For 1600x1200 or
1920x1080p, you need dual-link DVI hardware, which appears to be much
harder to find.

Of course, you need an nVidia graphics card if you want to use XvMC...

--
_ _ _ _ _ ___ _ _ _ ___ _ _ __ Enemy of the state
/ \/ \(_)| ' // ._\ / - \(_)/ ./| ' /(__
\_||_/|_||_|_\\___/ \_-_/|_|\__\|_|_\ __)
[ Mike Hicks | http://umn.edu/~hick0088/ | mailto:hick0088 [at] tc ]

Attachments:

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jcw at wilsonet

Aug 27, 2003, 1:24 AM

Post #18 of 28 (3521 views)
Permalink

Re: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

On Tuesday, Brandon replied to Brandon:

> I have a card, but I'm also the one who wrote the basic support so I'm
> biast. ;-) You can watch HDTV, change channels, seek backwards
> (Forward
> may have a bug that I'm checking into). The main problem we're facing
> is you have to use an NTSC TV program guide for HDTV, and shows do not
> always match from NTSC to ATSC/HDTV. Once a grabtv for hdtv is written
> to parse html on titantv.com and fill a myth database with information
> I
> consider that most of the final goal. Fixing bugs and handling no/poor
> ATSC signals is another feature. But it does work.

I'm getting one of these as soon as I have a spare $200... :)

> For hardware, I don't like hardware decoding as you can't do video
> overlay for OSD. You will need about a 2.4Ghz+ system to be safe
> (Although 1.8Ghz is enough to just play a HD stream). If you use
> hardware decoding a 1.2-1.4 ghz should be fine. The performance needs
> to be improved in MythTV. Another issue at times (How myth does it's
> scaling I believe).

How do you think an Athlon XP 1700 w/512MB of RAM and a GeForce 4 MX
440 would handle playback? I may also have to switch in my spare
GeForce 4 Ti 4400, so I can go DVI to Component video, speaking of
which, where is the best place to get a converter that'll let me feed
my HDTV's component video input from my video card (I'm just using
S-Video right now, which is fine until I go HD... :). I've found one
(linked below), but prices vary all over the board w/DVI cables...

Oh yeah, and the guy at Magnolia Hi-Fi (local audio/video phile shop)
insisted it is impossible to output from my computer to the TV via DVI
to component. I assume this would do the job though:

http://www.bestbuyplasma.com/Plasma/Product.asp_X_Sku_Y_DVIRCA2

Unfortunate digital to analog conversion necessary, but hey. (If only
I'd waited a bit longer to get my HDTV, I woulda had one w/DVI in... :)

> On Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 11:18:02PM -0700, Brandon Bremen wrote:
>> The new pcHDTV came out just the other day as you guys probably saw. I
>> read where mythTV got some preliminary support for it, and I am
>> wondering how that is coming. Also, what hardware is need to output at
>> HDTV resolutions?

See Brandon's HTPC doc:

http://www.sllug.org/how-to/linux-htpc/introduction.html

>> I've been lurking for a few days and noticed that
>> Jarod has an HDTV.

Yep.

>> How is the performance?

Not sure what you mean by that. I don't have any performance issues,
but then I don't have an HDTV tuner card yet either.

>> And has anyone had a chance
>> to actually try the pcHDTV card?

Like I said, as soon as I can afford one...

--Jarod

--
Jarod C. Wilson, RHCE

Got a question? Read this first...
http://catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html

MythTV, Red Hat Linux 9 & ATrpms documentation:
http://pvrhw.goldfish.org/tiki-page.php?pageName=rh9pvr250

bfoddy at visi

Aug 27, 2003, 9:19 AM

Post #19 of 28 (3511 views)
Permalink

Re: Re: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

On Wed, 27 Aug 2003, Jarod C. Wilson wrote:
> Unfortunate digital to analog conversion necessary, but hey. (If only
> I'd waited a bit longer to get my HDTV, I woulda had one w/DVI in... :)

I hear you. I got a 43" Hitachi in Feb, no DVI inputs. My parents
just a couple weeks ago picked up a 51" Sony with DVI for almost
the same price. But hey, I've had 7 months of enjoyment :)

Thanks for all the feedback on my question of component inputs.
Seems like it won't be a major stumbling block (I didn't think it would).
Now just need to collect some money, and get the hardware.

Personally, I waiting to see what the Athlon-64 and newer Xeons
look like before I make this jump. I could realistically see
a dual cpu machine with 1-2 HD cards, perhaps another 1-2 normal
cards. Since my current setup can already record 3 shows on one
machine, I doubt I'll want anything less.

Brian

schloer.jason at tangoinc

Aug 27, 2003, 9:44 AM

Post #20 of 28 (3529 views)
Permalink

RE: Re: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

I may be wrong on this, but for capture you shouldn't need too powerful
a machine. Since ATSC signals are already MPEG2 compressed to at most
19.2 mbps there's not a lot to do other than write the stream to disk.
So throughput will be the bigger issue for multiple hdtv cards. Where
you will need more horsepower is on the machines displaying the stream.
And once Myth is optimized for xvmc, even a 1.2 Ghz machine should be
enough. Anyway, I gues my point is that dual cpu Athlon-64 may be a bit
of overkill, especially if the "normal" cards you're considering are
hardware encoders. I'd love to hear other peoples take on this though,
especially Brandon.

Jason Schloer

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Brian Foddy
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 12:19 PM
To: Discussion about mythtv
Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] Re: pcHDTV and HDTV

On Wed, 27 Aug 2003, Jarod C. Wilson wrote:
> Unfortunate digital to analog conversion necessary, but hey. (If only
> I'd waited a bit longer to get my HDTV, I woulda had one w/DVI in...
:)

I hear you. I got a 43" Hitachi in Feb, no DVI inputs. My parents
just a couple weeks ago picked up a 51" Sony with DVI for almost
the same price. But hey, I've had 7 months of enjoyment :)

Thanks for all the feedback on my question of component inputs.
Seems like it won't be a major stumbling block (I didn't think it
would).
Now just need to collect some money, and get the hardware.

Personally, I waiting to see what the Athlon-64 and newer Xeons
look like before I make this jump. I could realistically see
a dual cpu machine with 1-2 HD cards, perhaps another 1-2 normal
cards. Since my current setup can already record 3 shows on one
machine, I doubt I'll want anything less.

Brian

ijr at po

Aug 27, 2003, 10:29 AM

Post #21 of 28 (3508 views)
Permalink

Re: Re: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

On Wednesday 27 August 2003 12:44 pm, Jason Schloer wrote:
> I may be wrong on this, but for capture you shouldn't need too powerful
> a machine. Since ATSC signals are already MPEG2 compressed to at most
> 19.2 mbps there's not a lot to do other than write the stream to disk.
> So throughput will be the bigger issue for multiple hdtv cards. Where
> you will need more horsepower is on the machines displaying the stream.
> And once Myth is optimized for xvmc, even a 1.2 Ghz machine should be
> enough. Anyway, I gues my point is that dual cpu Athlon-64 may be a bit
> of overkill, especially if the "normal" cards you're considering are
> hardware encoders. I'd love to hear other peoples take on this though,
> especially Brandon.

The xvmc stuff in CVS (and the last release) works fine. Of course, it uses
_more_ cpu than software decoding on my gf4.

Isaac
_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users [at] mythtv
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

bbeattie-maillist at linkexplorer

Aug 27, 2003, 10:32 AM

Post #22 of 28 (3515 views)
Permalink

Re: Re: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

I'd agree 64 bit is overkill. Why spend the extra money when you don't
need to? If I had that type of money I would build a dual P4 or AMD
and then spend the rest on hard drives to do software raid. 8 250GB
drives would be much nicer to have than a 64 bit system. The only
problem facing us in HDTV's in the future will be disk space. Current
processors are more than enough, and the _only_ reason you would need 2
CPU's is if you had 4 cards in a system, recording 20 shows a day and
wanting to transcode them to other formats (mpeg4 maybe to save disk
space). Otherwise a single CPU and 8 250GB drives would be enough if
you don't ever transcode. And anything over 3Ghz isn't needed for a
HTPC. (Don't quote me on this in a year. ;)

A 64 bit system will give you more bandwidth, but you don't need it.
Current systems can easily support 4 40Mb (ATSC streams are 20Mb to
40Mb, common is 25Mb currently). So if you have 160Mb/s your only
holdup will be writing to disk, not you BUS -- and thus why I'd get
software raid on 8 drives.. Space and writing ability.

You could even use a 486 with a software raid for recording 4 HD streams
at once. (Possibly, havn't checked it's max pci bandwidth). And even
though you can use a 1.2Ghz and hardware decoding I am against it
because you lose OSD and to e honest, I'm less than impressed with the
video quality of the mpeg2 decoder on nvidia cards. Upscaling an image
looks terrible, very pixelized. Using software decoding you can improve
the quality some atleast. So 2.4Ghz is a good CPU for a frontend only
system.

Why finance a skyscaper when all you need is a home? -- Don't waste
your money on things you don't need.

--Brandon

On Wed, Aug 27, 2003 at 12:44:09PM -0400, Jason Schloer wrote:
> I may be wrong on this, but for capture you shouldn't need too powerful
> a machine. Since ATSC signals are already MPEG2 compressed to at most
> 19.2 mbps there's not a lot to do other than write the stream to disk.
> So throughput will be the bigger issue for multiple hdtv cards. Where
> you will need more horsepower is on the machines displaying the stream.
> And once Myth is optimized for xvmc, even a 1.2 Ghz machine should be
> enough. Anyway, I gues my point is that dual cpu Athlon-64 may be a bit
> of overkill, especially if the "normal" cards you're considering are
> hardware encoders. I'd love to hear other peoples take on this though,
> especially Brandon.
>
>
> Jason Schloer
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
> [mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Brian Foddy
> Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 12:19 PM
> To: Discussion about mythtv
> Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] Re: pcHDTV and HDTV
>
> On Wed, 27 Aug 2003, Jarod C. Wilson wrote:
> > Unfortunate digital to analog conversion necessary, but hey. (If only
> > I'd waited a bit longer to get my HDTV, I woulda had one w/DVI in...
> :)
>
> I hear you. I got a 43" Hitachi in Feb, no DVI inputs. My parents
> just a couple weeks ago picked up a 51" Sony with DVI for almost
> the same price. But hey, I've had 7 months of enjoyment :)
>
> Thanks for all the feedback on my question of component inputs.
> Seems like it won't be a major stumbling block (I didn't think it
> would).
> Now just need to collect some money, and get the hardware.
>
> Personally, I waiting to see what the Athlon-64 and newer Xeons
> look like before I make this jump. I could realistically see
> a dual cpu machine with 1-2 HD cards, perhaps another 1-2 normal
> cards. Since my current setup can already record 3 shows on one
> machine, I doubt I'll want anything less.
>
> Brian
>
>
>
>

> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

jcaputo1 at comcast

Aug 27, 2003, 11:10 AM

Post #23 of 28 (3513 views)
Permalink

RE: Re: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
> [mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv]On Behalf Of Isaac Richards
> Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 1:29 PM
> To: Discussion about mythtv
> Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] Re: pcHDTV and HDTV
>
>
> The xvmc stuff in CVS (and the last release) works fine. Of
> course, it uses
> _more_ cpu than software decoding on my gf4.
>
> Isaac

Can someone enlighten me as to the purpose/benefit of XvMC support? Is it
for smoother playback? I thought it was hardware-accelerated, so why does
it take more CPU (or is that just because the Myth code works but isn't
optimal yet?)

-JAC

_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users [at] mythtv
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

schloer.jason at tangoinc

Aug 27, 2003, 11:19 AM

Post #24 of 28 (3495 views)
Permalink

RE: Re: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

My bad Isaac, I thought there was still more to do with it aside from
the OSD stuff. Is it something that will scale upwards better, i.e. it
uses 30% cpu on PVR-x50(5 mbps) files, but will also use 30% cpu on a
pchdtv(19.2 mbps) file, whereas a software decoder would jump up to
maybe 90%? Or is it a matter of the TI cards only supporting some of the
features whereas the MX cards support the full set? Or does xvmc just
suck?

Jason Schloer

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Isaac Richards
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2003 1:29 PM
To: Discussion about mythtv
Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] Re: pcHDTV and HDTV

On Wednesday 27 August 2003 12:44 pm, Jason Schloer wrote:
> I may be wrong on this, but for capture you shouldn't need too
powerful
> a machine. Since ATSC signals are already MPEG2 compressed to at most
> 19.2 mbps there's not a lot to do other than write the stream to disk.
> So throughput will be the bigger issue for multiple hdtv cards. Where
> you will need more horsepower is on the machines displaying the
stream.
> And once Myth is optimized for xvmc, even a 1.2 Ghz machine should be
> enough. Anyway, I gues my point is that dual cpu Athlon-64 may be a
bit
> of overkill, especially if the "normal" cards you're considering are
> hardware encoders. I'd love to hear other peoples take on this though,
> especially Brandon.

The xvmc stuff in CVS (and the last release) works fine. Of course, it
uses
_more_ cpu than software decoding on my gf4.

Isaac
_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users [at] mythtv
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

ijr at po

Aug 27, 2003, 11:39 AM

Post #25 of 28 (3513 views)
Permalink

Re: Re: pcHDTV and HDTV [In reply to]

On Wednesday 27 August 2003 02:19 pm, Jason Schloer wrote:
> My bad Isaac, I thought there was still more to do with it aside from
> the OSD stuff.

All that's left to do is the OSD and some code to select it (the current stuff
is always on, and as that only works for mpeg2 playback...)

> Is it something that will scale upwards better, i.e. it
> uses 30% cpu on PVR-x50(5 mbps) files, but will also use 30% cpu on a
> pchdtv(19.2 mbps) file, whereas a software decoder would jump up to
> maybe 90%? Or is it a matter of the TI cards only supporting some of the
> features whereas the MX cards support the full set? Or does xvmc just
> suck?

Don't really know. Thought about buying a MX card or a cheap FX to test
further, then decided I really didn't care _that_ much =)

Isaac
_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users [at] mythtv
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

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