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Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output

 

 

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trgreer at gmail

Aug 27, 2007, 5:03 PM

Post #1 of 22 (9823 views)
Permalink
Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output

Cox Communications in Orange County, CA has disabled the IEEE1394 output on
all of their cable boxes.

I called Technical Support this afternoon and spoke to a supervisor, who
informed me that this was a Cox Cable corporate decision.

When I informed him that this violated FCC regulations, he simply repeated
the new policy.

I promptly informed him that I was going to file a complaint with the FCC -
and immediately start the process of switching my telephone, internet
provider and cable TV service elsewhere.

I have filed a complaint with the FCC.

FYI, The specific FCC regulation that requires this is 47cfr76.640 where it
says:

(4) Cable operators shall:

(i) Effective April 1, 2004, upon request of a customer, replace any leased
high definition set-top box, which does not include a functional IEEE 1394
interface, with one that includes a functional IEEE 1394 interface or
upgrade the customer's set-top box by download or other means to ensure that
the IEEE 1394 interface is functional.

(ii) Effective July 1, 2005, include both a DVI or HDMI interface and an
IEEE 1394 interface on all high definition set-top boxes acquired by a cable
operator for distribution to customers.

I'm not entirely convinced this is a nationwide issue. Perhaps, we have a
local yokel here that is feeling his Wheaties. Is anyone else having this
problem?

Tom


turbo at talstar

Aug 27, 2007, 5:38 PM

Post #2 of 22 (9693 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

Tom Greer wrote:
> Cox Communications in Orange County, CA has disabled the IEEE1394 output on
> all of their cable boxes.
>
> I called Technical Support this afternoon and spoke to a supervisor, who
> informed me that this was a Cox Cable corporate decision.
>
> When I informed him that this violated FCC regulations, he simply repeated
> the new policy.

You need to call him back. Be sure to ask him the full, legal spelling of his name.

You'll need that for the lawsuit. Perhaps he'd like to volunteer, at that time,
the names of his boss, his boss's boss, and the specific "corporate individual" (or
individuals) at Cox Cable that mandated this decision.

Hmm? What lawsuit? I'm no psychologist, but your tone in this email differs from
what is normally displayed here -- clearly, you're suffering at least some measure of
personal anguish after this decision by them to deny you service (service that you
have paid for) in flagrant and direct violation of both federal law and the service
contract you signed with their company as a subscriber. If that's not actionable, what is?

> I promptly informed him that I was going to file a complaint with the FCC -
> and immediately start the process of switching my telephone, internet
> provider and cable TV service elsewhere.
>
> I have filed a complaint with the FCC.

Which, by itself, probably won't scare them much. They'll pay attention to the lawsuit,
though -- especially those individuals that are specifically named therein.


> FYI, The specific FCC regulation that requires this is 47cfr76.640 where it
> says:
>
> (4) Cable operators shall:
>
> (i) Effective April 1, 2004, upon request of a customer, replace any leased
> high definition set-top box, which does not include a functional IEEE 1394
> interface, with one that includes a functional IEEE 1394 interface or
> upgrade the customer's set-top box by download or other means to ensure that
> the IEEE 1394 interface is functional.
>
> (ii) Effective July 1, 2005, include both a DVI or HDMI interface and an
> IEEE 1394 interface on all high definition set-top boxes acquired by a cable
> operator for distribution to customers.
>
> I'm not entirely convinced this is a nationwide issue. Perhaps, we have a
> local yokel here that is feeling his Wheaties. Is anyone else having this
> problem?
>
> Tom
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

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tompoe at fngi

Aug 27, 2007, 5:39 PM

Post #3 of 22 (9676 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

Tom Greer wrote:
> Cox Communications in Orange County, CA has disabled the IEEE1394
> output on all of their cable boxes.
>
> I called Technical Support this afternoon and spoke to a supervisor,
> who informed me that this was a Cox Cable corporate decision.
>
> When I informed him that this violated FCC regulations, he simply
> repeated the new policy.
>
> I promptly informed him that I was going to file a complaint with the
> FCC - and immediately start the process of switching my telephone,
> internet provider and cable TV service elsewhere.
>
> I have filed a complaint with the FCC.
>
> FYI, The specific FCC regulation that requires this is 47cfr76.640
> where it says:
>
> (4) Cable operators shall:
>
> (i) Effective April 1, 2004, upon request of a customer, replace any
> leased high definition set-top box, which does not include a
> functional IEEE 1394 interface, with one that includes a functional
> IEEE 1394 interface or upgrade the customer's set-top box by download
> or other means to ensure that the IEEE 1394 interface is functional.
>
> (ii) Effective July 1, 2005, include both a DVI or HDMI interface and
> an IEEE 1394 interface on all high definition set-top boxes acquired
> by a cable operator for distribution to customers.
>
> I'm not entirely convinced this is a nationwide issue. Perhaps, we
> have a local yokel here that is feeling his Wheaties. Is anyone else
> having this problem?
>
> Tom
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
Tom: Can you take the time and call again, get a name and then follow
up with a complaint for fraud to the SEC.
http://www.sec.gov/complaint/selectconduct.shtml
Just the facts, of course, and they can give it a label. The CA
attorney general needs to know as well. They should be able to help you
determine corporate info to share so anyone can register complaints
about their business practices. These guys operate nationally, so a
top-down policy might be affecting a lot of folks.
Tom
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trgreer at gmail

Aug 27, 2007, 6:24 PM

Post #4 of 22 (9678 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

On 8/27/07, Tom Poe <tompoe [at] fngi> wrote:
>
> Tom: Can you take the time and call again, get a name and then follow
> up with a complaint for fraud to the SEC.
> http://www.sec.gov/complaint/selectconduct.shtml
> Just the facts, of course, and they can give it a label. The CA
> attorney general needs to know as well. They should be able to help you
> determine corporate info to share so anyone can register complaints
> about their business practices. These guys operate nationally, so a
> top-down policy might be affecting a lot of folks.
> Tom
>

I have already filed complaint with the FCC. In addition, I have emailed
complaints with the following executives:

PUBLIC POLICY & REGULATORY:

Amy Cohn
Executive Director of Public Affairs
(404) 843-5769
amy.cohn [at] cox
Stephanie Davis
Director of Public Affairs
(404) 843-7872
stephanie.davis2 [at] cox

Erin Lambremont
Manager of Public Relations
(404) 843-5854
erin.lambremont [at] cox

*California*
*Orange County/Palos Verdes*
Ayn Craciun
Communications Manager
(949) 546-2597
ayn.craciun [at] cox

In my communications, I have stated that I believe this is a local decision
made by an uninformed person, and that I am sure that this will be corrected
once escalated to the proper level of management.

I think that lawsuits and/or SEC complaints are a little premature.

I would urge any other Cox subscribers to similarly express their concerns
with the same people.

Tom


rpooser at gmail

Aug 27, 2007, 7:30 PM

Post #5 of 22 (9662 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

Tom Greer wrote:
> Cox Communications in Orange County, CA has disabled the IEEE1394 output
> on all of their cable boxes.
>
> I called Technical Support this afternoon and spoke to a supervisor, who
> informed me that this was a Cox Cable corporate decision.
>
> When I informed him that this violated FCC regulations, he simply
> repeated the new policy.
>
> I promptly informed him that I was going to file a complaint with the
> FCC - and immediately start the process of switching my telephone,
> internet provider and cable TV service elsewhere.
>
> I have filed a complaint with the FCC.
>
> FYI, The specific FCC regulation that requires this is 47cfr76.640 where
> it says:
>
> (4) Cable operators shall:
>
> (i) Effective April 1, 2004, upon request of a customer, replace any
> leased high definition set-top box, which does not include a functional
> IEEE 1394 interface, with one that includes a functional IEEE 1394
> interface or upgrade the customer's set-top box by download or other
> means to ensure that the IEEE 1394 interface is functional.
>
> (ii) Effective July 1, 2005, include both a DVI or HDMI interface and an
> IEEE 1394 interface on all high definition set-top boxes acquired by a
> cable operator for distribution to customers.
>
> I'm not entirely convinced this is a nationwide issue. Perhaps, we have
> a local yokel here that is feeling his Wheaties. Is anyone else having
> this problem?
>
> Tom
>
>
>

Wow, if comcast tries to pull that on me I will drop them so fast they
won't even be able to say "retention department". You did the right thing.

Raphael
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newbury at mandamus

Aug 27, 2007, 8:01 PM

Post #6 of 22 (9764 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

brian wrote:
> Tom Greer wrote:
>> Cox Communications in Orange County, CA has disabled the IEEE1394 output on
>> all of their cable boxes.
>>
>> I called Technical Support this afternoon and spoke to a supervisor, who
>> informed me that this was a Cox Cable corporate decision.
>>
>> When I informed him that this violated FCC regulations, he simply repeated
>> the new policy.
>
> You need to call him back. Be sure to ask him the full, legal spelling of his name.
>
> You'll need that for the lawsuit. Perhaps he'd like to volunteer, at that time,
> the names of his boss, his boss's boss, and the specific "corporate individual" (or
> individuals) at Cox Cable that mandated this decision.
>
> Hmm? What lawsuit? I'm no psychologist, but your tone in this email differs from
> what is normally displayed here -- clearly, you're suffering at least some measure of
> personal anguish after this decision by them to deny you service (service that you
> have paid for) in flagrant and direct violation of both federal law and the service
> contract you signed with their company as a subscriber. If that's not actionable, what is?
>
>> I promptly informed him that I was going to file a complaint with the FCC -
>> and immediately start the process of switching my telephone, internet
>> provider and cable TV service elsewhere.
>>
>> I have filed a complaint with the FCC.
>
> Which, by itself, probably won't scare them much. They'll pay attention to the lawsuit,
> though -- especially those individuals that are specifically named therein.
>
>
>> FYI, The specific FCC regulation that requires this is 47cfr76.640 where it
>> says:
>>
>> (4) Cable operators shall:
>>
>> (i) Effective April 1, 2004, upon request of a customer, replace any leased
>> high definition set-top box, which does not include a functional IEEE 1394
>> interface, with one that includes a functional IEEE 1394 interface or
>> upgrade the customer's set-top box by download or other means to ensure that
>> the IEEE 1394 interface is functional.
>>
>> (ii) Effective July 1, 2005, include both a DVI or HDMI interface and an
>> IEEE 1394 interface on all high definition set-top boxes acquired by a cable
>> operator for distribution to customers.
>>
>> I'm not entirely convinced this is a nationwide issue. Perhaps, we have a
>> local yokel here that is feeling his Wheaties. Is anyone else having this
>> problem?
>>
>> Tom

Firstly: DO NOT CHANGE YOUR SERVICE. You may lose your standing to
complain, or at the least, decrease the perceived damage to your
enjoyment of the service that their stupidity has caused.

In addition to getting his name, rank, shoe size and jock strap size (
shoe size in order to check the relation with his IQ, and jock strap to
check whether the size of his cojones is inversely related to his IQ),
find out where he works, visit him and deliver a nice pristine copy of
all of 47CFR76. Better yet, get him to sign a receipt. Best yet, have
someone else, not apparently attending with you, to witness this. And
remember that you probably have a digital memo recorder in your cell
phone...which of course, you are carrying in your shirt pocket.

Amazing the effect on corporate lawyers to hear one of their employees
saying words to the effect of "we don't give a crap what the FCC says,
you're not going to get an STB with firewire,"


Geoff
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freedenizen at gmail

Aug 27, 2007, 8:17 PM

Post #7 of 22 (9679 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

I would also advise you to contact James Snider at jsnider [at] 1394ta
he is a member of the 1394 (Firewire) Trade Association and has been
helping people handle FCC complaints about cable companies disabling
and/or restricting firewire.
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beww at beww

Aug 27, 2007, 8:23 PM

Post #8 of 22 (9684 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

Asher wrote:
> I would also advise you to contact James Snider at jsnider [at] 1394ta
> he is a member of the 1394 (Firewire) Trade Association and has been
> helping people handle FCC complaints about cable companies disabling
> and/or restricting firewire.

Might not accomplish anything, but it certainly couldn't hurt to copy
everything to the EFF as well.

BEWW
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aab at cichlid

Aug 27, 2007, 8:31 PM

Post #9 of 22 (9681 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

>I have already filed complaint with the FCC. In addition, I have emailed
>complaints with the following executives:

I'd follow up with registered letters.
Good luck!

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masterclc at gmail

Aug 27, 2007, 8:31 PM

Post #10 of 22 (9681 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

On 8/27/07, Tom Greer <trgreer [at] gmail> wrote:
> Cox Communications in Orange County, CA has disabled the IEEE1394 output on
> all of their cable boxes.
>
> I called Technical Support this afternoon and spoke to a supervisor, who
> informed me that this was a Cox Cable corporate decision.
>
> When I informed him that this violated FCC regulations, he simply repeated
> the new policy.
>
> I promptly informed him that I was going to file a complaint with the FCC -
> and immediately start the process of switching my telephone, internet
> provider and cable TV service elsewhere.
>
> I have filed a complaint with the FCC.
>
> FYI, The specific FCC regulation that requires this is 47cfr76.640 where it
> says:
>
> (4) Cable operators shall:
>
> (i) Effective April 1, 2004, upon request of a customer, replace any leased
> high definition set-top box, which does not include a functional IEEE 1394
> interface, with one that includes a functional IEEE 1394 interface or
> upgrade the customer's set-top box by download or other means to ensure that
> the IEEE 1394 interface is functional.
>
> (ii) Effective July 1, 2005, include both a DVI or HDMI interface and an
> IEEE 1394 interface on all high definition set-top boxes acquired by a cable
> operator for distribution to customers.
>
> I'm not entirely convinced this is a nationwide issue. Perhaps, we have a
> local yokel here that is feeling his Wheaties. Is anyone else having this
> problem?
>
> Tom
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________

Depending on their level of commitment to the community, contact your
local government officials as well (congressman, city council, etc).
If you have more than 1 agency "breathing down their necks" it could
sway their decision now AND in the future...

-Chad
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freedenizen at gmail

Aug 27, 2007, 8:32 PM

Post #11 of 22 (9678 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

On 8/27/07, Brian Wood <beww [at] beww> wrote:
> Asher wrote:
> > I would also advise you to contact James Snider at jsnider [at] 1394ta
> > he is a member of the 1394 (Firewire) Trade Association and has been
> > helping people handle FCC complaints about cable companies disabling
> > and/or restricting firewire.
>
> Might not accomplish anything, but it certainly couldn't hurt to copy
> everything to the EFF as well.

Ya good point I forgot to include that, email hdtvdrm [at] eff I was
having issues with comcast and firewire, was working with James Snider
at 1394ta, and Derek at eff. The comcast rep that handled my
complaint was less then helpful, but atleast I got it all on record.
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rcs at malibyte

Aug 28, 2007, 11:14 PM

Post #12 of 22 (9651 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

>
> Message: 10
> Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2007 18:55:47 -0700
> From: "Tom Greer" <trgreer [at] gmail>
> Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] Cox Communications has turned off Firewire
> output
> To: "Discussion about mythtv" <mythtv-users [at] mythtv>
> Message-ID:
> <e5cf05fa0708281855y7f943dean47f6c853e6c646c [at] mail>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Another update:
>
> A Cox Communications employee called me late today to assure me that they
> take their FCC compliance seriously. She explained that the problem was
> do
> to a coding error in a software update - and that they were working hard
> to
> test and implement a fix.
>
> She stated that the problem was global in nature and a fix was being
> tested
> tomorrow - and that I should expect a fix by Friday (worst case) and most
> likely before that.
>
> Tom

Well, I'm glad you have made progress with Cox. @#$%^&! Time Warner Cable
out here in Los Angeles cut off Firewire back in January. It seems that
they're using the same coders. :-(

Anyway, I have two tuner cards in my Myth box but would love to have
Firewire back - even if all I get is the same unencrypted channels I get
on the raw cable (which is what I got before). It'd be nice to get all
the HD channels I pay for, though. Were you getting those with Cox before
they cut you off?

Bob
--
________________________________________
Bob Sully - Simi Valley, California, USA
http://www.malibyte.net
http://www.malibyte.com

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trgreer at gmail

Aug 29, 2007, 7:03 AM

Post #13 of 22 (9677 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

On 8/28/07, Bob Sully <rcs [at] malibyte> wrote:
>
> Well, I'm glad you have made progress with Cox. @#$%^&! Time Warner Cable
> out here in Los Angeles cut off Firewire back in January. It seems that
> they're using the same coders. :-(
>
> Anyway, I have two tuner cards in my Myth box but would love to have
> Firewire back - even if all I get is the same unencrypted channels I get
> on the raw cable (which is what I got before). It'd be nice to get all
> the HD channels I pay for, though. Were you getting those with Cox before
> they cut you off?
>
> Bob


I was receiving everything except premium and pay-per-view. In other words,
I was getting all of the analog cable channels, all of the digital cable
channels and all of the HD channels (including local OTA channels plus TNT,
Mojo, Discovery, etc).

If Time Warner is not providing you with a set-top box that provide IEEE1394
compliant firewire output, then I would find out which executive is
responsible for regulatory compliance and contact them in writing to
complain. The FCC will direct you to also seek relief from the local
government organization who licenses them. Apparently, they are responsible
to ensure compliance with FCC regulations. So LA must have a group who
selects, approves and oversees cable provider(s). Complain to them and the
FCC at the same time and copy both on the correspondence to the other.

After getting the party-line from the local customer support supervisor that
stated clearly that firewire output had been intentionally disabled, and
then writing calmly and professionally to their regulatoy compliance
executives and managers, Cox has been very quick to agree that they have an
obligation to provide firewire output on the set-top boxes.

In my last home, I had Time Warner as my Cable TV and Internet provider. I
can tell you that Cox Communications is worlds better. They have always
been easy to contact, responsive and professional.

Tom


jra at baylink

Aug 29, 2007, 8:43 AM

Post #14 of 22 (9651 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

On Tue, Aug 28, 2007 at 11:14:02PM -0700, Bob Sully wrote:
> > A Cox Communications employee called me late today to assure me that
> > they take their FCC compliance seriously. She explained that the
> > problem was do to a coding error in a software update - and that
> > they were working hard to test and implement a fix.
> >
> > She stated that the problem was global in nature and a fix was being
> > tested tomorrow - and that I should expect a fix by Friday (worst
> > case) and most likely before that.

Well, perhaps they need to put out an internal memo that says "please
don't tell customers incorrect things that will get us shut down by the
FCC".

> Well, I'm glad you have made progress with Cox. @#$%^&! Time Warner
> Cable out here in Los Angeles cut off Firewire back in January. It
> seems that they're using the same coders. :-(

I gave Snider a heads up on the thread here; he says "please do have
people send me their reports on these problems, in detail; the FCC
people get 'visibly angry' when they hear these things".

For whatever that's worth. :-)

jsnider [at] 1394ta

And for what it's worth, also, I concur with those people who say
"don't cancel your service if you propose to make a fuss; you'll lose
standing"; they're probably right.

Cheers,
-- jra
--
Jay R. Ashworth Baylink jra [at] baylink
Designer The Things I Think RFC 2100
Ashworth & Associates http://baylink.pitas.com '87 e24
St Petersburg FL USA http://photo.imageinc.us +1 727 647 1274
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trgreer at gmail

Aug 29, 2007, 10:51 AM

Post #15 of 22 (9634 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

On 8/29/07, Jay R. Ashworth <jra [at] baylink> wrote:
>
> Well, perhaps they need to put out an internal memo that says "please
> don't tell customers incorrect things that will get us shut down by the
> FCC".


The response I received from the Customer Support supervisor really pissed
me off. It was so different than any other interaction with Cox, that I was
truly surprised.

He started by rather pompously telling me the firewire ports were
deactivated by a new software download to all set-top boxes.

Then, as we discussed the issue, he rambled a bit about:

- protecting the content of copyright holders
- that the USB and firewire ports being for Cox internal use only
- my attachment of unauthorized devices to the box being a violation
- that this was a "corporate" decision

This supervisor was obviously not surprised by my call. He was aware, in
advance, of the action being taken. While it did not appear that he was
reading a script, he was prepared.

He seemed ill-prepared for my quotation of FCC regulations. At first he
stumbled a bit, then he decided he was safe to hide under the corporate
decision umbrella

> Well, I'm glad you have made progress with Cox. @#$%^&! Time Warner
> > Cable out here in Los Angeles cut off Firewire back in January. It
> > seems that they're using the same coders. :-(
>
> I gave Snider a heads up on the thread here; he says "please do have
> people send me their reports on these problems, in detail; the FCC
> people get 'visibly angry' when they hear these things".
>
> For whatever that's worth. :-)

jsnider [at] 1394ta


I do think that the fear of FCC reprisals is important. Obviously, my email
campaign to Cox Communication executives and managers got attention. While
they did not respond directly, I did get rapid responses from the manager
who oversees all of California and from my local technical support team.

And for what it's worth, also, I concur with those people who say

> "don't cancel your service if you propose to make a fuss; you'll lose
> standing"; they're probably right.
>
>
I agree that I need to remain a customer for now.

However, if Cox was not responsive, my primary concern is to find a way to
keep the MythTV system operational. I've invested a lot of money building
the system and my family is really happy (and dependent) with the results.

Additionally, from my experience as a business manager, I know the most
powerful customers are those who are willing to vote with their dollars -
and who have influence to motivate others to follow. In that vein, whenever
I am unhappy as a customer, I get loud in a public forum, emphasize my
long-term happy customer status, register my present unhappiness and
threaten to take my business elsewhere. It is a very successful formula.

I would strongly recommend this strategy for all of the Time Warner Cable
customers in LA:

- Identify as many Time Warner Cable executives as possible.
Specifically seek those who have regulatory compliance responsibility. The
regulatory executives/managers are key. If the FCC lowers the hammer, these
people could lose their jobs. You may need to make some telephone to
identify the right contacts. Here is a starting point - this web page lists
the three divisional presidents who oversee Southern California and provides
an email address:
http://www.timewarnercable.com/SoCal/AboutUs/socalteam.html
- Make all of your initial contacts with Time Warner in writing.
Emphasize your long-term customer status. Be courteous and professional.
But be very specific about the FCC regulations (quote the CFR that I noted
in my opening post) and their non-compliance. Do not threaten. Instead
assume that some poorly informed person at some lower level in Time Warner
has made a mistake and request their assistance to correct the situation.
- Find out who in the City of Los Angeles oversees the awarding of
cable TV licenses. Never mind, here is a link to the minutes of their April
2007 meeting that shows all of the committee members from Google cache:
http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:w9sNKq1D5boJ:www.lacity.org/ita/bitcminutes/itabitcminutes23645228_04052007.pdf
- Write to all of the above committee members. Explain the situation
to them using the FCC regulations. Again be professional and courteous.
Tell them that you have been unsuccessful in getting this resolved and
request their assistance. Attach a copy of your correspondence to Time
Warner from above.
- Write to the FCC as well. Attach copies of the correspondence with
Time Warner and the city of LA. Ask them to investigate.

Finally, find others and get them to do the same. Avoid form letters. Each
person's correspondence needs to be unique. Boiler plate type
correspondence from customers is an instant turn-off. It creates the
appearance of manipulation by one or a small group - as opposed to a
groundswell of individuals who are upset.

Be persistent. You will succeed.

Good luck.

Tom


beww at beww

Aug 29, 2007, 11:24 AM

Post #16 of 22 (9632 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

Tom Greer wrote:

>
> The response I received from the Customer Support supervisor really
> pissed me off. It was so different than any other interaction with Cox,
> that I was truly surprised.
>
> He started by rather pompously telling me the firewire ports were
> deactivated by a new software download to all set-top boxes.
>
> Then, as we discussed the issue, he rambled a bit about:
>
> * protecting the content of copyright holders

Hmmm... This one is generally a concern of the copyright
holders/Hollywood Types, not CATV operators. I'd guess that language did
not originate with the cable folks.

I wonder if the HWTs are pressuring the cable operators to take these
actions, knowing it will not be them (the HWTs) who get into trouble if
there is a problem.

If you could prove that, can you say "conspiracy" ??

I still say the EFF should be made aware of the situation.

BEWW
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trgreer at gmail

Aug 29, 2007, 11:49 AM

Post #17 of 22 (9620 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

On 8/29/07, Brian Wood <beww [at] beww> wrote:
>
> > Then, as we discussed the issue, he rambled a bit about:
> >
> > * protecting the content of copyright holders
>
> Hmmm... This one is generally a concern of the copyright
> holders/Hollywood Types, not CATV operators. I'd guess that language did
> not originate with the cable folks.
>
> I wonder if the HWTs are pressuring the cable operators to take these
> actions, knowing it will not be them (the HWTs) who get into trouble if
> there is a problem.
>
> If you could prove that, can you say "conspiracy" ??
>
> I still say the EFF should be made aware of the situation.


It is interesting that we are seeing firewire access closed in the Southern
California portions of the Time Warner and Cox Communications organizations.

I don't think that we can prove anything; but I sure can smell it.

Tom


jra at baylink

Aug 29, 2007, 11:53 AM

Post #18 of 22 (9619 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

On Wed, Aug 29, 2007 at 10:51:04AM -0700, Tom Greer wrote:
> On 8/29/07, Jay R. Ashworth <[1]jra [at] baylink> wrote:
> Well, perhaps they need to put out an internal memo that says "please
> don't tell customers incorrect things that will get us shut down by the
> FCC".
>
> The response I received from the Customer Support supervisor really
> pissed me off. It was so different than any other interaction with
> Cox, that I was truly surprised.

Cox is otherwise good? :-)

Ok, ok; RoadRunner business is always good to me in Tampa Bay, too;
maybe it can happen.

> He started by rather pompously telling me the firewire ports were
> deactivated by a new software download to all set-top boxes.
> Then, as we discussed the issue, he rambled a bit about:
> * protecting the content of copyright holders
> * that the USB and firewire ports being for Cox internal use only
> * my attachment of unauthorized devices to the box being a violation
> * that this was a "corporate" decision
>
> This supervisor was obviously not surprised by my call. He was aware, in
> advance, of the action being taken. While it did not appear that he was
> reading a script, he was prepared.

That is odd, indeed. I'd make a point of that in my communications.

> He seemed ill-prepared for my quotation of FCC regulations. At first he
> stumbled a bit, then he decided he was safe to hide under the corporate
> decision umbrella

Hee.

> > Well, I'm glad you have made progress with Cox. @#$%^&! Time Warner
> > Cable out here in Los Angeles cut off Firewire back in January. It
> > seems that they're using the same coders. :-(
> I gave Snider a heads up on the thread here; he says "please do have
> people send me their reports on these problems, in detail; the FCC
> people get 'visibly angry' when they hear these things".
> For whatever that's worth. :-)
>
> [2]jsnider [at] 1394ta
>
> I do think that the fear of FCC reprisals is important. Obviously,
> my email campaign to Cox Communication executives and managers got
> attention. While they did not respond directly, I did get rapid
> responses from the manager who oversees all of California and from
> my local technical support team.

That's a good thing to hear.

> And for what it's worth, also, I concur with those people who say
>
> "don't cancel your service if you propose to make a fuss; you'll lose
> standing"; they're probably right.
>
> I agree that I need to remain a customer for now.
>
> However, if Cox was not responsive, my primary concern is to find
> a way to keep the MythTV system operational. I've invested a lot
> of money building the system and my family is really happy (and
> dependent) with the results. Additionally, from my experience as a
> business manager, I know the most powerful customers are those who
> are willing to vote with their dollars - and who have influence to
> motivate others to follow. In that vein, whenever I am unhappy as
> a customer, I get loud in a public forum, emphasize my long-term
> happy customer status, register my present unhappiness and threaten
> to take my business elsewhere. It is a very successful formula. I
> would strongly recommend this strategy for all of the Time Warner
> Cable customers in LA:

> * Identify as many Time Warner Cable executives as possible.
> Specifically seek those who have regulatory compliance
> responsibility. The regulatory executives/managers are
> key. If the FCC lowers the hammer, these people could
> lose their jobs. You may need to make some telephone to
> identify the right contacts. Here is a starting point -
> this web page lists the three divisional presidents who
> oversee Southern California and provides an email address:
> [3]http://www.timewarnercable.com/SoCal/AboutUs/socalteam.html

> * Make all of your initial contacts with Time Warner in writing.
> Emphasize your long-term customer status. Be courteous and
> professional. But be very specific about the FCC regulations
> (quote the CFR that I noted in my opening post) and their
> non-compliance. Do not threaten. Instead assume that some poorly
> informed person at some lower level in Time Warner has made a
> mistake and request their assistance to correct the situation.

And most importantly, remember this excellent general rule for
confrontational situations:

"The first one who raises their voice, loses."

Treat this as a temporary inconvenience that you're sure comes from
someone's low-level ineptitude, that you're sure will be easily cleared
up as soon as it's escalated to the proper level, and you're likely to
get farther.

Play racquetball; get all that irk and annoyance out first.

> * Write to all of the above committee members. Explain
> the situation to them using the FCC regulations. Again be
> professional and courteous. Tell them that you have been
> unsuccessful in getting this resolved and request their
> assistance. Attach a copy of your correspondence to Time Warner
> from above.

Make sure it's clear to them that this function is important to you and
your family so as to make sure you're receiving all the entertainment
you're paying for. Try to sound as little like a geek as possible;
that people geeky on this sort of thing are opinion leaders tends to go
right past such people and their staffers.

> * Write to the FCC as well. Attach copies of the correspondence
> with Time Warner and the city of LA. Ask them to investigate.

Make sure, in all these cases, that you explain that there *is* an FCC
reg that's being violated, and what it is, and why it's important to
you. People in the trenches may not have the 30,000 foot picture.

> Finally, find others and get them to do the same. Avoid form
> letters. Each person's correspondence needs to be unique. Boiler
> plate type correspondence from customers is an instant turn-off. It
> creates the appearance of manipulation by one or a small group - as
> opposed to a groundswell of individuals who are upset.

Yup. Don't let it look like astroturf.

Cheers,
-- jra
--
Jay R. Ashworth Baylink jra [at] baylink
Designer The Things I Think RFC 2100
Ashworth & Associates http://baylink.pitas.com '87 e24
St Petersburg FL USA http://photo.imageinc.us +1 727 647 1274
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jra at baylink

Aug 29, 2007, 11:53 AM

Post #19 of 22 (9620 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

On Wed, Aug 29, 2007 at 12:24:51PM -0600, Brian Wood wrote:
> > * protecting the content of copyright holders
>
> Hmmm... This one is generally a concern of the copyright
> holders/Hollywood Types, not CATV operators. I'd guess that language did
> not originate with the cable folks.
>
> I wonder if the HWTs are pressuring the cable operators to take these
> actions, knowing it will not be them (the HWTs) who get into trouble if
> there is a problem.
>
> If you could prove that, can you say "conspiracy" ??

"RICO".

"42USC1983".

Cheers,
-- jra
--
Jay R. Ashworth Baylink jra [at] baylink
Designer The Things I Think RFC 2100
Ashworth & Associates http://baylink.pitas.com '87 e24
St Petersburg FL USA http://photo.imageinc.us +1 727 647 1274
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trgreer at gmail

Aug 31, 2007, 1:29 AM

Post #20 of 22 (9596 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

Final update:

A Cox Cable representative called me this afternoon to inform me that their
revised software had been downloaded to my set-top boxes - and that the
firewire ports should be operational again.

As soon as I got home, I checked. Everything looks great again.

Tom


beww at beww

Aug 31, 2007, 6:33 AM

Post #21 of 22 (9586 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

Tom Greer wrote:
> Final update:
>
> A Cox Cable representative called me this afternoon to inform me that
> their revised software had been downloaded to my set-top boxes - and
> that the firewire ports should be operational again.
>
> As soon as I got home, I checked. Everything looks great again.

So, I guess it's time to ask for your credit for the time you were
without the service you were paying for :-)

BEWW
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rcs at malibyte

Aug 31, 2007, 10:45 PM

Post #22 of 22 (9549 views)
Permalink
Re: Cox Communications has turned off Firewire output [In reply to]

Tom Greer wrote:
> On 8/28/07, Bob Sully <rcs [at] malibyte> wrote:
>>
>> Well, I'm glad you have made progress with Cox. @#$%^&! Time Warner
>> Cable
>> out here in Los Angeles cut off Firewire back in January. It seems that
>> they're using the same coders. :-(
>>
>> Anyway, I have two tuner cards in my Myth box but would love to have
>> Firewire back - even if all I get is the same unencrypted channels I get
>> on the raw cable (which is what I got before). It'd be nice to get all
>> the HD channels I pay for, though. Were you getting those with Cox
>> before
>> they cut you off?
>>
>> Bob
>
>
> I was receiving everything except premium and pay-per-view. In other
> words,
> I was getting all of the analog cable channels, all of the digital cable
> channels and all of the HD channels (including local OTA channels plus
> TNT,
> Mojo, Discovery, etc).
>
> If Time Warner is not providing you with a set-top box that provide
> IEEE1394
> compliant firewire output, then I would find out which executive is
> responsible for regulatory compliance and contact them in writing to
> complain. The FCC will direct you to also seek relief from the local
> government organization who licenses them. Apparently, they are
> responsible
> to ensure compliance with FCC regulations. So LA must have a group who
> selects, approves and oversees cable provider(s). Complain to them and
> the
> FCC at the same time and copy both on the correspondence to the other.
>
> After getting the party-line from the local customer support supervisor
> that
> stated clearly that firewire output had been intentionally disabled, and
> then writing calmly and professionally to their regulatoy compliance
> executives and managers, Cox has been very quick to agree that they have
> an
> obligation to provide firewire output on the set-top boxes.
>
> In my last home, I had Time Warner as my Cable TV and Internet provider.
> I
> can tell you that Cox Communications is worlds better. They have always
> been easy to contact, responsive and professional.
>
> Tom
>

Tom and Jay:

Thanks for taking the time to reply. I have a DCT-6200; the Firewire port
was useful as an extra tuner for the unencrypted channels only (but it was
better than nothing). Then they cut it off entirely; now I can only use
the 1394 port to change the channel on the STB to record the s-video
output :-(

I will do as you both have suggested, and start making some noise (will
give Mr. Snider a heads-up and start finding out about who regulated (ha!)
cable providers here in Ventura County) once I get the time after getting
Myth updated.

Too bad we don't have Cox here; it's either Time Warner Cable or the
satellite services (which Myth can't grab HD from). It would be nice to
be able to record all of the HD channels that I pay for.

Bob
--
________________________________________
Bob Sully - Simi Valley, California, USA
http://www.malibyte.net
http://www.malibyte.com

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