Mailing List Archive: MythTV: Users

New User System Setup Questions

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grozio at buffalo

Feb 19, 2003, 8:36 PM

Post #1 of 21 (2477 views)
Permalink

New User System Setup Questions

I am looking at replacing my 30hr Tivo box as the monthly fee has gone
up in the past few months and my box seems to old to get the lifetime
subscription (since they do not carry over if the machine fails). I
stumbled upon MythTV today and found it very intriguing. I was looking
into a similar Windows based setup but think this just has so many
other features and possibilities. I have been reading the archives for
about 2 hours and find it extremely appealing. I had a few questions
before I ditched the Tivo and jumped aboard. Here we go...

1. I currently use medium settings on tivo to record programs and have
no problem with that. Does anyone know the medium setting resolution
on tivo? If so, approximately how many hours in MythTV could a 80gb
hard drive use? (Assuming 70gb available after MP3 and OS)

2. Is it incredibly hard to set up MythTV? I have some linux and unix
experience but not enough to call myself a average user. I like to
tinker so am sure I can figure it out sooner or later, but was just
looking for the general opinion on the matter.

3. I was looking into two setups. The first (higher priced one) would
have a Celeron 2.0ghz w/onboard sound/network. It would have 512mb
PC2100 memory and a 80gb hard drive. The second setup (lower priced)
would have a Athlon 1.4ghz w/onboard sound/network, 256mb PC2100
memory and a 60gb hard drive. Both would be in a BookPC type case with
a ATI TV Wonder and a GeForce2 MX400 w/TVOut 64mb ram (hacked off
metal to fit in the case), a 12x DVD Drive, and a Creative Infra
Remote. Assuming the first setup will run faster, does anyone have any
opinion on the two? Likes or dislikes of the processors?

4. Speaking of processors, which one would run the coolest between the
two? I would assume the celeron. I would like a quiet setup, much like
the current Tivo. Is there another processor I am forgetting that has
an equivalent or higher speed that is cool running?

and finally...

5. With the Celeron 2.0 or Athlon 1.4 I could concievably record a
show at medium quality while watching live TV (pausing and fast
forwarding, etc) correct? Does MythTV give an option for watching a
recorded show while recording a show like Tivo? If so, would I have
the capability with either of those processors to do that?

Thanks for taking the time to read this and help me along the way to
replacing my Tivo. I look forward to tinkering with this and browsing
this forum in the near future. Thanks again.

-D

johnmythtv at crombe

Feb 19, 2003, 10:21 PM

Post #2 of 21 (2428 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

> metal to fit in the case), a 12x DVD Drive, and a Creative Infra
> Remote.

Hi,

I bought a Creative Infra Remote (for like 8 bucks plus shipping) and after
much ado got it working. Here's the scoop:

1) I could only get it working with the included "credit card sized" remote.
That remote has very few keys. I had to play around with it a lot to get
the basic mythtv functions with the limited keys. Now, I'm building a
generic serial infrared receiver and using a purchased Tivo remote (you can
use your existing TiVo remote!). Should be a much better match since that
remote has so many more keys and it's so ergonomic.

2) The Creative remote has limited range (10 feet?) and only uses watch
batteries. I don't trust it for the "long run".

Good luck on your project. I'm an "ex-TiVo" person too and think Myth is
going to be a big step forward.

JC

Plug at BryceCo

Feb 19, 2003, 10:30 PM

Post #3 of 21 (2437 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

Welcome.
1. With my settings 1hr=1.5Gb. It's pretty decent on my monitor but I
don't have TV-Out. At that rate, it'd be 35hrs.
2. No, it is not hard to set-up and the docs are very good.
3. I'm personally partial to AMDs and Athlons but don't let my bias sway
you. The more important of the two, I guess, is the compatibility of
the sound chip with ALSA.
4. AMDs are a bit warm and there's no way to run w/o a fan unless you
like burning processors every 2 minutes (or faster on an AMD Athlon
2100+ XP, not that I have any experience). I have no idea about
celerons other than I don't like them. Again, don't let my bias sway
you.
5. Yes. They both should do fine. There are those here on the lists
playing 2 streams and recording 2 separate streams simultaneously an
systems like mine.
Have fun.

On Wed, 2003-02-19 at 20:36, grozio [at] buffalo wrote:
> I am looking at replacing my 30hr Tivo box as the monthly fee has gone
> up in the past few months and my box seems to old to get the lifetime
> subscription (since they do not carry over if the machine fails). I
> stumbled upon MythTV today and found it very intriguing. I was looking
> into a similar Windows based setup but think this just has so many
> other features and possibilities. I have been reading the archives for
> about 2 hours and find it extremely appealing. I had a few questions
> before I ditched the Tivo and jumped aboard. Here we go...
>
> 1. I currently use medium settings on tivo to record programs and have
> no problem with that. Does anyone know the medium setting resolution
> on tivo? If so, approximately how many hours in MythTV could a 80gb
> hard drive use? (Assuming 70gb available after MP3 and OS)
>
> 2. Is it incredibly hard to set up MythTV? I have some linux and unix
> experience but not enough to call myself a average user. I like to
> tinker so am sure I can figure it out sooner or later, but was just
> looking for the general opinion on the matter.
>
> 3. I was looking into two setups. The first (higher priced one) would
> have a Celeron 2.0ghz w/onboard sound/network. It would have 512mb
> PC2100 memory and a 80gb hard drive. The second setup (lower priced)
> would have a Athlon 1.4ghz w/onboard sound/network, 256mb PC2100
> memory and a 60gb hard drive. Both would be in a BookPC type case with
> a ATI TV Wonder and a GeForce2 MX400 w/TVOut 64mb ram (hacked off
> metal to fit in the case), a 12x DVD Drive, and a Creative Infra
> Remote. Assuming the first setup will run faster, does anyone have any
> opinion on the two? Likes or dislikes of the processors?
>
> 4. Speaking of processors, which one would run the coolest between the
> two? I would assume the celeron. I would like a quiet setup, much like
> the current Tivo. Is there another processor I am forgetting that has
> an equivalent or higher speed that is cool running?
>
> and finally...
>
> 5. With the Celeron 2.0 or Athlon 1.4 I could concievably record a
> show at medium quality while watching live TV (pausing and fast
> forwarding, etc) correct? Does MythTV give an option for watching a
> recorded show while recording a show like Tivo? If so, would I have
> the capability with either of those processors to do that?
>
> Thanks for taking the time to read this and help me along the way to
> replacing my Tivo. I look forward to tinkering with this and browsing
> this forum in the near future. Thanks again.
>
> -D
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] snowman
> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
--
Bryce C <Plug [at] BryceCo>
CoBryce Communications

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cedarmckay at mac

Feb 20, 2003, 12:30 AM

Post #4 of 21 (2430 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

>
> 1. I currently use medium settings on tivo to record programs and have
> no problem with that. Does anyone know the medium setting resolution
> on tivo? If so, approximately how many hours in MythTV could a 80gb
> hard drive use? (Assuming 70gb available after MP3 and OS)
>

googled for this. Can't vouch for accuracy:

Tivo:
Best Quality
544x480
5800.00 kbps
None

High Quality
480x480
3500.00 kbps
SVCD

Medium Quality
352x480
2600.00 kbps
VCD

Basic Quality
352x480
1470.00 kbps
VCD

Many people record at 640x480 which outshines even Tivo's "Best
Quality". I personally use 480x480, 3300 kbps (scaled) and mpg4 quality
setting of 2-12. I couldn't personally tell this apart from 640x480,
but maybe my tv isn't good enough (though it looks great to me!). By
the way, "scaled" means that if you set mythtv to record at 3300 kbps
at 640x480, then back off to 480x480, the bit rate will be reduced
proportionally. Upshot is that if you are recording at 480x480 you are
not really doing 3300 kbps. Anywho, the end result is the picture looks
awesome, much, much better than my friend's Tivo at "medium". You will
not be disappointed. Oh, my files weigh in at 1.1 Gig per hour.

Your question about recording and watching at the same time: I couldn't
tell what exactly you meant. So I'll just tell you how it is. Mythtv
can record one stream per tuner card. It can also play one stream at
the same time (assuming you have backend and frontend on one machine.
"Live" tv is really just recording a stream, and then playing the same
stream right away. So while your tuner is recording a stream you can a)
watch that stream (ie "live" tv), or b)watch a different, prerecorded
stream. Finally, if you have two tuners you can record two streams at a
time and watch one of them, or a different prerecorded stream. That
make sense? My *guess* is that a 2ghz celeron could handle two tuners,
but I'm not sure.

Finally, easy factor: If you are careful to pick motherboards, nics,
sound cards (or a motherboard with those built in) tuners, and graphics
cards carefully they will all pretty much just plug and play. And the
software is pretty easy to install if you carefully follow the docs at
www.mythtv.org/docs/ and you *read every word*. If you don't do enough
research (the lists are a good place to start) before you buy, you will
have to slam your head against the biggest hurdles that people seem to
run into when installing mythtv, namely hardware issues. The four
biggies seem to be sound cards without full duplex support, graphics
cards without xv support, tv-out issues (I use and external converter
that works great) and tuners which auto-detect as the wrong type. Look
over the lists, pick what people have been having good luck with, and
go to town.

best,

cedar

bjm at lvcm

Feb 20, 2003, 2:43 AM

Post #5 of 21 (2435 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

Cedar McKay wrote:

> Many people record at 640x480 which outshines even Tivo's "Best
> Quality". I personally use 480x480, 3300 kbps (scaled) and mpg4 quality
> setting of 2-12. I couldn't personally tell this apart from 640x480, but
> maybe my tv isn't good enough (though it looks great to me!).

Cedar, your TV and eyes are fine ;-). It's broadcast TV
that isn't so good. Decades of engineering have gone into
making all sorts of problems acceptable to a certain
tolerance. The result is that we are all fooled into thinking
that the signal must be good and would look better with a
better TV. It won't!

640x480 sounds like it should be better than 544x480 but if
you recorded broadcast TV and did a side by side test it
would be hard to tell which was which. However, if you had
a very clean source like a digital channel from a digital
cable box over s-video or a DVD player over s-video, then
you would see a difference at higher capture resolutions.

I've always assumed that the commercial products limit
themselves to lower resolutions because higher resolution
eats more disk space for little, if any, visible difference.
Recording capacity is the ONLY issue for model number/price
of commercial products. Yet, on the MythTV lists, this is
one of the few threads in months that even mentions disk
space efficiency.

-- bjm

grozio at buffalo

Feb 20, 2003, 9:13 AM

Post #6 of 21 (2417 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

Thanks for the info so far! I think I am going to drop the creative
infra remote and go with the ATI Remote Wonder, unless anyone else has
another suggestion. I also think I am going to drop the 2.0ghz Celeron
in exchange for a AMD 1800+ tbred core. Hopefully that will run cooler
or at least as cool. If need be I can always downclock it a bit. In
response to:

>Your question about recording and watching at the same time: I couldn't
>tell what exactly you meant. So I'll just tell you how it is. Mythtv
>can record one stream per tuner card. It can also play one stream at
>the same time (assuming you have backend and frontend on one machine.
>"Live" tv is really just recording a stream, and then playing the same
>stream right away. So while your tuner is recording a stream you can a)
>watch that stream (ie "live" tv), or b)watch a different, prerecorded
>stream. Finally, if you have two tuners you can record two streams at a
>time and watch one of them, or a different prerecorded stream. That
>make sense? My *guess* is that a 2ghz celeron could handle two tuners,
>but I'm not sure.

I am not really looking to do 2 TV tuners. What I was wondering about
is if I am recording a show at say 8:00 - 9:00 can I start watching a
previously recorded show at 8:15 while the other show is recording?
Would a AMD 1800+ be able to handle both at once? Was wondering how
much luck others have had on the board. I would be recording probably
at 480x480.

If anyone else has any suggestions or comments please let me know, this
really is helping me out a lot. Thanks again.

-D

micah at oregontech

Feb 20, 2003, 10:01 AM

Post #7 of 21 (2436 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

Before reading this, note: I have never gotten mythtv working and have
only once tried to with my Pinnacle BTTV card... So, here's what I've been
gathering over the last couple months of viewing this list.

I see TONS of people complain about their ATI All-In-Wonder cards....
1) They can't record and playback at the same time...
2) there are tons of auto-detection problems
3) the VE model seems to be more problematic than others.

I don't see any problems with Hauppauge cards... everybody seems to have
really good luck with those. I'm wondering what peoples opinions are with
these cards - what problems do they have, if any?

As for TV-Out, my GeForce2 MX400 has excellent TV-Out and was super-easy
to set up... Why do people fuss with matrox g200/400/450 cards when there
is such a cheap alternative? is it because the g200 has a tv-tuner? Can
it record and playback at the same time?

Thats all I have for now... :)

--Micah

> Thanks for the info so far! I think I am going to drop the creative
> infra remote and go with the ATI Remote Wonder, unless anyone else has
> another suggestion. I also think I am going to drop the 2.0ghz Celeron
> in exchange for a AMD 1800+ tbred core. Hopefully that will run cooler
> or at least as cool. If need be I can always downclock it a bit. In
> response to:
>
>>Your question about recording and watching at the same time: I couldn't
>> tell what exactly you meant. So I'll just tell you how it is. Mythtv
>> can record one stream per tuner card. It can also play one stream at
>> the same time (assuming you have backend and frontend on one machine.
>> "Live" tv is really just recording a stream, and then playing the same
>> stream right away. So while your tuner is recording a stream you can a)
>> watch that stream (ie "live" tv), or b)watch a different, prerecorded
>> stream. Finally, if you have two tuners you can record two streams at a
>> time and watch one of them, or a different prerecorded stream. That
>> make sense? My *guess* is that a 2ghz celeron could handle two tuners,
>> but I'm not sure.
>
> I am not really looking to do 2 TV tuners. What I was wondering about
> is if I am recording a show at say 8:00 - 9:00 can I start watching a
> previously recorded show at 8:15 while the other show is recording?
> Would a AMD 1800+ be able to handle both at once? Was wondering how
> much luck others have had on the board. I would be recording probably
> at 480x480.
>
> If anyone else has any suggestions or comments please let me know, this
> really is helping me out a lot. Thanks again.
>
> -D
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] snowman
> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

bvance at egenera

Feb 20, 2003, 10:30 AM

Post #8 of 21 (2433 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

> I am not really looking to do 2 TV tuners. What I was wondering about
> is if I am recording a show at say 8:00 - 9:00 can I start watching a
> previously recorded show at 8:15 while the other show is recording?

Yes you can do this. In addition if you are recording a show from
8:00-9:00, you can start watching that show, from the beginning, at
8:15.

This is basically the same as watching Live TV. As for hardware
performance, if you've tuned your system do do LiveTV smoothly you
should have no problem watching any pre-recorded shows while recording
another.

-Beev

webmaster at permutation

Feb 20, 2003, 11:14 AM

Post #9 of 21 (2400 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

Hauppauge cards are great. I had absolutely no problems with mine, worked
the first time, every time. I'm waiting on my WinTV 401 dbx-fm card to
come in, my current hauppauge card has problems with channels 6-11. I
don't believe this is because the card, but rather some issue with digital
cable at a former residence burning it up a little. I'll post once I have
the new one installed.
--
Jason Ramey
webmaster [at] permutation

> Before reading this, note: I have never gotten mythtv working and have
> only once tried to with my Pinnacle BTTV card... So, here's what I've been
> gathering over the last couple months of viewing this list.
>
> I see TONS of people complain about their ATI All-In-Wonder cards....
> 1) They can't record and playback at the same time...
> 2) there are tons of auto-detection problems
> 3) the VE model seems to be more problematic than others.
>
> I don't see any problems with Hauppauge cards... everybody seems to have
> really good luck with those. I'm wondering what peoples opinions are with
> these cards - what problems do they have, if any?
>
> As for TV-Out, my GeForce2 MX400 has excellent TV-Out and was super-easy
> to set up... Why do people fuss with matrox g200/400/450 cards when there
> is such a cheap alternative? is it because the g200 has a tv-tuner? Can
> it record and playback at the same time?
>
> Thats all I have for now... :)
>
> --Micah
>
>> Thanks for the info so far! I think I am going to drop the creative
>> infra remote and go with the ATI Remote Wonder, unless anyone else has
>> another suggestion. I also think I am going to drop the 2.0ghz Celeron
>> in exchange for a AMD 1800+ tbred core. Hopefully that will run cooler
>> or at least as cool. If need be I can always downclock it a bit. In
>> response to:
>>
>>>Your question about recording and watching at the same time: I couldn't
>>> tell what exactly you meant. So I'll just tell you how it is. Mythtv
>>> can record one stream per tuner card. It can also play one stream at
>>> the same time (assuming you have backend and frontend on one machine.
>>> "Live" tv is really just recording a stream, and then playing the same
>>> stream right away. So while your tuner is recording a stream you can a)
>>> watch that stream (ie "live" tv), or b)watch a different, prerecorded
>>> stream. Finally, if you have two tuners you can record two streams at a
>>> time and watch one of them, or a different prerecorded stream. That
>>> make sense? My *guess* is that a 2ghz celeron could handle two tuners,
>>> but I'm not sure.
>>
>> I am not really looking to do 2 TV tuners. What I was wondering about
>> is if I am recording a show at say 8:00 - 9:00 can I start watching a
>> previously recorded show at 8:15 while the other show is recording?
>> Would a AMD 1800+ be able to handle both at once? Was wondering how
>> much luck others have had on the board. I would be recording probably
>> at 480x480.
>>
>> If anyone else has any suggestions or comments please let me know, this
>> really is helping me out a lot. Thanks again.
>>
>> -D
>> _______________________________________________
>> mythtv-users mailing list
>> mythtv-users [at] snowman
>> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] snowman
> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>

santellij at yahoo

Feb 20, 2003, 11:34 AM

Post #10 of 21 (2407 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

I am trying to put together a machine for MythTV and
have the ATI Wonder VE. I have yet to have everything
running (other issues). Should I be concerned about
this car and return it? (running RH 8.0 but that
could change at any time)

I also noticed that the Hauppauge cards were listed as
"125-channel Tvtuners" Does this mean I will only be
able to watch up to 125? If so, will I have the same
issue with the card I have?

thanks
josh

--- Jason Ramey <webmaster [at] permutation> wrote:
> Hauppauge cards are great. I had absolutely no
> problems with mine, worked
> the first time, every time. I'm waiting on my WinTV
> 401 dbx-fm card to
> come in, my current hauppauge card has problems with
> channels 6-11. I
> don't believe this is because the card, but rather
> some issue with digital
> cable at a former residence burning it up a little.
> I'll post once I have
> the new one installed.
> --
> Jason Ramey
> webmaster [at] permutation
>
>
> > Before reading this, note: I have never gotten
> mythtv working and have
> > only once tried to with my Pinnacle BTTV card...
> So, here's what I've been
> > gathering over the last couple months of viewing
> this list.
> >
> > I see TONS of people complain about their ATI
> All-In-Wonder cards....
> > 1) They can't record and playback at the same
> time...
> > 2) there are tons of auto-detection problems
> > 3) the VE model seems to be more problematic
> than others.
> >
> > I don't see any problems with Hauppauge cards...
> everybody seems to have
> > really good luck with those. I'm wondering what
> peoples opinions are with
> > these cards - what problems do they have, if any?
> >
> > As for TV-Out, my GeForce2 MX400 has excellent
> TV-Out and was super-easy
> > to set up... Why do people fuss with matrox
> g200/400/450 cards when there
> > is such a cheap alternative? is it because the
> g200 has a tv-tuner? Can
> > it record and playback at the same time?
> >
> > Thats all I have for now... :)
> >
> > --Micah
> >
> >> Thanks for the info so far! I think I am going to
> drop the creative
> >> infra remote and go with the ATI Remote Wonder,
> unless anyone else has
> >> another suggestion. I also think I am going to
> drop the 2.0ghz Celeron
> >> in exchange for a AMD 1800+ tbred core. Hopefully
> that will run cooler
> >> or at least as cool. If need be I can always
> downclock it a bit. In
> >> response to:
> >>
> >>>Your question about recording and watching at the
> same time: I couldn't
> >>> tell what exactly you meant. So I'll just tell
> you how it is. Mythtv
> >>> can record one stream per tuner card. It can
> also play one stream at
> >>> the same time (assuming you have backend and
> frontend on one machine.
> >>> "Live" tv is really just recording a stream, and
> then playing the same
> >>> stream right away. So while your tuner is
> recording a stream you can a)
> >>> watch that stream (ie "live" tv), or b)watch a
> different, prerecorded
> >>> stream. Finally, if you have two tuners you can
> record two streams at a
> >>> time and watch one of them, or a different
> prerecorded stream. That
> >>> make sense? My *guess* is that a 2ghz celeron
> could handle two tuners,
> >>> but I'm not sure.
> >>
> >> I am not really looking to do 2 TV tuners. What I
> was wondering about
> >> is if I am recording a show at say 8:00 - 9:00
> can I start watching a
> >> previously recorded show at 8:15 while the other
> show is recording?
> >> Would a AMD 1800+ be able to handle both at once?
> Was wondering how
> >> much luck others have had on the board. I would
> be recording probably
> >> at 480x480.
> >>
> >> If anyone else has any suggestions or comments
> please let me know, this
> >> really is helping me out a lot. Thanks again.
> >>
> >> -D
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> mythtv-users mailing list
> >> mythtv-users [at] snowman
> >>
> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > mythtv-users mailing list
> > mythtv-users [at] snowman
> >
> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] snowman
> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

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mark at lorimarksolutions

Feb 20, 2003, 11:43 AM

Post #11 of 21 (2434 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

Choosing the "right" tuner card certainly must be an important issue.
Even for simpler "garden variety" (office type, general purpose)
computers strange problems can develop with hardware mixing and
matching. But, for me, what I did was refer to the
http://www.goldfish.org/~mcooper/pvrhw/stats.html site. Listed at the
top is the TV Wonder. Hauppage doesn't even show up in the top 5. So I
avoided the Hauppage entirely.

As a newbie I'm clueless about alot of these techonolgies - high
performance graphics, cpu's, tuners, ir devices... So much has changed
over the years (from the old z80 days). It's still difficult to read
through even this group and sort the chaff from the jewels. I've
finally settled on a Leadtech TV2000. Why? because someone else said
it worked for them. Mine isn't here yet. I'm keeping my fingers
crossed. I have *no clue* if it's going to work at all.

What I'm going to try to do, in my
http://www.lorimarksolutions.com/MythTv/Marks_LinTV_Project.html
project, is try to make some logical sense of all the components
(software and hardware) block them out, explain them if I can, and,
hopefully have some steering for those looking to get started on their own.

I had never considered heat issues as it pertains to cpu's and
performance and dropping frames. I never heard of anything that shuts
components of the cpu down if it detects that it's overheating. I think
that's pretty neat and I'm going to try to learn more about that as
well, because I notice that when I get into the bios on my via epia-m
board, it has a screen where it will indicate the fan rpm, and cpu
temperatures. That's cool. Does anyone happen to know how to get at
those kinds of values from Linux?

But, things like that, cpu temp, are the kinds of things I'm going to
try to cover in that page I'm working on.

Thanks for listening. Thanks for the great project.

Micah Morton wrote:
> Before reading this, note: I have never gotten mythtv working and have
> only once tried to with my Pinnacle BTTV card... So, here's what I've been
> gathering over the last couple months of viewing this list.
>
> I see TONS of people complain about their ATI All-In-Wonder cards....
> 1) They can't record and playback at the same time...
> 2) there are tons of auto-detection problems
> 3) the VE model seems to be more problematic than others.
>
> I don't see any problems with Hauppauge cards... everybody seems to have
> really good luck with those. I'm wondering what peoples opinions are with
> these cards - what problems do they have, if any?
>
> As for TV-Out, my GeForce2 MX400 has excellent TV-Out and was super-easy
> to set up... Why do people fuss with matrox g200/400/450 cards when there
> is such a cheap alternative? is it because the g200 has a tv-tuner? Can
> it record and playback at the same time?
>

micah at oregontech

Feb 20, 2003, 11:55 AM

Post #12 of 21 (2419 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

As far as I know.. ALL tuner cards only go up to 125 channels.. To obtain
higher channels, you must hook the card up to a digital cable box or
sattelite reciever and change the tuner card to channel 3 or 4 or
whatever..

> I am trying to put together a machine for MythTV and
> have the ATI Wonder VE. I have yet to have everything
> running (other issues). Should I be concerned about
> this car and return it? (running RH 8.0 but that
> could change at any time)
>
> I also noticed that the Hauppauge cards were listed as
> "125-channel Tvtuners" Does this mean I will only be
> able to watch up to 125? If so, will I have the same
> issue with the card I have?
>
> thanks
> josh
>
> --- Jason Ramey <webmaster [at] permutation> wrote:
>> Hauppauge cards are great. I had absolutely no
>> problems with mine, worked
>> the first time, every time. I'm waiting on my WinTV
>> 401 dbx-fm card to
>> come in, my current hauppauge card has problems with
>> channels 6-11. I
>> don't believe this is because the card, but rather
>> some issue with digital
>> cable at a former residence burning it up a little.
>> I'll post once I have
>> the new one installed.
>> --
>> Jason Ramey
>> webmaster [at] permutation
>>
>>
>> > Before reading this, note: I have never gotten
>> mythtv working and have
>> > only once tried to with my Pinnacle BTTV card...
>> So, here's what I've been
>> > gathering over the last couple months of viewing
>> this list.
>> >
>> > I see TONS of people complain about their ATI
>> All-In-Wonder cards....
>> > 1) They can't record and playback at the same
>> time...
>> > 2) there are tons of auto-detection problems
>> > 3) the VE model seems to be more problematic
>> than others.
>> >
>> > I don't see any problems with Hauppauge cards...
>> everybody seems to have
>> > really good luck with those. I'm wondering what
>> peoples opinions are with
>> > these cards - what problems do they have, if any?
>> >
>> > As for TV-Out, my GeForce2 MX400 has excellent
>> TV-Out and was super-easy
>> > to set up... Why do people fuss with matrox
>> g200/400/450 cards when there
>> > is such a cheap alternative? is it because the
>> g200 has a tv-tuner? Can
>> > it record and playback at the same time?
>> >
>> > Thats all I have for now... :)
>> >
>> > --Micah
>> >
>> >> Thanks for the info so far! I think I am going to
>> drop the creative
>> >> infra remote and go with the ATI Remote Wonder,
>> unless anyone else has
>> >> another suggestion. I also think I am going to
>> drop the 2.0ghz Celeron
>> >> in exchange for a AMD 1800+ tbred core. Hopefully
>> that will run cooler
>> >> or at least as cool. If need be I can always
>> downclock it a bit. In
>> >> response to:
>> >>
>> >>>Your question about recording and watching at the
>> same time: I couldn't
>> >>> tell what exactly you meant. So I'll just tell
>> you how it is. Mythtv
>> >>> can record one stream per tuner card. It can
>> also play one stream at
>> >>> the same time (assuming you have backend and
>> frontend on one machine.
>> >>> "Live" tv is really just recording a stream, and
>> then playing the same
>> >>> stream right away. So while your tuner is
>> recording a stream you can a)
>> >>> watch that stream (ie "live" tv), or b)watch a
>> different, prerecorded
>> >>> stream. Finally, if you have two tuners you can
>> record two streams at a
>> >>> time and watch one of them, or a different
>> prerecorded stream. That
>> >>> make sense? My *guess* is that a 2ghz celeron
>> could handle two tuners,
>> >>> but I'm not sure.
>> >>
>> >> I am not really looking to do 2 TV tuners. What I
>> was wondering about
>> >> is if I am recording a show at say 8:00 - 9:00
>> can I start watching a
>> >> previously recorded show at 8:15 while the other
>> show is recording?
>> >> Would a AMD 1800+ be able to handle both at once?
>> Was wondering how
>> >> much luck others have had on the board. I would
>> be recording probably
>> >> at 480x480.
>> >>
>> >> If anyone else has any suggestions or comments
>> please let me know, this
>> >> really is helping me out a lot. Thanks again.
>> >>
>> >> -D
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> mythtv-users mailing list
>> >> mythtv-users [at] snowman
>> >>
>> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > mythtv-users mailing list
>> > mythtv-users [at] snowman
>> >
>> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>> >
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> mythtv-users mailing list
>> mythtv-users [at] snowman
>> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] snowman
> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

gtgj at pacbell

Feb 20, 2003, 12:25 PM

Post #13 of 21 (2399 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

>>>>> On Thu, 20 Feb 2003 12:43:25 -0600, Mark Petryk <mark [at] lorimarksolutions> said:

m> Choosing the "right" tuner card certainly must be an important
m> issue. Even for simpler "garden variety" (office type, general
m> purpose) computers strange problems can develop with hardware mixing
m> and matching. But, for me, what I did was refer to the
m> http://www.goldfish.org/~mcooper/pvrhw/stats.html site. Listed at the
m> top is the TV Wonder. Hauppage doesn't even show up in the top 5. So
m> I avoided the Hauppage entirely.

No, the Hauppauge cards are just listed under a lot of
different names (WinTV variants). It looks like there's more than 25
people using these cards in the table.
--
Gregorio Gervasio, Jr.
gtgj [at] pacbell

webmaster at permutation

Feb 20, 2003, 12:39 PM

Post #14 of 21 (2426 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

I concur. Most TVs are like this too, I think...
--
Jason Ramey
webmaster [at] permutation

> As far as I know.. ALL tuner cards only go up to 125 channels.. To obtain
> higher channels, you must hook the card up to a digital cable box or
> sattelite reciever and change the tuner card to channel 3 or 4 or
> whatever..
>
>
>> I am trying to put together a machine for MythTV and
>> have the ATI Wonder VE. I have yet to have everything
>> running (other issues). Should I be concerned about
>> this car and return it? (running RH 8.0 but that
>> could change at any time)
>>
>> I also noticed that the Hauppauge cards were listed as
>> "125-channel Tvtuners" Does this mean I will only be
>> able to watch up to 125? If so, will I have the same
>> issue with the card I have?
>>
>> thanks
>> josh
>>
>> --- Jason Ramey <webmaster [at] permutation> wrote:
>>> Hauppauge cards are great. I had absolutely no
>>> problems with mine, worked
>>> the first time, every time. I'm waiting on my WinTV
>>> 401 dbx-fm card to
>>> come in, my current hauppauge card has problems with
>>> channels 6-11. I
>>> don't believe this is because the card, but rather
>>> some issue with digital
>>> cable at a former residence burning it up a little.
>>> I'll post once I have
>>> the new one installed.
>>> --
>>> Jason Ramey
>>> webmaster [at] permutation
>>>
>>>
>>> > Before reading this, note: I have never gotten
>>> mythtv working and have
>>> > only once tried to with my Pinnacle BTTV card...
>>> So, here's what I've been
>>> > gathering over the last couple months of viewing
>>> this list.
>>> >
>>> > I see TONS of people complain about their ATI
>>> All-In-Wonder cards....
>>> > 1) They can't record and playback at the same
>>> time...
>>> > 2) there are tons of auto-detection problems
>>> > 3) the VE model seems to be more problematic
>>> than others.
>>> >
>>> > I don't see any problems with Hauppauge cards...
>>> everybody seems to have
>>> > really good luck with those. I'm wondering what
>>> peoples opinions are with
>>> > these cards - what problems do they have, if any?
>>> >
>>> > As for TV-Out, my GeForce2 MX400 has excellent
>>> TV-Out and was super-easy
>>> > to set up... Why do people fuss with matrox
>>> g200/400/450 cards when there
>>> > is such a cheap alternative? is it because the
>>> g200 has a tv-tuner? Can
>>> > it record and playback at the same time?
>>> >
>>> > Thats all I have for now... :)
>>> >
>>> > --Micah
>>> >
>>> >> Thanks for the info so far! I think I am going to
>>> drop the creative
>>> >> infra remote and go with the ATI Remote Wonder,
>>> unless anyone else has
>>> >> another suggestion. I also think I am going to
>>> drop the 2.0ghz Celeron
>>> >> in exchange for a AMD 1800+ tbred core. Hopefully
>>> that will run cooler
>>> >> or at least as cool. If need be I can always
>>> downclock it a bit. In
>>> >> response to:
>>> >>
>>> >>>Your question about recording and watching at the
>>> same time: I couldn't
>>> >>> tell what exactly you meant. So I'll just tell
>>> you how it is. Mythtv
>>> >>> can record one stream per tuner card. It can
>>> also play one stream at
>>> >>> the same time (assuming you have backend and
>>> frontend on one machine.
>>> >>> "Live" tv is really just recording a stream, and
>>> then playing the same
>>> >>> stream right away. So while your tuner is
>>> recording a stream you can a)
>>> >>> watch that stream (ie "live" tv), or b)watch a
>>> different, prerecorded
>>> >>> stream. Finally, if you have two tuners you can
>>> record two streams at a
>>> >>> time and watch one of them, or a different
>>> prerecorded stream. That
>>> >>> make sense? My *guess* is that a 2ghz celeron
>>> could handle two tuners,
>>> >>> but I'm not sure.
>>> >>
>>> >> I am not really looking to do 2 TV tuners. What I
>>> was wondering about
>>> >> is if I am recording a show at say 8:00 - 9:00
>>> can I start watching a
>>> >> previously recorded show at 8:15 while the other
>>> show is recording?
>>> >> Would a AMD 1800+ be able to handle both at once?
>>> Was wondering how
>>> >> much luck others have had on the board. I would
>>> be recording probably
>>> >> at 480x480.
>>> >>
>>> >> If anyone else has any suggestions or comments
>>> please let me know, this
>>> >> really is helping me out a lot. Thanks again.
>>> >>
>>> >> -D
>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>> >> mythtv-users mailing list
>>> >> mythtv-users [at] snowman
>>> >>
>>> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > _______________________________________________
>>> > mythtv-users mailing list
>>> > mythtv-users [at] snowman
>>> >
>>> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>>> >
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> mythtv-users mailing list
>>> mythtv-users [at] snowman
>>> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>>
>>
>> __________________________________________________
>> Do you Yahoo!?
>> Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more
>> http://taxes.yahoo.com/
>> _______________________________________________
>> mythtv-users mailing list
>> mythtv-users [at] snowman
>> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] snowman
> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>

micah at oregontech

Feb 20, 2003, 12:52 PM

Post #15 of 21 (2440 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

> I had never considered heat issues as it pertains to cpu's and
> performance and dropping frames. I never heard of anything that shuts
> components of the cpu down if it detects that it's overheating. I think
> that's pretty neat and I'm going to try to learn more about that as
> well, because I notice that when I get into the bios on my via epia-m
> board, it has a screen where it will indicate the fan rpm, and cpu
> temperatures. That's cool. Does anyone happen to know how to get at
> those kinds of values from Linux?

----
Check out the lm_sensors project. http://www2.lm-sensors.nu/~lm78/

>
> But, things like that, cpu temp, are the kinds of things I'm going to
> try to cover in that page I'm working on.
>
> Thanks for listening. Thanks for the great project.
>
>
>
> Micah Morton wrote:
>> Before reading this, note: I have never gotten mythtv working and have
>> only once tried to with my Pinnacle BTTV card... So, here's what I've
>> been gathering over the last couple months of viewing this list.
>>
>> I see TONS of people complain about their ATI All-In-Wonder cards....
>> 1) They can't record and playback at the same time...
>> 2) there are tons of auto-detection problems
>> 3) the VE model seems to be more problematic than others.
>>
>> I don't see any problems with Hauppauge cards... everybody seems to
>> have really good luck with those. I'm wondering what peoples opinions
>> are with these cards - what problems do they have, if any?
>>
>> As for TV-Out, my GeForce2 MX400 has excellent TV-Out and was
>> super-easy to set up... Why do people fuss with matrox g200/400/450
>> cards when there is such a cheap alternative? is it because the g200
>> has a tv-tuner? Can it record and playback at the same time?
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] snowman
> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

dhubbard at dwightandamy

Feb 20, 2003, 2:12 PM

Post #16 of 21 (2417 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

> Choosing the "right" tuner card certainly must be an important issue.
> Even for simpler "garden variety" (office type, general purpose)
> computers strange problems can develop with hardware mixing and
> matching. But, for me, what I did was refer to the
> http://www.goldfish.org/~mcooper/pvrhw/stats.html site. Listed at the
> top is the TV Wonder. Hauppage doesn't even show up in the top 5. So I
> avoided the Hauppage entirely.

Hauppage is the manufacturer of the WinTV and WinTV go cards that where
number 2 and number 4.

jrjjh_4 at comcast

Feb 20, 2003, 3:47 PM

Post #17 of 21 (2417 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

I am running RH 8.0 and have not had any problems with my ATI TV Wonder
VE.

j.hoevertsz

----- Original Message -----
From: Joshua Santelli <santellij [at] yahoo>
Date: Thursday, February 20, 2003 10:34 am
Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] New User System Setup Questions

> I am trying to put together a machine for MythTV and
> have the ATI Wonder VE. I have yet to have everything
> running (other issues). Should I be concerned about
> this car and return it? (running RH 8.0 but that
> could change at any time)
>
> I also noticed that the Hauppauge cards were listed as
> "125-channel Tvtuners" Does this mean I will only be
> able to watch up to 125? If so, will I have the same
> issue with the card I have?
>
> thanks
> josh
>
> --- Jason Ramey <webmaster [at] permutation> wrote:
> > Hauppauge cards are great. I had absolutely no
> > problems with mine, worked
> > the first time, every time. I'm waiting on my WinTV
> > 401 dbx-fm card to
> > come in, my current hauppauge card has problems with
> > channels 6-11. I
> > don't believe this is because the card, but rather
> > some issue with digital
> > cable at a former residence burning it up a little.
> > I'll post once I have
> > the new one installed.
> > --
> > Jason Ramey
> > webmaster [at] permutation
> >
> >
> > > Before reading this, note: I have never gotten
> > mythtv working and have
> > > only once tried to with my Pinnacle BTTV card...
> > So, here's what I've been
> > > gathering over the last couple months of viewing
> > this list.
> > >
> > > I see TONS of people complain about their ATI
> > All-In-Wonder cards....
> > > 1) They can't record and playback at the same
> > time...
> > > 2) there are tons of auto-detection problems
> > > 3) the VE model seems to be more problematic
> > than others.
> > >
> > > I don't see any problems with Hauppauge cards...
> > everybody seems to have
> > > really good luck with those. I'm wondering what
> > peoples opinions are with
> > > these cards - what problems do they have, if any?
> > >
> > > As for TV-Out, my GeForce2 MX400 has excellent
> > TV-Out and was super-easy
> > > to set up... Why do people fuss with matrox
> > g200/400/450 cards when there
> > > is such a cheap alternative? is it because the
> > g200 has a tv-tuner? Can
> > > it record and playback at the same time?
> > >
> > > Thats all I have for now... :)
> > >
> > > --Micah
> > >
> > >> Thanks for the info so far! I think I am going to
> > drop the creative
> > >> infra remote and go with the ATI Remote Wonder,
> > unless anyone else has
> > >> another suggestion. I also think I am going to
> > drop the 2.0ghz Celeron
> > >> in exchange for a AMD 1800+ tbred core. Hopefully
> > that will run cooler
> > >> or at least as cool. If need be I can always
> > downclock it a bit. In
> > >> response to:
> > >>
> > >>>Your question about recording and watching at the
> > same time: I couldn't
> > >>> tell what exactly you meant. So I'll just tell
> > you how it is. Mythtv
> > >>> can record one stream per tuner card. It can
> > also play one stream at
> > >>> the same time (assuming you have backend and
> > frontend on one machine.
> > >>> "Live" tv is really just recording a stream, and
> > then playing the same
> > >>> stream right away. So while your tuner is
> > recording a stream you can a)
> > >>> watch that stream (ie "live" tv), or b)watch a
> > different, prerecorded
> > >>> stream. Finally, if you have two tuners you can
> > record two streams at a
> > >>> time and watch one of them, or a different
> > prerecorded stream. That
> > >>> make sense? My *guess* is that a 2ghz celeron
> > could handle two tuners,
> > >>> but I'm not sure.
> > >>
> > >> I am not really looking to do 2 TV tuners. What I
> > was wondering about
> > >> is if I am recording a show at say 8:00 - 9:00
> > can I start watching a
> > >> previously recorded show at 8:15 while the other
> > show is recording?
> > >> Would a AMD 1800+ be able to handle both at once?
> > Was wondering how
> > >> much luck others have had on the board. I would
> > be recording probably
> > >> at 480x480.
> > >>
> > >> If anyone else has any suggestions or comments
> > please let me know, this
> > >> really is helping me out a lot. Thanks again.
> > >>
> > >> -D
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> mythtv-users mailing list
> > >> mythtv-users [at] snowman
> > >>
> > http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > mythtv-users mailing list
> > > mythtv-users [at] snowman
> > >
> > http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > mythtv-users mailing list
> > mythtv-users [at] snowman
> > http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] snowman
> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>

grozio at buffalo

Feb 21, 2003, 6:10 AM

Post #18 of 21 (2424 views)
Permalink

Re:New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

Ok just a few more short questions and I am done, promise. What is the
most common distro everyone runs? Seems to be Red Hat 8, correct? Is
MythTV stable enough to keep on 24/7 only being controlled by remote
(no keyboard/mouse)? And finally...Is there a volume control in the
software itself where you can configure the volume buttons on a remote?
This would be great if I could hook up external PC-like speakers and
control the volume through that, would sound better than TVs speakers.
Thanks again to everyone for their help.

-D

webmaster at permutation

Feb 21, 2003, 7:01 AM

Post #19 of 21 (2400 views)
Permalink

Re: Re:New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

Can't speak for the distro preference, I run mine on Debian, 24/7. As for
the volume controls, that was actually just added into the CVS last night.
Works great, binds volume to the [ and ] keys. Provides an onscreen
display and everything.

--
Jason Ramey
webmaster [at] permutation

> Ok just a few more short questions and I am done, promise. What is the
> most common distro everyone runs? Seems to be Red Hat 8, correct? Is
> MythTV stable enough to keep on 24/7 only being controlled by remote
> (no keyboard/mouse)? And finally...Is there a volume control in the
> software itself where you can configure the volume buttons on a remote?
> This would be great if I could hook up external PC-like speakers and
> control the volume through that, would sound better than TVs speakers.
> Thanks again to everyone for their help.
>
> -D
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] snowman
> http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>

aburden at onegeeksopinion

Feb 21, 2003, 8:05 AM

Post #20 of 21 (2411 views)
Permalink

RE: Re:New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

I have mine running on Mandrake 9, and it is has been up 24/7 for a few
weeks now. Humming like a dream. I am working on lowering the noise.
Just put in a geforce4 with no fan. Picking up a quiet cpu fan today.

Cheers...

Some notes I have.
http://www.onegeeksopinion.com/nucleus/index.php?itemid=2

-----Original Message-----
From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] snowman
[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] snowman] On Behalf Of
grozio [at] buffalo
Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 5:11 AM
To: mythtv-users [at] snowman
Subject: [mythtv-users] Re:New User System Setup Questions

Ok just a few more short questions and I am done, promise. What is the
most common distro everyone runs? Seems to be Red Hat 8, correct? Is
MythTV stable enough to keep on 24/7 only being controlled by remote
(no keyboard/mouse)? And finally...Is there a volume control in the
software itself where you can configure the volume buttons on a remote?
This would be great if I could hook up external PC-like speakers and
control the volume through that, would sound better than TVs speakers.
Thanks again to everyone for their help.

-D
_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users [at] snowman
http://www.snowman.net/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

thczv at haddockfamily

Feb 21, 2003, 4:05 PM

Post #21 of 21 (2418 views)
Permalink

Re: New User System Setup Questions [In reply to]

> Finally, easy factor: If you are careful to pick
> motherboards, nics, sound cards (or a motherboard with
> those built in) tuners, and graphics cards carefully they will
> all pretty much just plug and play. And the software is
> pretty easy to install if you carefully follow the docs at
> www.mythtv.org/docs/ and you *read every word*. If you
> don't do enough research (the lists are a good place to
> start) before you buy, you will have to slam your head
> against the biggest hurdles that people seem to run into
> when installing mythtv, namely hardware issues. The four
> biggies seem to be sound cards without full duplex support,
> graphics cards without xv support, tv-out issues (I use and
> external converter that works great) and tuners which auto-
> detect as the wrong type. Look over the lists, pick what
> people have been having good luck with, and go to town.

These sound like really good reasons to describe some sort of
reference hardware platform. For me, being fairly new to linux,
it would be very helpful to see a list of devices that are as
close to a sure thing as can be.

--davidh

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