Mailing List Archive: MythTV: Users

PVR-350 output support being dropped!

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llcooljeff at gmail

Mar 22, 2006, 9:15 AM

Post #1 of 35 (5571 views)
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PVR-350 output support being dropped!

I just happened to read through the bug reports and found this:

http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/745

It says that PVR-350 output support will likely be dropped from later
releases of MythTV due to a lack of developers who want to maintain it.

Just a heads up for anyone who owns/uses a PVR-350 or is thinking of buying
one (don't)

- Jeff

kingedgar at gmail

Mar 22, 2006, 10:22 AM

Post #2 of 35 (5350 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

On 3/22/06, Jeff Simpson <llcooljeff [at] gmail> wrote:
> I just happened to read through the bug reports and found this:
>
> http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/745
>
> It says that PVR-350 output support will likely be dropped from later
> releases of MythTV due to a lack of developers who want to maintain it.
>
> Just a heads up for anyone who owns/uses a PVR-350 or is thinking of buying
> one (don't)

Terrible news for me. I would probably have to go to some sort of
windows alternative if 350 output is dropped. :(
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john.p.harvey at btinternet

Mar 22, 2006, 10:41 AM

Post #3 of 35 (5371 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

The 350 works ok using Xv now though and that works ok and will continue to
be supported ( I believe) since there is nothing that is 350 specific in
that code.

If people have problems with the Xv output I am happy to take a look at that
(though I am busy and the response may not be as fast as you would like).

John

> -----Original Message-----
> From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
> [mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Jason Garrett
> Sent: 22 March 2006 18:23
> To: Discussion about mythtv
> Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] PVR-350 output support being dropped!
>
> On 3/22/06, Jeff Simpson <llcooljeff [at] gmail> wrote:
> > I just happened to read through the bug reports and found this:
> >
> > http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/745
> >
> > It says that PVR-350 output support will likely be dropped
> from later
> > releases of MythTV due to a lack of developers who want to
> maintain it.
> >
> > Just a heads up for anyone who owns/uses a PVR-350 or is
> thinking of
> > buying one (don't)
>
> Terrible news for me. I would probably have to go to some
> sort of windows alternative if 350 output is dropped. :(
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

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mythtv at archer-segel

Mar 22, 2006, 10:52 AM

Post #4 of 35 (5372 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

I haven't tried it in a while, but on my system MythTV xv output from
the 350 never looked as good as the native MPEG decoder could produce.
The main problem was that it seemed to drop frames, although I'm not
certain it was actually doing that - it just seemed less smooth than the
native output, enough so that I always switched back. This was on an
Athlon XP 1700+ system with 512MB running SD only. I'll try it again
tonight to see if more recent versions of MythTV are any better. I
frequently use xv with xine to watch DVD images and don't notice
anything wrong with the video then, so I assume it's a Myth thing.

Are there any specific ivtvctl settings I should be using to make the
output as good as possible?

Daniel

John Harvey wrote:
> The 350 works ok using Xv now though and that works ok and will continue to
> be supported ( I believe) since there is nothing that is 350 specific in
> that code.
>
> If people have problems with the Xv output I am happy to take a look at that
> (though I am busy and the response may not be as fast as you would like).
>
> John
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
>> [mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Jason Garrett
>> Sent: 22 March 2006 18:23
>> To: Discussion about mythtv
>> Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] PVR-350 output support being dropped!
>>
>> On 3/22/06, Jeff Simpson <llcooljeff [at] gmail> wrote:
>>
>>> I just happened to read through the bug reports and found this:
>>>
>>> http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/745
>>>
>>> It says that PVR-350 output support will likely be dropped
>>>
>> from later
>>
>>> releases of MythTV due to a lack of developers who want to
>>>
>> maintain it.
>>
>>> Just a heads up for anyone who owns/uses a PVR-350 or is
>>>
>> thinking of
>>
>>> buying one (don't)
>>>
>> Terrible news for me. I would probably have to go to some
>> sort of windows alternative if 350 output is dropped. :(
>> _______________________________________________
>> mythtv-users mailing list
>> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
>> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>

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vthtym0505 at schlaegel

Mar 22, 2006, 11:14 AM

Post #5 of 35 (5348 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

On 3/22/06, Jeff Simpson <llcooljeff [at] gmail> wrote:
> I just happened to read through the bug reports and found this:
> http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/745
> It says that PVR-350 output support will likely be dropped from later
> releases of MythTV due to a lack of developers who want to maintain it.

I hope begging and pleading has some sway, because that is all can
offer right now. I use the PVR350 and so does a setup I did for my
parents. I really want the hardware decode of the PVR350, because
these systems are multi-use.

I love Myth and don't want to leave it (or have it leave me). Please
maintain support for the PVR350.

-Aaron
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john.p.harvey at btinternet

Mar 22, 2006, 11:21 AM

Post #6 of 35 (5358 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

It should just work but there is at least one resolution setting for me that
causes things to go wrong and the image to be jumpy. I have one video that
causes this and it may just be that myth is requesting a resolution that
provokes that problem.
I intend to fix this but I'm stuck rebuilding and decorating the lounge at
the moment so that's has to come first.

JOhn

> -----Original Message-----
> From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
> [mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Daniel A Segel
> Sent: 22 March 2006 18:52
> To: Discussion about mythtv
> Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] PVR-350 output support being dropped!
>
> I haven't tried it in a while, but on my system MythTV xv
> output from the 350 never looked as good as the native MPEG
> decoder could produce.
> The main problem was that it seemed to drop frames, although
> I'm not certain it was actually doing that - it just seemed
> less smooth than the native output, enough so that I always
> switched back. This was on an Athlon XP 1700+ system with
> 512MB running SD only. I'll try it again tonight to see if
> more recent versions of MythTV are any better. I frequently
> use xv with xine to watch DVD images and don't notice
> anything wrong with the video then, so I assume it's a Myth thing.
>
> Are there any specific ivtvctl settings I should be using to
> make the output as good as possible?
>
> Daniel
>
> John Harvey wrote:
> > The 350 works ok using Xv now though and that works ok and will
> > continue to be supported ( I believe) since there is
> nothing that is
> > 350 specific in that code.
> >
> > If people have problems with the Xv output I am happy to
> take a look
> > at that (though I am busy and the response may not be as
> fast as you would like).
> >
> > John
> >
> >
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
> >> [mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Jason Garrett
> >> Sent: 22 March 2006 18:23
> >> To: Discussion about mythtv
> >> Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] PVR-350 output support being dropped!
> >>
> >> On 3/22/06, Jeff Simpson <llcooljeff [at] gmail> wrote:
> >>
> >>> I just happened to read through the bug reports and found this:
> >>>
> >>> http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/745
> >>>
> >>> It says that PVR-350 output support will likely be dropped
> >>>
> >> from later
> >>
> >>> releases of MythTV due to a lack of developers who want to
> >>>
> >> maintain it.
> >>
> >>> Just a heads up for anyone who owns/uses a PVR-350 or is
> >>>
> >> thinking of
> >>
> >>> buying one (don't)
> >>>
> >> Terrible news for me. I would probably have to go to some sort of
> >> windows alternative if 350 output is dropped. :(
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> mythtv-users mailing list
> >> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> >> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> >>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > mythtv-users mailing list
> > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> > http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

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mythtv at archer-segel

Mar 22, 2006, 7:24 PM

Post #7 of 35 (5361 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

I tried it again tonight with xv and it's still not really usable. The
image isn't jumpy, it's more like it's in slow motion, except it's not.
It's hard to explain, but the problem is with motion - for example
somebody walking across the screen or waving their hands around. I tried
it with Live TV at both 720x480 and 640x480 with the same results.

I *would* like to get it working better with xv because then I could use
some of the other Myth features like time-stretch.

Daniel

John Harvey wrote:

>It should just work but there is at least one resolution setting for me that
>causes things to go wrong and the image to be jumpy. I have one video that
>causes this and it may just be that myth is requesting a resolution that
>provokes that problem.
>I intend to fix this but I'm stuck rebuilding and decorating the lounge at
>the moment so that's has to come first.
>
>JOhn
>
>
>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
>>[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Daniel A Segel
>>Sent: 22 March 2006 18:52
>>To: Discussion about mythtv
>>Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] PVR-350 output support being dropped!
>>
>>I haven't tried it in a while, but on my system MythTV xv
>>output from the 350 never looked as good as the native MPEG
>>decoder could produce.
>>The main problem was that it seemed to drop frames, although
>>I'm not certain it was actually doing that - it just seemed
>>less smooth than the native output, enough so that I always
>>switched back. This was on an Athlon XP 1700+ system with
>>512MB running SD only. I'll try it again tonight to see if
>>more recent versions of MythTV are any better. I frequently
>>use xv with xine to watch DVD images and don't notice
>>anything wrong with the video then, so I assume it's a Myth thing.
>>
>>Are there any specific ivtvctl settings I should be using to
>>make the output as good as possible?
>>
>>Daniel
>>
>>John Harvey wrote:
>>
>>
>>>The 350 works ok using Xv now though and that works ok and will
>>>continue to be supported ( I believe) since there is
>>>
>>>
>>nothing that is
>>
>>
>>>350 specific in that code.
>>>
>>>If people have problems with the Xv output I am happy to
>>>
>>>
>>take a look
>>
>>
>>>at that (though I am busy and the response may not be as
>>>
>>>
>>fast as you would like).
>>
>>
>>>John
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
>>>>[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Jason Garrett
>>>>Sent: 22 March 2006 18:23
>>>>To: Discussion about mythtv
>>>>Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] PVR-350 output support being dropped!
>>>>
>>>>On 3/22/06, Jeff Simpson <llcooljeff [at] gmail> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>I just happened to read through the bug reports and found this:
>>>>>
>>>>>http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/745
>>>>>
>>>>>It says that PVR-350 output support will likely be dropped
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>from later
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>releases of MythTV due to a lack of developers who want to
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>maintain it.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Just a heads up for anyone who owns/uses a PVR-350 or is
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>thinking of
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>buying one (don't)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>Terrible news for me. I would probably have to go to some sort of
>>>>windows alternative if 350 output is dropped. :(
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>mythtv-users mailing list
>>>>mythtv-users [at] mythtv
>>>>http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>mythtv-users mailing list
>>>mythtv-users [at] mythtv
>>>http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>mythtv-users mailing list
>>mythtv-users [at] mythtv
>>http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>>
>>
>
>_______________________________________________
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>mythtv-users [at] mythtv
>http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>

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zoiks2004-ivtv at yahoo

Mar 22, 2006, 7:37 PM

Post #8 of 35 (5347 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

Look anything like this?

http://ivtvdriver.org/trac/ticket/55

--- "Daniel A. Segel" <mythtv [at] archer-segel> wrote:

> I tried it again tonight with xv and it's still not
> really usable. The
> image isn't jumpy, it's more like it's in slow
> motion, except it's not.
> It's hard to explain, but the problem is with motion
> - for example
> somebody walking across the screen or waving their
> hands around. I tried
> it with Live TV at both 720x480 and 640x480 with the
> same results.
>
> I *would* like to get it working better with xv
> because then I could use
> some of the other Myth features like time-stretch.
>
> Daniel
>
> John Harvey wrote:
>
> >It should just work but there is at least one
> resolution setting for me that
> >causes things to go wrong and the image to be
> jumpy. I have one video that
> >causes this and it may just be that myth is
> requesting a resolution that
> >provokes that problem.
> >I intend to fix this but I'm stuck rebuilding and
> decorating the lounge at
> >the moment so that's has to come first.
> >
> >JOhn
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spam1001 at 2thebatcave

Mar 22, 2006, 7:40 PM

Post #9 of 35 (5359 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

I had some issues with scaling when I first setup mine. In your playback
settings is the aspect ration set to anything other than "off"? If so
that may be your problem too. I set mine to off which of course messed up
my display a bit, but I fixed it by setting the aspect ratio in the
recording profile to "square".

> I tried it again tonight with xv and it's still not really usable. The
> image isn't jumpy, it's more like it's in slow motion, except it's not.
> It's hard to explain, but the problem is with motion - for example
> somebody walking across the screen or waving their hands around. I tried
> it with Live TV at both 720x480 and 640x480 with the same results.
>
> I *would* like to get it working better with xv because then I could use
> some of the other Myth features like time-stretch.
>
> Daniel
>
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kichigai at comcast

Mar 22, 2006, 11:50 PM

Post #10 of 35 (5336 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

On Mar 22, 2006, at 11.15, Jeff Simpson wrote:

> I just happened to read through the bug reports and found this:
>
> http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/745
>
> It says that PVR-350 output support will likely be dropped from
> later releases of MythTV due to a lack of developers who want to
> maintain it.
>
> Just a heads up for anyone who owns/uses a PVR-350 or is thinking
> of buying one (don't)

Oh piffle! I was considering condensing my MythTV system, and using a
PVR-350 as output, since my back-end doesn't have any AGP slots, a
single PCI slot I can free up, and I wanted to include at least one
more tuner. I guess I'll need to stick to my separated solution for now.

>
> - Jeff
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

Attachments:

PGP.sig (0.18 KB)

ian at duckland

Mar 23, 2006, 1:58 AM

Post #11 of 35 (5315 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

On Thu, 2006-03-23 at 01:50 -0600, Kichigai Mentat wrote:

> Oh piffle! I was considering condensing my MythTV system, and using a
> PVR-350 as output, since my back-end doesn't have any AGP slots, a
> single PCI slot I can free up, and I wanted to include at least one
> more tuner. I guess I'll need to stick to my separated solution for
> now.

If you've got an onboard VGA out, just use a transcoder box such as an
Audio Authority...

-I

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gwilford at gmail

Mar 23, 2006, 6:25 AM

Post #12 of 35 (5330 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

Yep, looks exactly as described.

On 23/03/06, zoiks2004-ivtv [at] yahoo <zoiks2004-ivtv [at] yahoo> wrote:
> Look anything like this?
>
> http://ivtvdriver.org/trac/ticket/55
>
>
> --- "Daniel A. Segel" <mythtv [at] archer-segel> wrote:
>
> > I tried it again tonight with xv and it's still not
> > really usable. The
> > image isn't jumpy, it's more like it's in slow
> > motion, except it's not.
> > It's hard to explain, but the problem is with motion
> > - for example
> > somebody walking across the screen or waving their
> > hands around. I tried
> > it with Live TV at both 720x480 and 640x480 with the
> > same results.
> >
> > I *would* like to get it working better with xv
> > because then I could use
> > some of the other Myth features like time-stretch.
> >
> > Daniel
> >
> > John Harvey wrote:
> >
> > >It should just work but there is at least one
> > resolution setting for me that
> > >causes things to go wrong and the image to be
> > jumpy. I have one video that
> > >causes this and it may just be that myth is
> > requesting a resolution that
> > >provokes that problem.
> > >I intend to fix this but I'm stuck rebuilding and
> > decorating the lounge at
> > >the moment so that's has to come first.
> > >
> > >JOhn
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users

--
Me [at] googl | MythTV blog: http://mezzanines.blogspot.com/
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jeffsimpson at alum

Mar 23, 2006, 6:41 AM

Post #13 of 35 (5340 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

On 3/22/06, Daniel A. Segel <mythtv [at] archer-segel> wrote:
>
> I tried it again tonight with xv and it's still not really usable. The
> image isn't jumpy, it's more like it's in slow motion, except it's not.
> It's hard to explain, but the problem is with motion - for example
> somebody walking across the screen or waving their hands around. I tried
> it with Live TV at both 720x480 and 640x480 with the same results.
>
> I *would* like to get it working better with xv because then I could use
> some of the other Myth features like time-stretch.

If you're going to use XV instead of the MPEG2 output, why not just use the
hardware acceleration on a normal nvidia card with TV out? That's the reason
that the "support" is being dropped, as far as I can tell - everything
that's more advanced than "just playing an MPEG" is difficult to maintain
with this card.

Besides, the only thing the PVR-350 has over a normal video card for output
is the MPEG2 decoding, and the only way to get the good myth features (and
to get the normal features to work) is to not use the MPEG2 decoding and
stick with XV, thus defeating the purpose.

I also recently found out that as of x.org 6.9/7.0, you can run multiple
simultaneous X sessions and have them both be active at the same time! I
haven't installed it yet (because the package structure changed and this
means major changes in gentoo), but it looks like I should be able to get as
many TV-Out cards as I want and have them all be running separately,
provided that I can assign each of them a unique input (remote or keyboard).
There goes the other benefit of the PVR-350, which was that you could have
MPEG2 decoding to TV going on while using another X-session (but not XV
display)

> John Harvey wrote:
>
> >It should just work but there is at least one resolution setting for me
> that
> >causes things to go wrong and the image to be jumpy. I have one video
> that
> >causes this and it may just be that myth is requesting a resolution that
> >provokes that problem.
> >I intend to fix this but I'm stuck rebuilding and decorating the lounge
> at
> >the moment so that's has to come first.
> >
> >JOhn
> >
> >
> >
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
> >>[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Daniel A Segel
> >>Sent: 22 March 2006 18:52
> >>To: Discussion about mythtv
> >>Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] PVR-350 output support being dropped!
> >>
> >>I haven't tried it in a while, but on my system MythTV xv
> >>output from the 350 never looked as good as the native MPEG
> >>decoder could produce.
> >>The main problem was that it seemed to drop frames, although
> >>I'm not certain it was actually doing that - it just seemed
> >>less smooth than the native output, enough so that I always
> >>switched back. This was on an Athlon XP 1700+ system with
> >>512MB running SD only. I'll try it again tonight to see if
> >>more recent versions of MythTV are any better. I frequently
> >>use xv with xine to watch DVD images and don't notice
> >>anything wrong with the video then, so I assume it's a Myth thing.
> >>
> >>Are there any specific ivtvctl settings I should be using to
> >>make the output as good as possible?
> >>
> >>Daniel
> >>
> >>John Harvey wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>The 350 works ok using Xv now though and that works ok and will
> >>>continue to be supported ( I believe) since there is
> >>>
> >>>
> >>nothing that is
> >>
> >>
> >>>350 specific in that code.
> >>>
> >>>If people have problems with the Xv output I am happy to
> >>>
> >>>
> >>take a look
> >>
> >>
> >>>at that (though I am busy and the response may not be as
> >>>
> >>>
> >>fast as you would like).
> >>
> >>
> >>>John
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>-----Original Message-----
> >>>>From: mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv
> >>>>[mailto:mythtv-users-bounces [at] mythtv] On Behalf Of Jason Garrett
> >>>>Sent: 22 March 2006 18:23
> >>>>To: Discussion about mythtv
> >>>>Subject: Re: [mythtv-users] PVR-350 output support being dropped!
> >>>>
> >>>>On 3/22/06, Jeff Simpson <llcooljeff [at] gmail> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>I just happened to read through the bug reports and found this:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/ticket/745
> >>>>>
> >>>>>It says that PVR-350 output support will likely be dropped
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>from later
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>releases of MythTV due to a lack of developers who want to
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>maintain it.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>Just a heads up for anyone who owns/uses a PVR-350 or is
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>thinking of
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>buying one (don't)
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>Terrible news for me. I would probably have to go to some sort of
> >>>>windows alternative if 350 output is dropped. :(
> >>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>mythtv-users mailing list
> >>>>mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> >>>>http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>_______________________________________________
> >>>mythtv-users mailing list
> >>>mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> >>>http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>mythtv-users mailing list
> >>mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> >>http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> >>
> >>
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >mythtv-users mailing list
> >mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> >http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> >
> >
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>

john.p.harvey at btinternet

Mar 23, 2006, 7:20 AM

Post #14 of 35 (5348 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

Can you mail me the section from your messages file
about register settings that occurs when Xv starts.
I believe i have something that fixes this problem but
it breaks other resolutions so i'm not ready to
release it yet. With that information i can see if its
the same issue as i'm trying to fix.

John
--- Graeme Wilford <gwilford [at] gmail> wrote:

> Yep, looks exactly as described.
>
> On 23/03/06, zoiks2004-ivtv [at] yahoo
> <zoiks2004-ivtv [at] yahoo> wrote:
> > Look anything like this?
> >
> > http://ivtvdriver.org/trac/ticket/55
> >
> >
> > --- "Daniel A. Segel" <mythtv [at] archer-segel>
> wrote:
> >
> > > I tried it again tonight with xv and it's still
> not
> > > really usable. The
> > > image isn't jumpy, it's more like it's in slow
> > > motion, except it's not.
> > > It's hard to explain, but the problem is with
> motion
> > > - for example
> > > somebody walking across the screen or waving
> their
> > > hands around. I tried
> > > it with Live TV at both 720x480 and 640x480 with
> the
> > > same results.
> > >
> > > I *would* like to get it working better with xv
> > > because then I could use
> > > some of the other Myth features like
> time-stretch.
> > >
> > > Daniel
> > >
> > > John Harvey wrote:
> > >
> > > >It should just work but there is at least one
> > > resolution setting for me that
> > > >causes things to go wrong and the image to be
> > > jumpy. I have one video that
> > > >causes this and it may just be that myth is
> > > requesting a resolution that
> > > >provokes that problem.
> > > >I intend to fix this but I'm stuck rebuilding
> and
> > > decorating the lounge at
> > > >the moment so that's has to come first.
> > > >
> > > >JOhn
> > _______________________________________________
> > mythtv-users mailing list
> > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> >
>
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
> --
> Me [at] googl | MythTV blog:
> http://mezzanines.blogspot.com/
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
>
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>

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mythtv at archer-segel

Mar 23, 2006, 7:23 AM

Post #15 of 35 (5329 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

The problem I'm seeing happens on both prerecorded shows and Live TV.
Also, it's not quite like dropped frames - the image is jerky, but
consistently so. It *never* has periods of smooth motion. Maybe it's
dropping every other or every third frame. As I said, it's hard to describe.

With xine playing DVD images I needed to do an 'ivtvctl
--set-yuv-mode=mode=1' to get it to play smoothly, but the problem I was
having there isn't the same as what I'm seeing with MythTV.

Daniel

zoiks2004-ivtv [at] yahoo wrote:
> Look anything like this?
>
> http://ivtvdriver.org/trac/ticket/55
>
>
> --- "Daniel A. Segel" <mythtv [at] archer-segel> wrote:
>
>
>> I tried it again tonight with xv and it's still not
>> really usable. The
>> image isn't jumpy, it's more like it's in slow
>> motion, except it's not.
>> It's hard to explain, but the problem is with motion
>> - for example
>> somebody walking across the screen or waving their
>> hands around. I tried
>> it with Live TV at both 720x480 and 640x480 with the
>> same results.
>>
>> I *would* like to get it working better with xv
>> because then I could use
>> some of the other Myth features like time-stretch.
>>
>> Daniel
>>
>> John Harvey wrote:
>>
>>
>>> It should just work but there is at least one
>>>
>> resolution setting for me that
>>
>>> causes things to go wrong and the image to be
>>>
>> jumpy. I have one video that
>>
>>> causes this and it may just be that myth is
>>>
>> requesting a resolution that
>>
>>> provokes that problem.
>>> I intend to fix this but I'm stuck rebuilding and
>>>
>> decorating the lounge at
>>
>>> the moment so that's has to come first.
>>>
>>> JOhn
>>>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>

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mythtv at archer-segel

Mar 23, 2006, 7:25 AM

Post #16 of 35 (5340 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

I have "Aspect Override" set to Off. I may try it set to Fill instead.

Is anybody actually using a PVR-350 in XV mode with an interlaced SD TV
with good results? If so, what resolution are you recording at?

Daniel

Nick Bartos wrote:
> I had some issues with scaling when I first setup mine. In your playback
> settings is the aspect ration set to anything other than "off"? If so
> that may be your problem too. I set mine to off which of course messed up
> my display a bit, but I fixed it by setting the aspect ratio in the
> recording profile to "square".
>
>
>> I tried it again tonight with xv and it's still not really usable. The
>> image isn't jumpy, it's more like it's in slow motion, except it's not.
>> It's hard to explain, but the problem is with motion - for example
>> somebody walking across the screen or waving their hands around. I tried
>> it with Live TV at both 720x480 and 640x480 with the same results.
>>
>> I *would* like to get it working better with xv because then I could use
>> some of the other Myth features like time-stretch.
>>
>> Daniel
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>

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john.p.harvey at btinternet

Mar 23, 2006, 7:31 AM

Post #17 of 35 (5337 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

> If you're going to use XV instead of the MPEG2
> output, why not just use the
> hardware acceleration on a normal nvidia card with
> TV out? That's the reason
> that the "support" is being dropped, as far as I can
> tell - everything
> that's more advanced than "just playing an MPEG" is
> difficult to maintain
> with this card.
>
> Besides, the only thing the PVR-350 has over a
> normal video card for output
> is the MPEG2 decoding, and the only way to get the
> good myth features (and
> to get the normal features to work) is to not use
> the MPEG2 decoding and
> stick with XV, thus defeating the purpose.
>
Apart from this particular bug the quality using Xv or
mpeg decoding is similar and the cpu usage is similar
so there is no real loss in using Xv and the gain is
that we don't have to maintain 2 sets of code.

> I also recently found out that as of x.org 6.9/7.0,
> you can run multiple
> simultaneous X sessions and have them both be active
> at the same time! I
> haven't installed it yet (because the package
> structure changed and this
> means major changes in gentoo), but it looks like I
> should be able to get as
> many TV-Out cards as I want and have them all be
> running separately,
> provided that I can assign each of them a unique
> input (remote or keyboard).
> There goes the other benefit of the PVR-350, which
> was that you could have
> MPEG2 decoding to TV going on while using another
> X-session (but not XV
> display)

Yes this is true but i am not convinced (haven't
looked at it) that i can use the svideo output and the
vga output of a single nvidia card from 2 different X
sessions so i would need to go and buy a second VGA
card to replace the 350 i allready have. Also the
output quality is typically lower as well.

So the main thing is really that most people have
working hardware and don't want to change it and have
to buy new hardware.

John
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john.p.harvey at btinternet

Mar 23, 2006, 7:33 AM

Post #18 of 35 (5338 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

I believe its the interlacing not working so its
displaying every other frame.

John
--- Daniel A Segel <mythtv [at] archer-segel> wrote:

> The problem I'm seeing happens on both prerecorded
> shows and Live TV.
> Also, it's not quite like dropped frames - the image
> is jerky, but
> consistently so. It *never* has periods of smooth
> motion. Maybe it's
> dropping every other or every third frame. As I
> said, it's hard to describe.
>
> With xine playing DVD images I needed to do an
> 'ivtvctl
> --set-yuv-mode=mode=1' to get it to play smoothly,
> but the problem I was
> having there isn't the same as what I'm seeing with
> MythTV.
>
> Daniel
>
> zoiks2004-ivtv [at] yahoo wrote:
> > Look anything like this?
> >
> > http://ivtvdriver.org/trac/ticket/55
> >
> >
> > --- "Daniel A. Segel" <mythtv [at] archer-segel>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> >> I tried it again tonight with xv and it's still
> not
> >> really usable. The
> >> image isn't jumpy, it's more like it's in slow
> >> motion, except it's not.
> >> It's hard to explain, but the problem is with
> motion
> >> - for example
> >> somebody walking across the screen or waving
> their
> >> hands around. I tried
> >> it with Live TV at both 720x480 and 640x480 with
> the
> >> same results.
> >>
> >> I *would* like to get it working better with xv
> >> because then I could use
> >> some of the other Myth features like
> time-stretch.
> >>
> >> Daniel
> >>
> >> John Harvey wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>> It should just work but there is at least one
> >>>
> >> resolution setting for me that
> >>
> >>> causes things to go wrong and the image to be
> >>>
> >> jumpy. I have one video that
> >>
> >>> causes this and it may just be that myth is
> >>>
> >> requesting a resolution that
> >>
> >>> provokes that problem.
> >>> I intend to fix this but I'm stuck rebuilding
> and
> >>>
> >> decorating the lounge at
> >>
> >>> the moment so that's has to come first.
> >>>
> >>> JOhn
> >>>
> > _______________________________________________
> > mythtv-users mailing list
> > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> >
>
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
>
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>

_______________________________________________
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joevph at yahoo

Mar 23, 2006, 7:51 AM

Post #19 of 35 (5339 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

--- Daniel A Segel <mythtv [at] archer-segel> wrote:

> I have "Aspect Override" set to Off. I may try it
> set to Fill instead.
>
> Is anybody actually using a PVR-350 in XV mode with
> an interlaced SD TV
> with good results? If so, what resolution are you
> recording at?
>
> Daniel
>
> Nick Bartos wrote:
> > I had some issues with scaling when I first setup
> mine. In your playback
> > settings is the aspect ration set to anything
> other than "off"? If so
> > that may be your problem too. I set mine to off
> which of course messed up
> > my display a bit, but I fixed it by setting the
> aspect ratio in the
> > recording profile to "square".
> >
> >
> >> I tried it again tonight with xv and it's still
> not really usable. The
> >> image isn't jumpy, it's more like it's in slow
> motion, except it's not.
> >> It's hard to explain, but the problem is with
> motion - for example
> >> somebody walking across the screen or waving
> their hands around. I tried
> >> it with Live TV at both 720x480 and 640x480 with
> the same results.
> >>
> >> I *would* like to get it working better with xv
> because then I could use
> >> some of the other Myth features like
> time-stretch.
> >>
> >> Daniel
> >>
> >>
> > _______________________________________________
> > mythtv-users mailing list
> > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> >
>
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
>
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>

I was (but am not anymore because I have a widescreen
HDTV now) using my PVR-350 with Xv output via S-Video.
I stuck with it for so long because the picture
quality is better than my GeForce 5200FX (even with
this new HDTV), but I do have to use the 5200FX now in
order to do HD (which is still a work in progress for
me).

I was recording at 720x480 with the default bitrates
(I think 4500 and 6000?).

-- Joe

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antdaniel at gmail

Mar 23, 2006, 8:09 AM

Post #20 of 35 (5333 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

On 23/03/06, John Harvey <john.p.harvey [at] btinternet> wrote:
> I believe its the interlacing not working so its
> displaying every other frame.
>
> John

The biggest problem I noticed (and the reason my wife won't let me use
it) is that the text for our OSD flickers. From memory the background
boxes are ok.

I do remember that some of the playback was juderry, but not always
noticable. I believe I'm on interlaced (after all isn't that the
standard UK analog broadcast?, ok I'm recording off Sky, but it still
has to translate to interlaced analog to give me S-Video, doesn't it?)

The judering became more noticable using timeshift (I expect I would
have to put up with some, but as I've never experienced it before
wouldn't know if what I was getting is normal or not.)

Ant.
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sdkovacs at gmail

Mar 23, 2006, 10:56 AM

Post #21 of 35 (5313 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

Maybe I'm doing something wrong (right), but the PVR350 is working
well for me. I watch DVD's and Videos with no problem.
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gwilford at gmail

Mar 23, 2006, 11:04 AM

Post #22 of 35 (5316 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

John,

It only appears to be a problem when the encoder is running at the
same time. I've tried playing back DVDs at 720x576 and the following
at 320 and 704:

ivtv0-osd warning: Need to adjust to width 320 src_w 320 dst_w 580
src_x 0 dst_x 79
ivtv0-osd warning: Need to adjust to height 576 src_h 576 dst_h 450
src_y 0 dst_y 46
ivtv0-osd warning: Source video: Interlaced
ivtv0 warning: Enable video output
ivtv0-osd warning: Need to adjust to width 704 src_w 704 dst_w 580
src_x 0 dst_x 79
ivtv0-osd warning: Need to adjust to height 576 src_h 576 dst_h 450
src_y 0 dst_y 46
ivtv0-osd warning: Source video: Interlaced
ivtv0 warning: Enable video output

As others have said, the video stream appears to blip every second or
so - but not consistently as I saw a clean 5 second pan while
re-testing. The audio stays in sync but the video looks like it's
dropping frames.

Strangely, when I changed Myth's settings in Appearance to use
full-screen rather than matching the OSD size:

ivtv0-osd warning: Need to adjust to width 320 src_w 320 dst_w 678
src_x 0 dst_x 22
ivtv0-osd warning: Need to adjust to height 576 src_h 576 dst_h 518
src_y 0 dst_y 20
ivtv0-osd warning: Source video: Interlaced
ivtv0 warning: Enable video output
ivtv0-osd warning: Need to adjust to width 704 src_w 704 dst_w 704
src_x 0 dst_x 9
ivtv0-osd warning: Need to adjust to height 576 src_h 576 dst_h 518
src_y 0 dst_y 20
ivtv0-osd warning: Source video: Interlaced
ivtv0 warning: Enable video output

The visual frame drop was much reduced and possibly even eliminated entirely.

However, watching live-TV (using Myth's fullscreen setting) looked bad
with frame dropping and the hand-waving blurryness that someone else
mentioned:

ivtv0-osd warning: Need to adjust to width 720 src_w 720 dst_w 678
src_x 0 dst_x 22
ivtv0-osd warning: Need to adjust to height 576 src_h 576 dst_h 518
src_y 0 dst_y 20
ivtv0-osd warning: Source video: Interlaced
ivtv0 warning: Enable video output

HTH.

Thanks,
Wilf.

On 23/03/06, John Harvey <john.p.harvey [at] btinternet> wrote:
> Can you mail me the section from your messages file
> about register settings that occurs when Xv starts.
> I believe i have something that fixes this problem but
> it breaks other resolutions so i'm not ready to
> release it yet. With that information i can see if its
> the same issue as i'm trying to fix.
>
>
> John
> --- Graeme Wilford <gwilford [at] gmail> wrote:
>
> > Yep, looks exactly as described.
> >
> > On 23/03/06, zoiks2004-ivtv [at] yahoo
> > <zoiks2004-ivtv [at] yahoo> wrote:
> > > Look anything like this?
> > >
> > > http://ivtvdriver.org/trac/ticket/55
> > >
> > >
> > > --- "Daniel A. Segel" <mythtv [at] archer-segel>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > > I tried it again tonight with xv and it's still
> > not
> > > > really usable. The
> > > > image isn't jumpy, it's more like it's in slow
> > > > motion, except it's not.
> > > > It's hard to explain, but the problem is with
> > motion
> > > > - for example
> > > > somebody walking across the screen or waving
> > their
> > > > hands around. I tried
> > > > it with Live TV at both 720x480 and 640x480 with
> > the
> > > > same results.
> > > >
> > > > I *would* like to get it working better with xv
> > > > because then I could use
> > > > some of the other Myth features like
> > time-stretch.
> > > >
> > > > Daniel
> > > >
> > > > John Harvey wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >It should just work but there is at least one
> > > > resolution setting for me that
> > > > >causes things to go wrong and the image to be
> > > > jumpy. I have one video that
> > > > >causes this and it may just be that myth is
> > > > requesting a resolution that
> > > > >provokes that problem.
> > > > >I intend to fix this but I'm stuck rebuilding
> > and
> > > > decorating the lounge at
> > > > >the moment so that's has to come first.
> > > > >
> > > > >JOhn
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > mythtv-users mailing list
> > > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> > >
> >
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> >
> > --
> > Me [at] googl | MythTV blog:
> > http://mezzanines.blogspot.com/
> > _______________________________________________
> > mythtv-users mailing list
> > mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> >
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>

--
Me [at] googl | MythTV blog: http://mezzanines.blogspot.com/
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lsaunderson at blueyonder

Mar 23, 2006, 11:34 AM

Post #23 of 35 (5306 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

I've been using my 350 since I first built the mythbox about 1.5 - 2
years ago now (I think, was on 0.17 at the time I think)
Granted it's annoying that the non mpeg2 stuff is sometimes slow (or not
supported), but I always found that the quality looked better than the
output from my Geforce 5800. I still have the 5800 in the box and
occasionally switch X's setup back to it if I wannt play a game or
something (I've got Stepmania installed on the same machine, great fun
on a TV and using a dancemat !).
I might try the Geforce again this w/end to compare quality again, but I
for one would like the 350 support to be kept alive..

I assume this is talking about losing 350 output support, not encoding
as well seeing as that's provided out ivtv ?

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vthtym0505 at schlaegel

Mar 23, 2006, 12:59 PM

Post #24 of 35 (5303 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

On 3/23/06, John Harvey <john.p.harvey [at] btinternet> wrote:
> Apart from this particular bug the quality using Xv or
> mpeg decoding is similar and the cpu usage is similar
> so there is no real loss in using Xv and the gain is
> that we don't have to maintain 2 sets of code.

For my usage I see a large difference between xv playback and native
350 playback. The native 350 playback has almost no processor usage on
my two 350 systems, while xv frontends use a lot of of the processor.

For me, all of the killer features of myth are met by my 350 systems.
Perhaps people have different ideas of what the killer features of
myth are.
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joevph at yahoo

Mar 23, 2006, 2:00 PM

Post #25 of 35 (5322 views)
Permalink

Re: PVR-350 output support being dropped! [In reply to]

--- Leigh <lsaunderson [at] blueyonder> wrote:

> I've been using my 350 since I first built the
> mythbox about 1.5 - 2
> years ago now (I think, was on 0.17 at the time I
> think)
> Granted it's annoying that the non mpeg2 stuff is
> sometimes slow (or not
> supported), but I always found that the quality
> looked better than the
> output from my Geforce 5800. I still have the 5800
> in the box and
> occasionally switch X's setup back to it if I wannt
> play a game or
> something (I've got Stepmania installed on the same
> machine, great fun
> on a TV and using a dancemat !).
> I might try the Geforce again this w/end to compare
> quality again, but I
> for one would like the 350 support to be kept
> alive..
>
> I assume this is talking about losing 350 output
> support, not encoding
> as well seeing as that's provided out ivtv ?
>
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>
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The only support that is being considered dropped is
that of the MPEG-2 (hardware) decoder on the PVR-350.
You can still use the actual card itself for TV output
by installing the X driver which gives Xv support.
The only downsides to this are:
1. It is much more CPU intensive (because Xv is done
by the CPU instead of a video card supporting
acceleration), and
2. There seem to be some bugs relating to capturing
data and playing it back at the same time (which is a
seperate discussion).

If you want to continue to use your PVR-350, you can
with newer versions of MythTV, you just might have to
use the X driver and not the MPEG-2 decoder, that's
all.

Now then, if there is somebody (or multiple people)
who use the PVR-350 hardware decoder, and who wish to
support the code for it in MythTV, then there is no
problem. The decoder chip was designed for only a
certain feature set, and I am quite impressed that the
developers have gotten as far as they have with it.
The code in (at least) a few places has PVR-350
specific sections (for the MPEG-2
decoder/framebuffer), and keeping that the same (in
terms of features) adds a big strain for only one type
of hardware.

Myself, I used to use the PVR-350 with the X driver,
but have since switched to an HDTV that connects to my
GeForce 5200FX through it's VGA port. The picture
quality takes a bit of a hit (I have to use Bob
deinterlacing, which sometimes has it's own issues),
but I am able to do so much more with the 5200FX
(OpenGL for the new UI and MythMusic, proper screen
size for xmame, etc.). It's just as more of the core
users and (more importantly) the developers start
moving away from the PVR-350 MPEG-2 decoder, there
will be less support for it.

-- Joe

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