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Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs

 

 

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john_miller5555 at yahoo

Feb 26, 2005, 5:19 PM

Post #1 of 39 (9628 views)
Permalink
Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs

Simple patch against the recent DB changes.



__________________________________
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Yahoo! Sports - Sign up for Fantasy Baseball.
http://baseball.fantasysports.yahoo.com/
Attachments: torrentocracy-mythtvcvs.diff (8.07 KB)


denier at umr

Feb 26, 2005, 6:39 PM

Post #2 of 39 (9393 views)
Permalink
Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

I had thought this was not an accepted feature of the main myth
developers...

On Sat, 2005-02-26 at 17:19 -0800, John Miller wrote:
> Simple patch against the recent DB changes.
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Sports - Sign up for Fantasy Baseball.
> http://baseball.fantasysports.yahoo.com/
> plain text document attachment (torrentocracy-mythtvcvs.diff),
> "torrentocracy-mythtvcvs.diff"
> diff -Naur torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/main.cpp torrentocracy/torrentocracy/main.cpp --- torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/main.cpp 2004-07-14 18:28:16.000000000 -0500 +++ torrentocracy/torrentocracy/main.cpp 2005-02-26 18:19:01.951565143 -0600 @@ -22,7 +22,6 @@ #include <iostream> #include <qapplication.h> -#include <qsqldatabase.h> #include <unistd.h> #include "torrentocracy.h" @@ -71,8 +70,7 @@ QString(".qm"), "."); qApp->installTranslator(&translator); - Torrentocracy news(QSqlDatabase::database(), - gContext->GetMainWindow(), "torrentocracy"); + Torrentocracy news(gContext->GetMainWindow(), "torrentocracy"); news.exec(); qApp->removeTranslator(&translator); @@ -92,8 +90,7 @@ QString(".qm"), "."); qApp->installTranslator(&translator); - TorrentocracyConfig config(QSqlDatabase::database(), - gContext->GetMainWindow(), "torrentocracy"); + TorrentocracyConfig config(gContext->GetMainWindow(), "torrentocracy"); config.exec(); qApp->removeTranslator(&translator); diff -Naur torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.cpp torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.cpp --- torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.cpp 2004-09-08 22:21:11.000000000 -0500 +++ torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.cpp 2005-02-26 18:36:07.296670239 -0600 @@ -22,7 +22,6 @@ #include <iostream> #include <qnetwork.h> -#include <qsqlquery.h> #include <qdatetime.h> #include <qpainter.h> #include <qdir.h> @@ -31,12 +30,15 @@ #include <qtimer.h> #include <qregexp.h> +#include <mythtv/mythcontext.h> +#include <mythtv/mythdbcon.h> + #include "torrentocracy.h" #include <mythtv/inetcomms.h> -Torrentocracy::Torrentocracy(QSqlDatabase *db, MythMainWindow *parent, +Torrentocracy::Torrentocracy(MythMainWindow *parent, const char *name ) - : MythDialog(parent, name), m_DB(db) + : MythDialog(parent, name) { qInitNetworkProtocols (); @@ -77,9 +79,9 @@ // Load sites from database - QSqlQuery query("SELECT name, url, updated FROM rssfeeds ORDER BY name", - db); - if (!query.isActive()) { + MSqlQuery query(MSqlQuery::InitCon()); + query.prepare("SELECT name, url, updated FROM rssfeeds ORDER BY name"); + if (!query.exec()) { cerr << "Torrentocracy: Error in loading Sites from DB" << endl; } else { @@ -824,11 +826,13 @@ { unsigned int updated = site->lastUpdated().toTime_t(); - QSqlQuery query("UPDATE rssfeeds SET updated=" + + MSqlQuery query(MSqlQuery::InitCon()); + + query.prepare("UPDATE rssfeeds SET updated=" + QString::number(updated) + " WHERE name='" + - site->name() + "'", m_DB); - if (!query.isActive()) { + site->name() + "'"); + if (!query.exec()) { cerr << "Torrentocracy: Error in updating time in DB" << endl; } diff -Naur torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.h torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.h --- torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.h 2004-08-21 13:11:06.000000000 -0500 +++ torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.h 2005-02-26 18:17:23.153785667 -0600 @@ -22,7 +22,6 @@ #ifndef TORRENTOCRACY_H #define TORRENTOCRACY_H -#include <qsqldatabase.h> #include <qtextbrowser.h> #include <mythtv/uitypes.h> @@ -44,7 +43,7 @@ public: - Torrentocracy(QSqlDatabase *db, MythMainWindow *parent, + Torrentocracy(MythMainWindow *parent, const char *name = 0); ~Torrentocracy(); @@ -83,7 +82,6 @@ int currentPage; - QSqlDatabase *m_DB; XMLParse *m_Theme; UIListBtnType *m_UISites; diff -Naur torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.cpp torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.cpp --- torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.cpp 2004-07-14 18:28:18.000000000 -0500 +++ torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.cpp 2005-02-26 18:34:58.640594081 -0600 @@ -22,6 +22,9 @@ #include <qapplication.h> #include <iostream> +#include <mythtv/mythcontext.h> +#include <mythtv/mythdbcon.h> + #include <qptrlist.h> #include <qstring.h> #include <qfile.h> @@ -92,12 +95,10 @@ // --------------------------------------------------- -TorrentocracyConfig::TorrentocracyConfig(QSqlDatabase *db, - MythMainWindow *parent, +TorrentocracyConfig::TorrentocracyConfig(MythMainWindow *parent, const char *name) : MythDialog(parent, name) { - m_db = db; m_priv = new TorrentocracyConfigPriv; m_updateFreqTimer = new QTimer(this); m_updateFreq = gContext->GetNumSetting("NewsUpdateFrequency", 30); @@ -112,7 +113,7 @@ " url VARCHAR(255) NOT NULL," " ico VARCHAR(255)," " updated INT UNSIGNED );"); - QSqlQuery query(QString::null, m_db); + MSqlQuery query(MSqlQuery::InitCon()); if (!query.exec(queryString)) { cerr << "TorrentocracyConfig: Error in creating sql table" << endl; } @@ -440,10 +441,11 @@ { bool val = false; - QSqlQuery query( "SELECT name FROM rssfeeds WHERE name='" - + name + "'", m_db); - if (!query.isActive()) { - cerr << "TorrentocracyConfig: Error in finding in DB" << endl; + MSqlQuery query(MSqlQuery::InitCon()); + query.prepare( "SELECT name FROM rssfeeds WHERE name='" + + name + "'"); + if (!query.exec()) { + cerr << "TorrentocracyConfig: Error in finding in DB: " << name << endl; return val; } @@ -458,16 +460,26 @@ if (findInDB(site->name)) return false; + QString s( QString("INSERT INTO rssfeeds " + " (name,category,url,ico) " + " VALUES( '") + + site->name + "', '" + + site->category + "', '" + + site->url + "', '" + + site->ico + "' );"); - QSqlQuery query( QString("INSERT INTO rssfeeds " + MSqlQuery query(MSqlQuery::InitCon()); + query.prepare( QString("INSERT INTO rssfeeds " " (name,category,url,ico) " " VALUES( '") + site->name + "', '" + site->category + "', '" + site->url + "', '" + site->ico + "' );"); - if (!query.isActive()) { + if (!query.exec()) { cerr << "TorrentocracyConfig: Error in inserting in DB" << endl; + //cerr << "name: " << site->name << " cat: " << site->category << " url: " << site->url << " ico: " << site->ico << endl; + //cerr << "query: " << s << endl; return false; } @@ -478,9 +490,10 @@ { if (!site) return false; - QSqlQuery query( "DELETE FROM rssfeeds WHERE name='" - + site->name + "'", m_db); - if (!query.isActive()) { + MSqlQuery query(MSqlQuery::InitCon()); + query.prepare( "DELETE FROM rssfeeds WHERE name='" + + site->name + "'"); + if (!query.exec()) { cerr << "TorrentocracyConfig: Error in Deleting from DB" << endl; return false; } diff -Naur torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.h torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.h --- torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.h 2004-07-14 18:28:18.000000000 -0500 +++ torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.h 2005-02-26 18:19:29.149650034 -0600 @@ -22,8 +22,6 @@ #ifndef TORRENTOCRACYCONFIG_H #define TORRENTOCRACYCONFIG_H -#include <qsqldatabase.h> - #include <mythtv/uitypes.h> #include <mythtv/uilistbtntype.h> #include <mythtv/xmlparse.h> @@ -54,8 +52,7 @@ public: - TorrentocracyConfig(QSqlDatabase *db, - MythMainWindow *parent, + TorrentocracyConfig(MythMainWindow *parent, const char *name = 0); ~TorrentocracyConfig();
> _______________________________________________ mythtv-users mailing list mythtv-users[at]mythtv.org http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users


dsmolka at gmail

Feb 27, 2005, 7:14 AM

Post #3 of 39 (9390 views)
Permalink
Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 20:39:27 -0600, Robert Denier <denier[at]umr.edu> wrote:
> I had thought this was not an accepted feature of the main myth
> developers...

I agree. While I'm willing to give mad respect to anyone who hacks
together a torrent plug-in, I don't think this is the place for it.
The developers and much of the myth community have made it clear that
torrents are NOT supported, not least because we want the machines and
the project that we spent so much time working on to remain to
free of legal burdens.

If you want to code a torrent plug-in, go for it. If you want to use
BT on another machine and transfer the files to your myth box, go for
it. But if you want to discuss the ways and means of getting torrents
to work natively on your mythbox, perhaps you should start a new
mailing list.

MythTV was not designed as a means of sharing content on the internet
(or stealing from poor, orphaned movie stars, depending on who you
listen to), and all of us would suffer if the project came to be
treated as such.

Talk about your hardware. Talk about the problems you had getting your
widget to work and how you solved the problems. Talk about bugs in the
new CVS. Talk about the importance of defeating the broadcast flag
before (or if) it comes into effect.

But please, please, please, please, lay off discussing torrents, at
least on official MythTV forums.

That said, nice patch.


lerhaupt at gmail

Feb 27, 2005, 1:42 PM

Post #4 of 39 (9401 views)
Permalink
Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

Thanks! Updated in my cvs. Keep em coming if you got em, it
certainly needs it :).

Gary


On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 17:19:58 -0800 (PST), John Miller
<john_miller5555[at]yahoo.com> wrote:
> Simple patch against the recent DB changes.
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Sports - Sign up for Fantasy Baseball.
> http://baseball.fantasysports.yahoo.com/
>
> diff -Naur torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/main.cpp torrentocracy/torrentocracy/main.cpp
> --- torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/main.cpp 2004-07-14 18:28:16.000000000 -0500
> +++ torrentocracy/torrentocracy/main.cpp 2005-02-26 18:19:01.951565143 -0600
> @@ -22,7 +22,6 @@
> #include <iostream>
>
> #include <qapplication.h>
> -#include <qsqldatabase.h>
> #include <unistd.h>
>
> #include "torrentocracy.h"
> @@ -71,8 +70,7 @@
> QString(".qm"), ".");
> qApp->installTranslator(&translator);
>
> - Torrentocracy news(QSqlDatabase::database(),
> - gContext->GetMainWindow(), "torrentocracy");
> + Torrentocracy news(gContext->GetMainWindow(), "torrentocracy");
> news.exec();
>
> qApp->removeTranslator(&translator);
> @@ -92,8 +90,7 @@
> QString(".qm"), ".");
> qApp->installTranslator(&translator);
>
> - TorrentocracyConfig config(QSqlDatabase::database(),
> - gContext->GetMainWindow(), "torrentocracy");
> + TorrentocracyConfig config(gContext->GetMainWindow(), "torrentocracy");
> config.exec();
>
> qApp->removeTranslator(&translator);
> diff -Naur torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.cpp torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.cpp
> --- torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.cpp 2004-09-08 22:21:11.000000000 -0500
> +++ torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.cpp 2005-02-26 18:36:07.296670239 -0600
> @@ -22,7 +22,6 @@
> #include <iostream>
>
> #include <qnetwork.h>
> -#include <qsqlquery.h>
> #include <qdatetime.h>
> #include <qpainter.h>
> #include <qdir.h>
> @@ -31,12 +30,15 @@
> #include <qtimer.h>
> #include <qregexp.h>
>
> +#include <mythtv/mythcontext.h>
> +#include <mythtv/mythdbcon.h>
> +
> #include "torrentocracy.h"
> #include <mythtv/inetcomms.h>
>
> -Torrentocracy::Torrentocracy(QSqlDatabase *db, MythMainWindow *parent,
> +Torrentocracy::Torrentocracy(MythMainWindow *parent,
> const char *name )
> - : MythDialog(parent, name), m_DB(db)
> + : MythDialog(parent, name)
> {
> qInitNetworkProtocols ();
>
> @@ -77,9 +79,9 @@
>
> // Load sites from database
>
> - QSqlQuery query("SELECT name, url, updated FROM rssfeeds ORDER BY name",
> - db);
> - if (!query.isActive()) {
> + MSqlQuery query(MSqlQuery::InitCon());
> + query.prepare("SELECT name, url, updated FROM rssfeeds ORDER BY name");
> + if (!query.exec()) {
> cerr << "Torrentocracy: Error in loading Sites from DB" << endl;
> }
> else {
> @@ -824,11 +826,13 @@
> {
> unsigned int updated = site->lastUpdated().toTime_t();
>
> - QSqlQuery query("UPDATE rssfeeds SET updated=" +
> + MSqlQuery query(MSqlQuery::InitCon());
> +
> + query.prepare("UPDATE rssfeeds SET updated=" +
> QString::number(updated) +
> " WHERE name='" +
> - site->name() + "'", m_DB);
> - if (!query.isActive()) {
> + site->name() + "'");
> + if (!query.exec()) {
> cerr << "Torrentocracy: Error in updating time in DB" << endl;
> }
>
> diff -Naur torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.h torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.h
> --- torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.h 2004-08-21 13:11:06.000000000 -0500
> +++ torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracy.h 2005-02-26 18:17:23.153785667 -0600
> @@ -22,7 +22,6 @@
> #ifndef TORRENTOCRACY_H
> #define TORRENTOCRACY_H
>
> -#include <qsqldatabase.h>
> #include <qtextbrowser.h>
>
> #include <mythtv/uitypes.h>
> @@ -44,7 +43,7 @@
>
> public:
>
> - Torrentocracy(QSqlDatabase *db, MythMainWindow *parent,
> + Torrentocracy(MythMainWindow *parent,
> const char *name = 0);
> ~Torrentocracy();
>
> @@ -83,7 +82,6 @@
>
> int currentPage;
>
> - QSqlDatabase *m_DB;
> XMLParse *m_Theme;
>
> UIListBtnType *m_UISites;
> diff -Naur torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.cpp torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.cpp
> --- torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.cpp 2004-07-14 18:28:18.000000000 -0500
> +++ torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.cpp 2005-02-26 18:34:58.640594081 -0600
> @@ -22,6 +22,9 @@
> #include <qapplication.h>
> #include <iostream>
>
> +#include <mythtv/mythcontext.h>
> +#include <mythtv/mythdbcon.h>
> +
> #include <qptrlist.h>
> #include <qstring.h>
> #include <qfile.h>
> @@ -92,12 +95,10 @@
>
> // ---------------------------------------------------
>
> -TorrentocracyConfig::TorrentocracyConfig(QSqlDatabase *db,
> - MythMainWindow *parent,
> +TorrentocracyConfig::TorrentocracyConfig(MythMainWindow *parent,
> const char *name)
> : MythDialog(parent, name)
> {
> - m_db = db;
> m_priv = new TorrentocracyConfigPriv;
> m_updateFreqTimer = new QTimer(this);
> m_updateFreq = gContext->GetNumSetting("NewsUpdateFrequency", 30);
> @@ -112,7 +113,7 @@
> " url VARCHAR(255) NOT NULL,"
> " ico VARCHAR(255),"
> " updated INT UNSIGNED );");
> - QSqlQuery query(QString::null, m_db);
> + MSqlQuery query(MSqlQuery::InitCon());
> if (!query.exec(queryString)) {
> cerr << "TorrentocracyConfig: Error in creating sql table" << endl;
> }
> @@ -440,10 +441,11 @@
> {
> bool val = false;
>
> - QSqlQuery query( "SELECT name FROM rssfeeds WHERE name='"
> - + name + "'", m_db);
> - if (!query.isActive()) {
> - cerr << "TorrentocracyConfig: Error in finding in DB" << endl;
> + MSqlQuery query(MSqlQuery::InitCon());
> + query.prepare( "SELECT name FROM rssfeeds WHERE name='"
> + + name + "'");
> + if (!query.exec()) {
> + cerr << "TorrentocracyConfig: Error in finding in DB: " << name << endl;
> return val;
> }
>
> @@ -458,16 +460,26 @@
>
> if (findInDB(site->name))
> return false;
> + QString s( QString("INSERT INTO rssfeeds "
> + " (name,category,url,ico) "
> + " VALUES( '") +
> + site->name + "', '" +
> + site->category + "', '" +
> + site->url + "', '" +
> + site->ico + "' );");
>
> - QSqlQuery query( QString("INSERT INTO rssfeeds "
> + MSqlQuery query(MSqlQuery::InitCon());
> + query.prepare( QString("INSERT INTO rssfeeds "
> " (name,category,url,ico) "
> " VALUES( '") +
> site->name + "', '" +
> site->category + "', '" +
> site->url + "', '" +
> site->ico + "' );");
> - if (!query.isActive()) {
> + if (!query.exec()) {
> cerr << "TorrentocracyConfig: Error in inserting in DB" << endl;
> + //cerr << "name: " << site->name << " cat: " << site->category << " url: " << site->url << " ico: " << site->ico << endl;
> + //cerr << "query: " << s << endl;
> return false;
> }
>
> @@ -478,9 +490,10 @@
> {
> if (!site) return false;
>
> - QSqlQuery query( "DELETE FROM rssfeeds WHERE name='"
> - + site->name + "'", m_db);
> - if (!query.isActive()) {
> + MSqlQuery query(MSqlQuery::InitCon());
> + query.prepare( "DELETE FROM rssfeeds WHERE name='"
> + + site->name + "'");
> + if (!query.exec()) {
> cerr << "TorrentocracyConfig: Error in Deleting from DB" << endl;
> return false;
> }
> diff -Naur torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.h torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.h
> --- torrentocracy-orig/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.h 2004-07-14 18:28:18.000000000 -0500
> +++ torrentocracy/torrentocracy/torrentocracyconfig.h 2005-02-26 18:19:29.149650034 -0600
> @@ -22,8 +22,6 @@
> #ifndef TORRENTOCRACYCONFIG_H
> #define TORRENTOCRACYCONFIG_H
>
> -#include <qsqldatabase.h>
> -
> #include <mythtv/uitypes.h>
> #include <mythtv/uilistbtntype.h>
> #include <mythtv/xmlparse.h>
> @@ -54,8 +52,7 @@
>
> public:
>
> - TorrentocracyConfig(QSqlDatabase *db,
> - MythMainWindow *parent,
> + TorrentocracyConfig(MythMainWindow *parent,
> const char *name = 0);
> ~TorrentocracyConfig();
>
>
>


lerhaupt at gmail

Feb 27, 2005, 2:16 PM

Post #5 of 39 (9387 views)
Permalink
Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

...
"The developers and much of the myth community have made it clear that
torrents are NOT supported, not least because we want the machines and
the project that we spent so much time working on to remain to
free of legal burdens."
...

This is really truly such an unfortunate attitude. I really
appreciate this patch. Many other myth users including yourself I'm
sure appreciate this patch. Bit torrent is not illegal technology.
No lawyer has yet to go after Bram Cohen. No lawyer has yet to go
after me. In fact, I don't think you could ask for a better
poster-child for the legal torrent community as the maintainer of this
project than myself (well, maybe Bram Cohen or the etree.org people)
and what I have done with prodigem.com (a bit torrent hosting service
for legal creative commons content). To avoid the controversy of even
discussing the words torrent and Myth in the same sentence is
kow-towing to the MPAA and is a little spineless.

Go take a look at the frontpage of lokitorrent.com. Hoax or not, it
says it all: There are websites that provide legal downloads. This is
not one of them.

Well, I run one of "them". Others run "them" too. There's lots of
good legal stuff out there and to not even tolerate discussion out of
fear is silly. Sure you can say that I can create my own mailing list
and perhaps I should, but it's really too bad that the same base group
of people can't make use of existing resources to discuss relavant
software.

Gary

On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:42:51 -0800, Gary Lerhaupt <lerhaupt[at]gmail.com> wrote:
> Thanks! Updated in my cvs. Keep em coming if you got em, it
> certainly needs it :).
>
> Gary
>
> On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 17:19:58 -0800 (PST), John Miller
> <john_miller5555[at]yahoo.com> wrote:
> > Simple patch against the recent DB changes.
> >


lists at forevermore

Feb 27, 2005, 2:26 PM

Post #6 of 39 (9383 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

> This is really truly such an unfortunate attitude. I really
> appreciate this patch. Many other myth users including yourself I'm
> sure appreciate this patch. Bit torrent is not illegal technology.

No, bittorrent is not illegal. Nor is mythtv. But combining them in
such a way that makes it blatantly easy for people to share tv
recordings will draw the same attention that Napster did (napster was
not illegal until people started using it to share copyrighted files --
no one cared about the people who were sharing legal recordings).

Perhaps I'm misunderstanding what torrentocracy does, but the general
sentiment is that the few people who are doing things the right way
(sharing legal content) will be overlooked as soon as someone starts
breaking the law. What we do as individuals is our own business, but
the mythtv developers have decided that we don't want to be seen as even
remotely supportive of this venture.

Now, maybe someone could figure out some kind of safeguard system to
prevent access to non-legal-torrent sites that would make Isaac feel
differently about such things, but that's between you and him.

-CHris
_______________________________________________
mythtv-users mailing list
mythtv-users[at]mythtv.org
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users


brad+myth at templetons

Feb 27, 2005, 2:48 PM

Post #7 of 39 (9382 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

On Sun, Feb 27, 2005 at 02:26:38PM -0800, Chris Petersen wrote:
> >This is really truly such an unfortunate attitude. I really
> >appreciate this patch. Many other myth users including yourself I'm
> >sure appreciate this patch. Bit torrent is not illegal technology.
>
> No, bittorrent is not illegal. Nor is mythtv. But combining them in
> such a way that makes it blatantly easy for people to share tv
> recordings will draw the same attention that Napster did (napster was
> not illegal until people started using it to share copyrighted files --
> no one cared about the people who were sharing legal recordings).

Napster operated a centralized server with a database of available files.
It was alleged that Napster, in planning their business, sat around and
discussed how they could get rich off all the unlawful filesharing that
would take place.

There are a lot of other differences in the Napster case. There are
differences in the Grokster/Morpheus case too, which we're going before
the supreme court in just over a month on, so I won't comment in detail,
but if you read our briefs you can see how we're defending the same
principles that kept the VCR legal.

Bittorrent is nothing more nor less than the best tool for distributing
large files for people who do not have massive bandwidth of their own.
As the best tool it is used by everybody who wants to distribute
large files -- both people who want to illicitly copy videos and those
who want to do independent movies and those who want to put out linux distros.

Whatever the best tool is, it will get used by the video pirates. As
such, there will be legal assaults _relating_ to it by the enemies of
the video pirates. However, organizations like ours continue to defend
the tools. We have not been called upon to defend bittorrent itself because
even the MPAA is smart enough to know that as a tool, it's clearly on
the legal side of the line.

If you say, "Let's stay away because of that" you are saying "let's stay
away from integrating the best tools."

Which is indeed the victory the MPAA wants.

> Now, maybe someone could figure out some kind of safeguard system to
> prevent access to non-legal-torrent sites that would make Isaac feel
> differently about such things, but that's between you and him.

That's pretty difficult, and actually might even open you up to more
legal liability. One reason Napster fell is the judge decided that if
they wanted to block a copyrighted song once they were told it was
a violation, it was within their power because they were in the center
of all directory searches and downloads. Power to block, the judge
suggested, could turn into duty to block.


jonathan.link at gmail

Feb 27, 2005, 2:59 PM

Post #8 of 39 (9386 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

Bottom line, this list is operated under the sufferance of the
developer(s). Though IANAD for Myth, I certainly understand their
desire to avoid the appearance of impropriety.
As with any OSS, develop add-ons and discuss them in another forum,
just respect the developers' wishes that this particular project and
others with similar functionality or purpose not be discussed HERE,
it's not blessed as being part of MythTV, so therefore should not be
discussed here. What's so hard to understand about that? No one is
restricting your rights to do with the software as you wish, all that
is being asked is that discussions, developments of Torrentocracy
et.al. be handled off this list.

Regards
-Jonathan


On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 14:48:46 -0800, Brad Templeton
<brad+myth[at]templetons.com> wrote:
> On Sun, Feb 27, 2005 at 02:26:38PM -0800, Chris Petersen wrote:
> > >This is really truly such an unfortunate attitude. I really
> > >appreciate this patch. Many other myth users including yourself I'm
> > >sure appreciate this patch. Bit torrent is not illegal technology.
> >
> > No, bittorrent is not illegal. Nor is mythtv. But combining them in
> > such a way that makes it blatantly easy for people to share tv
> > recordings will draw the same attention that Napster did (napster was
> > not illegal until people started using it to share copyrighted files --
> > no one cared about the people who were sharing legal recordings).
>
> Napster operated a centralized server with a database of available files.
> It was alleged that Napster, in planning their business, sat around and
> discussed how they could get rich off all the unlawful filesharing that
> would take place.
>
> There are a lot of other differences in the Napster case. There are
> differences in the Grokster/Morpheus case too, which we're going before
> the supreme court in just over a month on, so I won't comment in detail,
> but if you read our briefs you can see how we're defending the same
> principles that kept the VCR legal.
>
> Bittorrent is nothing more nor less than the best tool for distributing
> large files for people who do not have massive bandwidth of their own.
> As the best tool it is used by everybody who wants to distribute
> large files -- both people who want to illicitly copy videos and those
> who want to do independent movies and those who want to put out linux distros.
>
> Whatever the best tool is, it will get used by the video pirates. As
> such, there will be legal assaults _relating_ to it by the enemies of
> the video pirates. However, organizations like ours continue to defend
> the tools. We have not been called upon to defend bittorrent itself because
> even the MPAA is smart enough to know that as a tool, it's clearly on
> the legal side of the line.
>
> If you say, "Let's stay away because of that" you are saying "let's stay
> away from integrating the best tools."
>
> Which is indeed the victory the MPAA wants.
>
> > Now, maybe someone could figure out some kind of safeguard system to
> > prevent access to non-legal-torrent sites that would make Isaac feel
> > differently about such things, but that's between you and him.
>
> That's pretty difficult, and actually might even open you up to more
> legal liability. One reason Napster fell is the judge decided that if
> they wanted to block a copyrighted song once they were told it was
> a violation, it was within their power because they were in the center
> of all directory searches and downloads. Power to block, the judge
> suggested, could turn into duty to block.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users[at]mythtv.org
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>
>


joevph at yahoo

Feb 27, 2005, 4:19 PM

Post #9 of 39 (9380 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

BitTorrent is not illegal. We all know that.

Integrating BitTorrent into MythTV is not illegal.
Again, we all know that.

However, it is not us that you need to convince.

There are several groups out there (RIAA, MPAA and
others) who, if the plugin became official, might put
MythTV in their sights (more so than it already is).
Although MythTV doesn't do anything that is really
questionable, I'm sure that these groups are following
our progress.

That said, Isaac and a number of the developers are
located in the United States of America, where much of
this lobbying power is. It would be quite easy for
these groups to start putting pressure on Isaac and
the developers (who are named, thus easy to find).
It's not so much the threat of being arrested, it's
more the hassle of possibly having to defend yourself
against a possible lawsuit. Even if you were to win,
it could cost you hundreds of thousands of dollars and
ruin your life. There are a number of frivolous
lawsuits in the United States, they're very easy to
initiate.

If I was Isaac, and (I'm not saying that this has
happened, but...) I was contacted by lawyers, or given
a C&D (cease and desist) or anything like that, I'd
probably pull the plug on MythTV immediately. I don't
think that's what anybody wants. You may call it
spineless - I call it sensible.

Maybe it's for this reason, maybe it's for another
reason, I don't really know, as I don't know Isaac.
However, he has made it perfectly clear on more than
one occasion that MythTV is *NOT* an official plugin,
and that he does not want discussion about it on this
mailing list.

Simply put: It's his program, it's his mailing list,
it's his rules. While I disagree with some of the
things that he says, and the manner in which he says
them, the above still holds true. Please respect his
wishes. Feel free to hack on the plugin yourself, but
post the patches elsewhere.

-- Joe

--- Gary Lerhaupt <lerhaupt[at]gmail.com> wrote:

> ...
> "The developers and much of the myth community have
> made it clear that
> torrents are NOT supported, not least because we
> want the machines and
> the project that we spent so much time working on to
> remain to
> free of legal burdens."
> ...
>
> This is really truly such an unfortunate attitude.
> I really
> appreciate this patch. Many other myth users
> including yourself I'm
> sure appreciate this patch. Bit torrent is not
> illegal technology.
> No lawyer has yet to go after Bram Cohen. No lawyer
> has yet to go
> after me. In fact, I don't think you could ask for
> a better
> poster-child for the legal torrent community as the
> maintainer of this
> project than myself (well, maybe Bram Cohen or the
> etree.org people)
> and what I have done with prodigem.com (a bit
> torrent hosting service
> for legal creative commons content). To avoid the
> controversy of even
> discussing the words torrent and Myth in the same
> sentence is
> kow-towing to the MPAA and is a little spineless.
>
> Go take a look at the frontpage of lokitorrent.com.
> Hoax or not, it
> says it all: There are websites that provide legal
> downloads. This is
> not one of them.
>
> Well, I run one of "them". Others run "them" too.
> There's lots of
> good legal stuff out there and to not even tolerate
> discussion out of
> fear is silly. Sure you can say that I can create
> my own mailing list
> and perhaps I should, but it's really too bad that
> the same base group
> of people can't make use of existing resources to
> discuss relavant
> software.
>
> Gary
>
> On Sun, 27 Feb 2005 13:42:51 -0800, Gary Lerhaupt
> <lerhaupt[at]gmail.com> wrote:
> > Thanks! Updated in my cvs. Keep em coming if you
> got em, it
> > certainly needs it :).
> >
> > Gary
> >
> > On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 17:19:58 -0800 (PST), John
> Miller
> > <john_miller5555[at]yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > Simple patch against the recent DB changes.
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users[at]mythtv.org
>
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>




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denier at umr

Feb 27, 2005, 4:59 PM

Post #10 of 39 (9395 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

The only way I can think that sharing TV programs would not annoy the
powers that be would possibly be if you were forced to watch, or at
least let play a set of commericials.

To be honest I don't think that is possible to fully secure unless you
use non general purpose hardware for the playback.

For instance, the hardware might be something like special monitors
where the decryption keys get negotiated via public key encryption.
Other essential information like key parts of the video stream could be
sent via the established private keys. If a hardware hack occured on a
specific version of the hardware you could tell the main server for that
tv program to not talk to hardware that has the associated key pairs.
Basically your then looking at some kind of access card for your
monitors that can be upgraded.

Where then does the sharing become useful? Well you could transfer most
of the video data that way, but to keep the system reasonably secure and
reduce hacks each playback would have to negotiate with the server to
recompute the decryption keys and maybe key parts of the video stream
for the monitor's decryption hardware to finish reconstructing the
video.

Would the public accept this? Not easily, since there will be lots of
unencrypted material out there.

Is such a design unbreakable? Nope, you could at worst film the
monitor, or if you took apart the monitor and found a way to grab the
decrypted signal or the key once computed then the game is over. Of
course lots of lawsuits and such would likely keep that in check.

Things should get interesting once broadband is as common as regular
phone service. I rather suspect something around these lines will
attempt to be forced on the public.


lists at forevermore

Feb 28, 2005, 12:00 AM

Post #11 of 39 (9373 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

> The only way I can think that sharing TV programs would not annoy the
> powers that be would possibly be if you were forced to watch, or at
> least let play a set of commericials.

It'd never happen. Commercials are targetted regionally. You don't
want to send a Safeway commercial to viewers in Chicago, any more than
you'd want a Jewel commercial sent out to the west coast. Not to
mention the small-retailer commercials on your local stations -- they
don't have any need for national coverage, and would put their money
elsewhere (radio, print ads, etc) if they were forced to because the
stations decided that because shows were being shared nationally, they
should charge the national-coverage fee.

Nothing we could do with FOSS software would make the networks happy --
the "free and open" part gets in the way of their being able to control
what we'd do with it. Even if the official MythTV project implemented
DRM, someone could just fork the project and produce a non-drm version
-- and we'd all happily switch over to using it (just look at what
happened when XFree86 changed their license -- most people are using
X.org now)

Personally, if Torrentocracy really is ONLY about sharing free-and-legal
shows, I wouldn't mind seeing it become accepted into the official
mythtv plugins list. But right now, as I understand it, it's just too
easy to be construed as a tool for piracy. One user picked up by an
automated filename-matching bot and found to be using mythtv +
officially-sanctioned-torrentocracy for sharing a copyrighted program
and the mythtv devs are submersed into a legal battle that they didn't
want or need. It's just not worth the risk/effort at the moment. But
like I said, I'd love to see some safeguards installed, or something
like that, to make it "safe" for people to use as an officially
sanctioned plugin. I still don't see that happening anytime soon.

-Chris

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mythtv-users mailing list
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http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users


simon at koala

Feb 28, 2005, 3:02 AM

Post #12 of 39 (9343 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

On Monday 28 February 2005 08:00, Chris Petersen wrote:
> > The only way I can think that sharing TV programs would not annoy the
> > powers that be would possibly be if you were forced to watch, or at
> > least let play a set of commericials.
how about sharing the locations of the commercials?

would need a way of accurately setting time - or a hash of the frames
a bit like cddb - somebody does an accurate commerical cut and then sends it
to a central repository

now that would be cool
--
simon
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samsara at tulsaconnect

Feb 28, 2005, 8:45 AM

Post #13 of 39 (9351 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

> easy to be construed as a tool for piracy. One user picked up by an
> automated filename-matching bot and found to be using mythtv +
> officially-sanctioned-torrentocracy for sharing a copyrighted program

When this comes up, may we use a word other than "copyrighted" to
represent the program content of Hollywood? Most works are copyrighted,
but a substantial portion (particularly in computing) are available
under free licenses.

MythTV is copyrighted, but the GPL makes for a wonderful freedom to
share it.

This reminds me of how the press perverted the word "hacker".
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lists at forevermore

Feb 28, 2005, 10:13 AM

Post #14 of 39 (9348 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

> When this comes up, may we use a word other than "copyrighted" to
> represent the program content of Hollywood? Most works are copyrighted,
> but a substantial portion (particularly in computing) are available
> under free licenses.

I generally use copyright vs copyleft. GPL is copyleft. Don't know how
else to describe not-free-for-sharing content without using lots of hyphens.

-Chris
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matt at mattorama

Mar 2, 2005, 8:49 AM

Post #15 of 39 (9325 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

Brad Templeton wrote:
>
> If you say, "Let's stay away because of that" you are saying "let's stay
> away from integrating the best tools."
>
> Which is indeed the victory the MPAA wants.
>

It's good to hear at least one voice of reason on this list when it
comes to torrents.

The idea that this project is somehow under the radar of the
MPAA/RIAA/whoever just because we don't do torrents easily is ridiculous
and the attitude of people here toward Torrentocracy in particular is
just dumb.
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mavantix at gmail

Mar 2, 2005, 11:14 PM

Post #16 of 39 (9325 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

> how about sharing the locations of the commercials?
>
> would need a way of accurately setting time - or a hash of the frames
> a bit like cddb - somebody does an accurate commerical cut and then sends it
> to a central repository
>
> now that would be cool

You must be on the same wave length of me and my friends. We where
recently talking about this functionality, so only the first person
mark commercials (manual, ie, not auto flagged) and submit their
locations to the network. Then everyone else has perfectly commercial
free viewing. For any time that show ever airs, it's likely to be the
same too.

THE MAN would definitely dislike this idea, and IANAL, but I certainly
can't seeing it being illegal. There's no obligation to watching
commercials or using any sort of technology to skip them, as far as I
know.

Issac already expressed he doesn't want any technology that's central
server centric (ala Napster was), at least that's the way I understood
his post about that. Maybe I misunderstood.

-Kenneth


brad+myth at templetons

Mar 2, 2005, 11:53 PM

Post #17 of 39 (9341 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

On Thu, Mar 03, 2005 at 02:14:58AM -0500, Maverick wrote:
> You must be on the same wave length of me and my friends. We where
> recently talking about this functionality, so only the first person
> mark commercials (manual, ie, not auto flagged) and submit their
> locations to the network. Then everyone else has perfectly commercial
> free viewing. For any time that show ever airs, it's likely to be the
> same too.

You will find this suggestion from me in a number of threads in the
past (I think I first suggested it to the Replay guys 5 years ago but
they never did anything with it.) It will happen.
>
> THE MAN would definitely dislike this idea, and IANAL, but I certainly
> can't seeing it being illegal. There's no obligation to watching
> commercials or using any sort of technology to skip them, as far as I
> know.

Actually, where it would come in handy is not just commercials (which
software today can detect) but other things like pitching changes, boring
academy awards acceptance speeches, long driving scenes to no purpose etc.
>
> Issac already expressed he doesn't want any technology that's central
> server centric (ala Napster was), at least that's the way I understood
> his post about that. Maybe I misunderstood.

Actually what he said recently that sounded like this was that what he meant
was he wants to insist that a recommendation system be centralized on his
personal server.


simon at koala

Mar 3, 2005, 7:14 AM

Post #18 of 39 (9332 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

On Thursday 03 March 2005 07:14, Maverick wrote:
> > how about sharing the locations of the commercials?
> >
> > would need a way of accurately setting time - or a hash of the frames
> > a bit like cddb - somebody does an accurate commerical cut and then sends
> > it to a central repository
> >
> > now that would be cool
>
> You must be on the same wave length of me and my friends. We where
> recently talking about this functionality, so only the first person
> mark commercials (manual, ie, not auto flagged) and submit their
> locations to the network. Then everyone else has perfectly commercial
> free viewing. For any time that show ever airs, it's likely to be the
> same too.
>
> THE MAN would definitely dislike this idea, and IANAL, but I certainly
> can't seeing it being illegal. There's no obligation to watching
> commercials or using any sort of technology to skip them, as far as I
> know.

that sort of makes it worth doing - doesn't it :-)
>
> Issac already expressed he doesn't want any technology that's central
> server centric (ala Napster was), at least that's the way I understood
> his post about that. Maybe I misunderstood.
>
> -Kenneth

we use freedb, imdb and amazon already - so the point is moot
all you would need is:

channel, date and time (though additional info like program title might help)
what would be returned would be a set of cut point
you would probably need to be able to slide them around as a group to cater
for time differences
--
simon
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kuphal at dls

Mar 3, 2005, 7:32 AM

Post #19 of 39 (9303 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

Simon Kenyon wrote:

>we use freedb, imdb and amazon already - so the point is moot
>all you would need is:
>
>
None of those are hosted, operated, or under the control of anyone
related to MythTV which was the point being made.

Kevin
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garrycook at gmail

Mar 3, 2005, 7:39 AM

Post #20 of 39 (9309 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

On Thu, 03 Mar 2005 09:32:07 -0600, Kevin Kuphal <kuphal[at]dls.net> wrote:
> Simon Kenyon wrote:
>
> >we use freedb, imdb and amazon already - so the point is moot
> >all you would need is:
> >
> >
> None of those are hosted, operated, or under the control of anyone
> related to MythTV which was the point being made.
>
> Kevin

This might be a pie in the sky idea, but since we are talking about
commercials and information about them being stored centrally and/or
distributed, I thought I might throw out this wish-list item.

I've had my MythTV box up for a little over a week now, and one thing
that really kills me is when I see a commercial (watching live TV of
course) for a program that is of interest. What do I do? Stop watching
and go schedule it? Write it down on a list I keep on the coffee
table? It would be great if I could just hit a button and have the
program touted in the commercial scheduled.

Naturally, this might require information about the program to be
stored in the stream, which probably does not exist. That's why this
is a true wish-list item and not a feature request/idea.

Perhaps the TWish beta that's being talked about will help with this
issue, but wow, wouldn't that just be the nutz?!?!

Garry


jcaputo1 at comcast

Mar 3, 2005, 7:47 AM

Post #21 of 39 (9318 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

On Thursday 03 March 2005 10:39, Garry Cook wrote:
>
> I've had my MythTV box up for a little over a week now, and one thing
> that really kills me is when I see a commercial (watching live TV of
> course) for a program that is of interest. What do I do? Stop watching
> and go schedule it? Write it down on a list I keep on the coffee
> table? It would be great if I could just hit a button and have the
> program touted in the commercial scheduled.
>
> Naturally, this might require information about the program to be
> stored in the stream, which probably does not exist. That's why this
> is a true wish-list item and not a feature request/idea.
>
> Perhaps the TWish beta that's being talked about will help with this
> issue, but wow, wouldn't that just be the nutz?!?!

Wouldn't even need anything so fancy -- just the ability to navigate
around some Myth menus without exiting the recording I'm watching.
LiveTV already does this wrt the EPG.

-JAC
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mavantix at gmail

Mar 3, 2005, 7:50 AM

Post #22 of 39 (9317 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

> You will find this suggestion from me in a number of threads in the
> past (I think I first suggested it to the Replay guys 5 years ago but
> they never did anything with it.) It will happen.
>
> Actually, where it would come in handy is not just commercials (which
> software today can detect) but other things like pitching changes, boring
> academy awards acceptance speeches, long driving scenes to no purpose etc.

That's cool. Of course implementing this using a central server of
some sort will be easier. Is the MythTV project (users) opposed to
server centric information sharing, such as flagged commercials?

> >
> > Issac already expressed he doesn't want any technology that's central
> > server centric (ala Napster was), at least that's the way I understood
> > his post about that. Maybe I misunderstood.
>
> Actually what he said recently that sounded like this was that what he meant
> was he wants to insist that a recommendation system be centralized on his
> personal server.

Ahh, thanks for the clarification.

-Kenneth


mavantix at gmail

Mar 3, 2005, 7:55 AM

Post #23 of 39 (9305 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

> we use freedb, imdb and amazon already - so the point is moot
> all you would need is:
>
> channel, date and time (though additional info like program title might help)
> what would be returned would be a set of cut point
> you would probably need to be able to slide them around as a group to cater
> for time differences

Well, if it could use a key frame signature then the time frame
adjustment could be automatic. But the key frame detection would have
to be smart enough to compensate for varying signal qualities...

-Kenneth


shaul.kedem at gmail

Mar 3, 2005, 8:18 AM

Post #24 of 39 (9322 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

"Actually, where it would come in handy is not just commercials (which
software today can detect) but other things like pitching changes, boring
academy awards acceptance speeches, long driving scenes to no purpose etc."

This gives me an idea.. how about having more than one sort of "flag"?

- Over 18 flag
- Boring car chases flag
- Commercial flag
- ...

This way if you want to see something all you need to do is say what
sections to remove according to the flags and away you go....




On Wed, 2 Mar 2005 23:53:39 -0800, Brad Templeton
<brad+myth[at]templetons.com> wrote:
> On Thu, Mar 03, 2005 at 02:14:58AM -0500, Maverick wrote:
> > You must be on the same wave length of me and my friends. We where
> > recently talking about this functionality, so only the first person
> > mark commercials (manual, ie, not auto flagged) and submit their
> > locations to the network. Then everyone else has perfectly commercial
> > free viewing. For any time that show ever airs, it's likely to be the
> > same too.
>
> You will find this suggestion from me in a number of threads in the
> past (I think I first suggested it to the Replay guys 5 years ago but
> they never did anything with it.) It will happen.
> >
> > THE MAN would definitely dislike this idea, and IANAL, but I certainly
> > can't seeing it being illegal. There's no obligation to watching
> > commercials or using any sort of technology to skip them, as far as I
> > know.
>
> Actually, where it would come in handy is not just commercials (which
> software today can detect) but other things like pitching changes, boring
> academy awards acceptance speeches, long driving scenes to no purpose etc.
> >
> > Issac already expressed he doesn't want any technology that's central
> > server centric (ala Napster was), at least that's the way I understood
> > his post about that. Maybe I misunderstood.
>
> Actually what he said recently that sounded like this was that what he meant
> was he wants to insist that a recommendation system be centralized on his
> personal server.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-users mailing list
> mythtv-users[at]mythtv.org
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-users
>
>
>


lists at forevermore

Mar 3, 2005, 8:53 AM

Post #25 of 39 (9308 views)
Permalink
Re: Re: Torrentocracy Patch against Mythtv-cvs [In reply to]

> a.) every instance of the show puts the commercials in the same place
> b.) the same show airing on different channels have the commercials in the
> same place (SkyONE has radically different commercial placement than, say,
> the sciFI channel).
> c.) the commercials are the same length (could be gotten around by looking
> at content on either side of commercials).

This is pretty standard -- shows are edited such that there are
commercial breaks in certain places. However, it does NOT account for
the commercial breaks being the same length in each region (remember,
commercials are regional things).

Also, don't forget that some people record before/after shows, and myth
is never 100% accurate in the time you give it (I'm set to record an
additional 2.5 minutes on each show, and my recordings are anywhere from
1.5 to 3.5 minutes longer than the show runs)

And how would you pick which commercial flags to use? My flagging is
rather inaccurate on about half of my shows, and I go in and clean up
ALL of my shows (almost every flag needs to be moved at least a few
frames one direction or another). Importing a flag list is useless to
me if no one else shares my desire for perfect commercial cutting.

As for whether users "want" it or not -- that's easy, you just add a
flag (default to off) for auto-sending/getting, and/or make it a manual
choice -- just like "transcode" is now.

-Chris
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