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Proposed Change to MythMusic

 

 

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mythtv at colin

Jul 11, 2007, 2:59 PM

Post #26 of 36 (1404 views)
Permalink
Re: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

Steven Adeff wrote:
> On 7/11/07, Daniel Di Giacomo <lists [at] dadigi> wrote:
>>> Some have said Amarok is a good model for a music player but last time
>>> I looked at that it didn't seem at all viable for mythtv - it relies
>>> on small fonts & cramming a lot of information on screen, and it's
>>> hardly very remote friendly. That part is very easy to forget.
>> Maybe something like AmarokFS
>> (http://www.kde-apps.org/content/show.php?content=52641) could be an
>> solution. But this would mean to let mythmusic act as a frontend to
>> amarok, and I don't think that this is the approach of mythtv-developers.
>
> the problem with amarok is it has limited db abilities so very little
> tag information is stored there. or at least thats the way it looks.
>

This Myth/amarok hybrid has been suggested several times. I'm a regular
reader of the Amarok mailing list and people have been wanting this to
happen for a long time.

I think we have to think wider and not think about integrating Myth with
amarok or Amarok with Myth, but rather think about rebasing both
projects on a common base with Standards to rule it. Only by doing this
will you get the ultimate solution.

I've posed two other mails on exactly this subject tonight on this list
so I wont repeat it here, please look for my other posts and reply there
for more discussion!

Col

--

+------------------------+
| Colin Guthrie |
+------------------------+
| myth(at)colin.guthr.ie |
| http://colin.guthr.ie/ |
+------------------------+
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kraney at kraney

Jul 11, 2007, 3:37 PM

Post #27 of 36 (1380 views)
Permalink
Re: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

When it comes to managing playlists, the main thing I want is not to
have to sit around and do it all up front before I can listen to music.

What I want is to create a playlist prepopulated with all my music
(or prepopulated with a smart query,) and give it a name. Then I want
an easy way to drop songs out of the list while it's playing.

For example, I might create a playlist called 'Mellow', and start it
playing. Any time a song came on I thought didn't fit the mood, I'd
push a button and drop it off the playlist (not just skip it.) Over
time, the list would become correct. Of course, if I have to hunt
around menus to get it off the playlist, this technique becomes too
annoying to be useful. It should just be a button, or maybe a 2
button sequence to avoid accidental removals.

A bonus would be the ability to remove an entire album at once, in
response to a single song from that album.

- Kris Raney
------------------------------------------------------------------------
------
Perhaps, if I am very lucky, the feeble efforts of my
lifetime will someday be noticed, and maybe, in some small
way, they will be acknowledged as the greatest works of
genius ever created by Man.
-- Deep Thoughts by Jack Handey [SNL]


dburr at veritel

Jul 11, 2007, 3:53 PM

Post #28 of 36 (1387 views)
Permalink
Re: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

On Wed, 2007-07-11 at 17:37 -0500, Kris Raney wrote:
> For example, I might create a playlist called 'Mellow', and start it
> playing. Any time a song came on I thought didn't fit the mood, I'd
> push a button and drop it off the playlist (not just skip it.) Over
> time, the list would become correct. Of course, if I have to hunt
> around menus to get it off the playlist, this technique becomes too
> annoying to be useful. It should just be a button, or maybe a 2 button
> sequence to avoid accidental removals.
>
> A bonus would be the ability to remove an entire album at once, in
> response to a single song from that album.

I would propose that when a song is selected by pressing enter a menu pops up instead of playing that song immediately.
If the selected song is not on a playlist, then the menu options are "Listen Now", "Add to end of playlist", "Add as next song in playlist".
If the current song is in a playlist then the options can be "Listen Now", "Remove song from playlist" and "Remove this album from playlist".

If I can find the time I'll try doing this tonight.

DB

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g8ecj at gilks

Jul 12, 2007, 1:43 AM

Post #29 of 36 (1366 views)
Permalink
Re: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

> On Wed, 2007-07-11 at 17:37 -0500, Kris Raney wrote:
>> For example, I might create a playlist called 'Mellow', and start it
>> playing. Any time a song came on I thought didn't fit the mood, I'd
>> push a button and drop it off the playlist (not just skip it.) Over
>> time, the list would become correct. Of course, if I have to hunt
>> around menus to get it off the playlist, this technique becomes too
>> annoying to be useful. It should just be a button, or maybe a 2 button
>> sequence to avoid accidental removals.
>>
>> A bonus would be the ability to remove an entire album at once, in
>> response to a single song from that album.
>
> I would propose that when a song is selected by pressing enter a menu pops
> up instead of playing that song immediately.
> If the selected song is not on a playlist, then the menu options are
> "Listen Now", "Add to end of playlist", "Add as next song in playlist".
> If the current song is in a playlist then the options can be "Listen Now",
> "Remove song from playlist" and "Remove this album from playlist".
>
> If I can find the time I'll try doing this tonight.
>

I'll certainly test anything along those lines that you come up with. The
current setup has an almost zero WAF due to having to remember to press
'3' to get into the playlist editor and the 'all music' selection is a
left-up-right key sequence to even get to the top of the tree. The tree
could do with expanding as well into say 2 letters per line or maybe based
on the number of albums/tracks in each 'pigeon hole'?


--
Robin Gilks

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stuarta at squashedfrog

Jul 12, 2007, 9:14 AM

Post #30 of 36 (1360 views)
Permalink
Re: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

Daniel Burr wrote:
> On Wed, 2007-07-11 at 17:37 -0500, Kris Raney wrote:
>> For example, I might create a playlist called 'Mellow', and start it
>> playing. Any time a song came on I thought didn't fit the mood, I'd
>> push a button and drop it off the playlist (not just skip it.) Over
>> time, the list would become correct. Of course, if I have to hunt
>> around menus to get it off the playlist, this technique becomes too
>> annoying to be useful. It should just be a button, or maybe a 2 button
>> sequence to avoid accidental removals.
>>
>> A bonus would be the ability to remove an entire album at once, in
>> response to a single song from that album.
>
> I would propose that when a song is selected by pressing enter a menu pops up instead of playing that song immediately.
> If the selected song is not on a playlist, then the menu options are "Listen Now", "Add to end of playlist", "Add as next song in playlist".
> If the current song is in a playlist then the options can be "Listen Now", "Remove song from playlist" and "Remove this album from playlist".
>

There's two schools of thought on this.
1) replace the currently playing song with the one i select
2) add the selected song to the end of the list.

#1 is current behaviour.
#2 is what i call DJ mode, or party mode.

Let's face it, you are only ever going to be using one or the other
at any one time, so it makes more sense to make it switch between
them.

There are further things you should then be able to do in DJ mode,
(in fact anytime you need playlist manipulation) like move songs
up/down in the list, push to the front of the queue, remove etc etc.


That's enough rambling for now....


Stuart
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adeffs.mythtv at gmail

Jul 12, 2007, 12:57 PM

Post #31 of 36 (1382 views)
Permalink
Re: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

On 7/12/07, Stuart Auchterlonie <stuarta [at] squashedfrog> wrote:
> Daniel Burr wrote:
> > On Wed, 2007-07-11 at 17:37 -0500, Kris Raney wrote:
> >> For example, I might create a playlist called 'Mellow', and start it
> >> playing. Any time a song came on I thought didn't fit the mood, I'd
> >> push a button and drop it off the playlist (not just skip it.) Over
> >> time, the list would become correct. Of course, if I have to hunt
> >> around menus to get it off the playlist, this technique becomes too
> >> annoying to be useful. It should just be a button, or maybe a 2 button
> >> sequence to avoid accidental removals.
> >>
> >> A bonus would be the ability to remove an entire album at once, in
> >> response to a single song from that album.
> >
> > I would propose that when a song is selected by pressing enter a menu pops up instead of playing that song immediately.
> > If the selected song is not on a playlist, then the menu options are "Listen Now", "Add to end of playlist", "Add as next song in playlist".
> > If the current song is in a playlist then the options can be "Listen Now", "Remove song from playlist" and "Remove this album from playlist".
> >
>
> There's two schools of thought on this.
> 1) replace the currently playing song with the one i select
> 2) add the selected song to the end of the list.
>
> #1 is current behaviour.
> #2 is what i call DJ mode, or party mode.
>
> Let's face it, you are only ever going to be using one or the other
> at any one time, so it makes more sense to make it switch between
> them.
>
> There are further things you should then be able to do in DJ mode,
> (in fact anytime you need playlist manipulation) like move songs
> up/down in the list, push to the front of the queue, remove etc etc.
>
>
> That's enough rambling for now....

how about:
clicking "select" on the track pops up a menu that lets you choose,
clicking "play" performs a either action as set by a default option.

--
Steve
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roo.watt at gmail

Jul 13, 2007, 6:08 AM

Post #32 of 36 (1361 views)
Permalink
Re: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

On 12/07/07, Steven Adeff <adeffs.mythtv [at] gmail> wrote:

> So basically Smart Playlists.
>
> Of course, all this is dependent on proper tagging and full db support
> for all the id3v2.x fields.


So basically yeah, Smart Playlists. :)

But allowing the user to build the tree that organises *their* music
collection the way that make most sense to them. Merging the
collection browsing with the playlist editing makes great sense to me.

Cheers,

Roo
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roo.watt at gmail

Jul 13, 2007, 6:19 AM

Post #33 of 36 (1361 views)
Permalink
Re: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

On 13/07/07, Stuart Auchterlonie <stuarta [at] squashedfrog> wrote:

> There's two schools of thought on this.
> 1) replace the currently playing song with the one i select
> 2) add the selected song to the end of the list.
>
> #1 is current behaviour.
> #2 is what i call DJ mode, or party mode.

Being able to "lock on" DJ mode would be great, so if you are having a
party you can stop people exiting a messing with the rest of your
mythtv recordings etc.

Come to think of it, in DJ mode you would want to stop the same song
getting scheduled multiple times and prevent user B deleting user A's
song from the playlist "cos they a sh*t".


Cheers,

Roo
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adeffs.mythtv at gmail

Jul 13, 2007, 11:13 AM

Post #34 of 36 (1350 views)
Permalink
Re: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

On 7/13/07, Roo <roo.watt [at] gmail> wrote:
> On 12/07/07, Steven Adeff <adeffs.mythtv [at] gmail> wrote:
>
> > So basically Smart Playlists.
> >
> > Of course, all this is dependent on proper tagging and full db support
> > for all the id3v2.x fields.
>
>
> So basically yeah, Smart Playlists. :)
>
> But allowing the user to build the tree that organises *their* music
> collection the way that make most sense to them. Merging the
> collection browsing with the playlist editing makes great sense to me.

I agree. I rather like how XBMC does that actually. you can browse
music, hit a button and see the playlist, hit it again and go back to
browsing. To add a track to the playlist while in browse mode you hit
another button, which i think defaults to "0". Similarly to that, and
how shuffle/viz/random are now, things could be mapped to the number
buttons.

On 7/13/07, Roo <roo.watt [at] gmail> wrote:
> On 13/07/07, Stuart Auchterlonie <stuarta [at] squashedfrog> wrote:
> > There's two schools of thought on this.
> > 1) replace the currently playing song with the one i select
> > 2) add the selected song to the end of the list.
> >
> > #1 is current behaviour.
> > #2 is what i call DJ mode, or party mode.
>
> Being able to "lock on" DJ mode would be great, so if you are having a
> party you can stop people exiting a messing with the rest of your
> mythtv recordings etc.
>
> Come to think of it, in DJ mode you would want to stop the same song
> getting scheduled multiple times and prevent user B deleting user A's
> song from the playlist "cos they a sh*t".

a DJ mode would be great, especially if you can control it via
MythWeb, so you could just have the visualization up on the tv and do
any dj management via a laptop or similar.

--
Steve
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guido.grazioli at gmail

Jul 14, 2007, 8:30 AM

Post #35 of 36 (1330 views)
Permalink
Re: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

Hello all,

i'm relatively new to mythtv, but let me explain my point of view:
mythmusic should be left as simple as possible and should
not depend neither on good id3 tagging nor external
tools/ways of managing music metainfo.

The action itself of "creating a playlist" or "modify a playlist content"
in its intrinsic complexity is way too much for a *home* (in the sense
of living room) media system.

My idea is that of playlists working as keyword tagging works in blogs;
each song can be tagged with any keyword (press SELECT ->
play it; press MENU -> dialog with multiselect box of existing tags
and textbox to add a new one).

So for instance if i have that song:
"Bela Fleck & The Flecktones - Sinister Minister"
i can tag it with
"wooten" (the bass player), "original soundtrack" and/or "fusion"
without touching id3 tags.

The best in that case would be doubling the height of each row
in song listings looking as follows:
04. Bela Fleck & The Flecktones - Sinister Minister (big font)
[wooten] [fusion] [awesome] (smaller one)

So creating playlists would be as easy as to check on/off all defined
tags and possibly, placing them in AND or OR relation. Actually the
list of songs tagged with a keyword *is* already a playlist.

Sorry if my contribution is a duplicate or just stupid,
as i said i'm new to mythtv and theres alot of material to read.


Guido

2007/7/13, Steven Adeff <adeffs.mythtv [at] gmail>:
> On 7/13/07, Roo <roo.watt [at] gmail> wrote:
> > On 12/07/07, Steven Adeff <adeffs.mythtv [at] gmail> wrote:
> >
> > > So basically Smart Playlists.
> > >
> > > Of course, all this is dependent on proper tagging and full db support
> > > for all the id3v2.x fields.
> >
> >
> > So basically yeah, Smart Playlists. :)
> >
> > But allowing the user to build the tree that organises *their* music
> > collection the way that make most sense to them. Merging the
> > collection browsing with the playlist editing makes great sense to me.
>
> I agree. I rather like how XBMC does that actually. you can browse
> music, hit a button and see the playlist, hit it again and go back to
> browsing. To add a track to the playlist while in browse mode you hit
> another button, which i think defaults to "0". Similarly to that, and
> how shuffle/viz/random are now, things could be mapped to the number
> buttons.
>
> On 7/13/07, Roo <roo.watt [at] gmail> wrote:
> > On 13/07/07, Stuart Auchterlonie <stuarta [at] squashedfrog> wrote:
> > > There's two schools of thought on this.
> > > 1) replace the currently playing song with the one i select
> > > 2) add the selected song to the end of the list.
> > >
> > > #1 is current behaviour.
> > > #2 is what i call DJ mode, or party mode.
> >
> > Being able to "lock on" DJ mode would be great, so if you are having a
> > party you can stop people exiting a messing with the rest of your
> > mythtv recordings etc.
> >
> > Come to think of it, in DJ mode you would want to stop the same song
> > getting scheduled multiple times and prevent user B deleting user A's
> > song from the playlist "cos they a sh*t".
>
> a DJ mode would be great, especially if you can control it via
> MythWeb, so you could just have the visualization up on the tv and do
> any dj management via a laptop or similar.
>
> --
> Steve
> _______________________________________________
> mythtv-dev mailing list
> mythtv-dev [at] mythtv
> http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev
>


----------------------------
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48011 - Alfonsine (RA)
Italy
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roo.watt at gmail

Jul 14, 2007, 4:07 PM

Post #36 of 36 (1324 views)
Permalink
Re: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

On 15/07/07, Guido Grazioli <guido.grazioli [at] gmail> wrote:

> My idea is that of playlists working as keyword tagging works in blogs;
> each song can be tagged with any keyword (press SELECT ->
> play it; press MENU -> dialog with multiselect box of existing tags
> and textbox to add a new one).

I think it would make sense to be able to supplement the tags with
user specified data like you have suggested. I have been interested in
doing this myself.

My wife has a reasonable amount of 80's music, I have a broad
collection some of which she doesn't listen too. I would like to be
able to select "All my songs" and randomise the playlist, this would
exclude the 80's rubbish as I would not have marked it as music I
subscribe to.

Anyway, useful idea I think, as a supplement to proper tags.

(Maybe there is a freetext field that could be used in tags already, I
don't know)

Cheers,

Roo.
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