Mailing List Archive: MythTV: Dev

MythMusic Redux Proposals WAS: Proposed Change to MythMusic

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adeffs.mythtv at gmail

Jul 11, 2007, 7:18 AM

Post #1 of 10 (948 views)
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MythMusic Redux Proposals WAS: Proposed Change to MythMusic

Starting a new thread, read comments below....

On 7/11/07, Justin Hornsby <justin.hornsby [at] gmail> wrote:
> It's not even as if you *can* use a mouse with mythmusic yet - none of
> those buttons do anything when clicked.
>
> The one thing I think everybody agrees with is that mythmusic needs to
> be improved. The thing is, I've yet to see any positive input on
> precisely how to improve it. There's little use saying "oh it needs
> to be more like X with a bit of Y" since not everybody is familiar
> with X or Y.
>
> What we really need are mockups, functional descriptions & the like.
> Anything a developer can really work towards.
>
> As far as I know there aren't too many existing apps which make it
> easy to deal with large collections of music other than the now
> ubiquitous albumart browser - but then those don't suit people whose
> music collections aren't based entirely around albums.
>
> Some have said Amarok is a good model for a music player but last time
> I looked at that it didn't seem at all viable for mythtv - it relies
> on small fonts & cramming a lot of information on screen, and it's
> hardly very remote friendly. That part is very easy to forget.
>
> XBMC, on the face of it, seems 'cooler' but I can't see how it makes
> dealing with large collections any easier - plus its 'transport
> buttons' popup seems antiquated & cumbersome - not to mention it
> duplicates buttons on a remote.
>
> AppleTV, Ipod et al - they sure look spiffy but I've yet to speak to
> anybody who can describe how they operate in detail - I've certainly
> not experienced them for long enough to make a subjective study.
>
> If we had $1 for everybody who said mythmusic could bear improvement
> we'd have been able to pay a professional to write a whole new music
> plugin already. What's needed is more constructive input & much more
> detailed suggestions for a solution to the problem.
>
> Have a think about it - how would you change the way we choose tracks
> out of thousands in our collection?
>
> Let's see less of 'mythmusic could be better / mythmusic sucks' & get
> some case studies down if you really want to help. Out of the legion
> of mythtv users there must be somebody who has had experience working
> on such a thing somewhere at some point. There's a real opportunity
> here for people to contribute in a big way IMHO.
>
> Ok, so say we do away with the music transport buttons & make viewing
> them (on top of the UI, say) optional so that those with mice /
> touchscreens can use them. That'd be a start. We'd still need a
> button to make the controls visible/invisible - or maybe a 'kiosk
> mode' where they'd always be visible. That'd mean we can devote much
> more screen space to the playlist & music tree.
>
> An album art gallery view would be very handy, and as far as I know
> that's 'on the to-do list'.
> You could use that for genres, years.. any other classification too -
> all in addition to the existing list / filtered list views.
>
> The improvements to the display model needn't only apply to mythmusic
> either - I've thought about it in the past & implimenting a new
> 'browser' might work well for recordings & videos too. Let's face it
> if we're going to get new UI classes why not let the rest of the
> project benefit?
>
> Anyway, I've got some ideas I'm going to get down in the form of
> still-frame mockups. It'll at least be a *start*, and maybe I can tie
> still frames together in video form to give an overall impression of
> how the new stuff will work in context.
>
> None of this, by the way, will make any bearing on how to play music
> in the background - but I think we can all agree that the methods we
> use to pick music to be played need some attention.
>
> Regards,

Ok, since I've been a big proponent of MythMusic needing a rewrite,
but not having the basic skills to do it, I'm going to do some hand
drawn markups of how I would like to see MythMusic behave on an HDTV
and how I think it could work on an SDTV. I'll scan them in and post
them on my web space. Perhaps we can get some dialog moving like with
the website revamp thread.

Please note, I'm not a "computer scientist"/programmer. Don't expect
me to implement this. All this is for is to help those, like Stuart
and theme designers have something to "work towards". I've thought a
lot about this and have what I think are some good ideas. Hopefully
when Justin puts together his drawings we'll have some good ideas to
mesh together.

Now, in doing this I will assume a few things,
1) non-static interface. the current interface is static, one screen
that shows everything. this is obviously not ideal and having an
interface that changes depending on what is going on will make things
easier for the user.
2) remote control use will be limited to very few buttons. I *hate*
having tons of buttons on a remote to do simple tasks. So beyond the
normal playback buttons (play, pause, stop, ff/rew, skip+/-) I will
only use directional (up down left right), select and one, perhaps two
menu buttons.
3) that this will be for a "complete mythmusic rewrite". meaning I
will include "features" not yet included, stuff on the wish list, etc.

Let's use this thread to post and discuss mock-ups. This is not a
"wish list" thread, use the wiki for that and those of us creating
mock-ups will use that list to create our ideas. Use this thread to
comment on the mock-up. Also, please wait for mock-ups to be posted or
create your own instead of just adding comments like "I'd like to see
things work this way...".

--
Steve
Before you ask, read the FAQ!
http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Frequently_Asked_Questions
then search the Wiki, and this list,
http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/
Mailinglist etiquette -
http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List_etiquette
_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev [at] mythtv
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev

jcaputo1 at gmail

Jul 11, 2007, 9:13 AM

Post #2 of 10 (919 views)
Permalink

Re: MythMusic Redux Proposals WAS: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

On 7/11/07, Steven Adeff <adeffs.mythtv [at] gmail> wrote:
> Starting a new thread, read comments below....
>
> On 7/11/07, Justin Hornsby <justin.hornsby [at] gmail> wrote:
> > It's not even as if you *can* use a mouse with mythmusic yet - none of
> > those buttons do anything when clicked.
> >
> > The one thing I think everybody agrees with is that mythmusic needs to
> > be improved. The thing is, I've yet to see any positive input on
> > precisely how to improve it. There's little use saying "oh it needs
> > to be more like X with a bit of Y" since not everybody is familiar
> > with X or Y.
> >
> > What we really need are mockups, functional descriptions & the like.
> > Anything a developer can really work towards.
> >
> > As far as I know there aren't too many existing apps which make it
> > easy to deal with large collections of music other than the now
> > ubiquitous albumart browser - but then those don't suit people whose
> > music collections aren't based entirely around albums.
> >
> > Some have said Amarok is a good model for a music player but last time
> > I looked at that it didn't seem at all viable for mythtv - it relies
> > on small fonts & cramming a lot of information on screen, and it's
> > hardly very remote friendly. That part is very easy to forget.
> >
> > XBMC, on the face of it, seems 'cooler' but I can't see how it makes
> > dealing with large collections any easier - plus its 'transport
> > buttons' popup seems antiquated & cumbersome - not to mention it
> > duplicates buttons on a remote.
> >
> > AppleTV, Ipod et al - they sure look spiffy but I've yet to speak to
> > anybody who can describe how they operate in detail - I've certainly
> > not experienced them for long enough to make a subjective study.
> >
> > If we had $1 for everybody who said mythmusic could bear improvement
> > we'd have been able to pay a professional to write a whole new music
> > plugin already. What's needed is more constructive input & much more
> > detailed suggestions for a solution to the problem.
> >
> > Have a think about it - how would you change the way we choose tracks
> > out of thousands in our collection?
> >
> > Let's see less of 'mythmusic could be better / mythmusic sucks' & get
> > some case studies down if you really want to help. Out of the legion
> > of mythtv users there must be somebody who has had experience working
> > on such a thing somewhere at some point. There's a real opportunity
> > here for people to contribute in a big way IMHO.
> >
> > Ok, so say we do away with the music transport buttons & make viewing
> > them (on top of the UI, say) optional so that those with mice /
> > touchscreens can use them. That'd be a start. We'd still need a
> > button to make the controls visible/invisible - or maybe a 'kiosk
> > mode' where they'd always be visible. That'd mean we can devote much
> > more screen space to the playlist & music tree.
> >
> > An album art gallery view would be very handy, and as far as I know
> > that's 'on the to-do list'.
> > You could use that for genres, years.. any other classification too -
> > all in addition to the existing list / filtered list views.
> >
> > The improvements to the display model needn't only apply to mythmusic
> > either - I've thought about it in the past & implimenting a new
> > 'browser' might work well for recordings & videos too. Let's face it
> > if we're going to get new UI classes why not let the rest of the
> > project benefit?
> >
> > Anyway, I've got some ideas I'm going to get down in the form of
> > still-frame mockups. It'll at least be a *start*, and maybe I can tie
> > still frames together in video form to give an overall impression of
> > how the new stuff will work in context.
> >
> > None of this, by the way, will make any bearing on how to play music
> > in the background - but I think we can all agree that the methods we
> > use to pick music to be played need some attention.
> >
> > Regards,
>
> Ok, since I've been a big proponent of MythMusic needing a rewrite,
> but not having the basic skills to do it, I'm going to do some hand
> drawn markups of how I would like to see MythMusic behave on an HDTV
> and how I think it could work on an SDTV. I'll scan them in and post
> them on my web space. Perhaps we can get some dialog moving like with
> the website revamp thread.
>
> Please note, I'm not a "computer scientist"/programmer. Don't expect
> me to implement this. All this is for is to help those, like Stuart
> and theme designers have something to "work towards". I've thought a
> lot about this and have what I think are some good ideas. Hopefully
> when Justin puts together his drawings we'll have some good ideas to
> mesh together.
>
> Now, in doing this I will assume a few things,
> 1) non-static interface. the current interface is static, one screen
> that shows everything. this is obviously not ideal and having an
> interface that changes depending on what is going on will make things
> easier for the user.
> 2) remote control use will be limited to very few buttons. I *hate*
> having tons of buttons on a remote to do simple tasks. So beyond the
> normal playback buttons (play, pause, stop, ff/rew, skip+/-) I will
> only use directional (up down left right), select and one, perhaps two
> menu buttons.
> 3) that this will be for a "complete mythmusic rewrite". meaning I
> will include "features" not yet included, stuff on the wish list, etc.
>
> Let's use this thread to post and discuss mock-ups. This is not a
> "wish list" thread, use the wiki for that and those of us creating
> mock-ups will use that list to create our ideas. Use this thread to
> comment on the mock-up. Also, please wait for mock-ups to be posted or
> create your own instead of just adding comments like "I'd like to see
> things work this way...".

Cool.

RE: my ideas posted in the parent thread
(http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/dev/278708#278708)

I've done a little mockup in Qt Designer. It's not themed, and of
course we'd use the appropriate MythUI controls, etc., but it gives
the general idea of what I'm envisioning. NOTE: I used a QTabWidget
for the bottom pane, only so that you can have the ability to switch
views in the mockup. In the real thing, we'd use a QWidgetStack or
something similar. It's designed at 800x600.

Comments?

-JAC

Attachments:

mythmusic_mockup.ui (20.5 KB)

justin.hornsby at gmail

Jul 11, 2007, 10:12 AM

Post #3 of 10 (925 views)
Permalink

Re: MythMusic Redux Proposals WAS: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

The big problem here is the assumption that HDTVs can display much
more readable information than an SDTV. This isn't necessarily the
case. They're _wider_, sure - but that doesn't amount to much more
information onscreen that a user will be able to make out from where
they sit.

Will all that 8pt text still be legible from where the user sits? The
problem isn't so much one of screen space - more how it's used.

When I started off on this tangent I didn't intend to start some kind
of free-for-all - I was just pointing out that for all the 'mythmusic
needs improving' comments, nobody had actually offerred anything
concrete to suggest how it might be betterred.

I fear this discussion will degenerate into the mess that was the
'mythtv.org redesign' thread, picking apart every last nit.

--
Justin Hornsby
Creator of ProjectGrayhem, blootube and neon-wide themes for MythTV
email: justin(dot)hornsby(at)gmail.com
web: http://www.juski.co.uk
_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev [at] mythtv
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev

adeffs.mythtv at gmail

Jul 11, 2007, 11:04 AM

Post #4 of 10 (910 views)
Permalink

Re: MythMusic Redux Proposals WAS: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

On 7/11/07, Justin Hornsby <justin.hornsby [at] gmail> wrote:
> The big problem here is the assumption that HDTVs can display much
> more readable information than an SDTV. This isn't necessarily the
> case. They're _wider_, sure - but that doesn't amount to much more
> information onscreen that a user will be able to make out from where
> they sit.
>
> Will all that 8pt text still be legible from where the user sits? The
> problem isn't so much one of screen space - more how it's used.
>
> When I started off on this tangent I didn't intend to start some kind
> of free-for-all - I was just pointing out that for all the 'mythmusic
> needs improving' comments, nobody had actually offerred anything
> concrete to suggest how it might be betterred.
>
> I fear this discussion will degenerate into the mess that was the
> 'mythtv.org redesign' thread, picking apart every last nit.

well, yes, and in the end whomever does the redesign will have final
say, but what this does is give that person something to work towards.

as for HD, I agree it doesn't guarantee more that the space will be
visable, but considering most HDTV's are larger, in the 42+ range,
having an SD and an HD version will let the person choose. But I know
on my 50" 1080p screen I can fit a lot more information and still have
it visible at my siting distance. Like you say, its about how its
used, and It would be great to be able to take advantage of smaller
text if I can.

--
Steve
Before you ask, read the FAQ!
http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Frequently_Asked_Questions
then search the Wiki, and this list,
http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/
Mailinglist etiquette -
http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Mailing_List_etiquette
_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev [at] mythtv
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev

herman at frontier

Jul 11, 2007, 12:00 PM

Post #5 of 10 (916 views)
Permalink

Re: MythMusic Redux Proposals WAS: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

> I fear this discussion will degenerate into the mess that was the
> 'mythtv.org redesign' thread, picking apart every last nit.

Ah, well, maybe I should stay out of it then ;-)

In a back burner kind of way I've been working on a mockup of an MM
interface as I would like it, cobbled together from ideas nicked from MS,
Apple, etc etc. One problem is that it is a Flash mockup (as I was also
wondering if a fully Flash-based frontend would be feasible, but I'm afraid
I don't have enough time to work that out :-) Also, my thoughts probably
won't fit in the GUI framework in place...

I'm an album listener, so not many ideas on playlists etc. How often to
people browse MM for tracks to be added to playlists there and then? Given
(lots) more smart playlists, browsing these could be similar to browsing
albums, as they would share characteristics etc.?

Anyway, maybe turn up that burner a bit more :-)

Herman

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Herman Kuiper - m: herman [at] frontier - w: http://www.frontier.nl
Beech Ave 162 - 1119 PS Schiphol-Rijk - t/f: 020-6589034/6142816
_______________________________________________
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http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev

jcaputo1 at gmail

Jul 11, 2007, 1:42 PM

Post #6 of 10 (914 views)
Permalink

Re: MythMusic Redux Proposals WAS: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

On 7/11/07, Herman Kuiper <herman [at] frontier> wrote:
>
> I'm an album listener, so not many ideas on playlists etc. How often do
> people browse MM for tracks to be added to playlists there and then?

Speaking for myself, quite often. One of my favorite listening modes
is "browse through my collection and queue up whatever strikes my
fancy at that moment". Something which the current MM does not do
very well (you can sort of do it, but there are too many steps).

-JAC
_______________________________________________
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mythtv-dev [at] mythtv
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev

mythtv at colin

Jul 11, 2007, 2:39 PM

Post #7 of 10 (895 views)
Permalink

Re: MythMusic Redux Proposals WAS: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

Steven Adeff wrote:
> Let's use this thread to post and discuss mock-ups. This is not a
> "wish list" thread, use the wiki for that and those of us creating
> mock-ups will use that list to create our ideas. Use this thread to
> comment on the mock-up. Also, please wait for mock-ups to be posted or
> create your own instead of just adding comments like "I'd like to see
> things work this way...".

I also do not have much time for coding, but here are some of the things
that caught my eye of late:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/9111235 [at] N0/774817433/in/photostream/
The above link is a series of Mockup a user recently posted to the
Clutter mailing list. This appears to be his pet project and he has
written a backend and is now coding the frontend using libclutter and
the python bindings. For those of you who don't know Clutter is a nice
API for creating simple but visually rich GL apps, specifically media apps.

http://elisa.fluendo.com/
Elisa is a Pigment based meida player. Pigment seems to be very similar
to Clutter and some people I've spoken to recently on IRC (MacSlow
included) have mentioned that they'd like the Pigment and Clutter people
to work together for the common good. I don't think this is overly
likely however. It seems Pigment has more focus on the Python bindings
in that these appear to be the main/recommended approach to leaveraging
Pigment.

The above are designed to give a few thoughts on ideas rather than
anything else.

Also I recently attended part of the Akademy (KDE Dev conference). There
are some very interesting things proposed by Qt guys, specifically Zack
Rusin. He showed some really nice GL based frameworks he was working on.
I think Qt will really start to shine in it's next 4.x series
(QGraphicsView is already pretty good I am told but more is gonna come
in the future).

Also in addition to this, there was significant talk of Strigi (the KDE4
Indexing tool - think Kat, Kerry, Beagle etc. but actually good!). I
wanted to catch this lecture but missed most of it. I wanted to ask if
this was a good thing as there are so many solutions in this field, how
can we make user facing tools that will work with all backends? Well
what I did manage to catch of this was that there is now a Freedesktop
Standard for accessing search indexes!!! Woot!!

http://freedesktop.org/wiki/XesamAbout

This is a mechanism to search these various indexers via DBUS.

This would meed that Tracker or Strigi could be used to index your Music
files and Xesam could be used to query it.

If there is to be a MythMusic rewrite (or reimplementation as MythTunes
perhaps?) then i think it could lead the way to building on such a
backend. I really hope that media applications will go this way - even
if it means doing work on other projects ot get there. I dream of the
day I can use Amarok, or RhythmBox or MythTunes and they all share the
same Meta database, same static playlists, and even the same dynamic
playlists (some sort of Stored Procedure but for a search index? No idea
if this exists, but it would be neat!).

Those of you who know me know this is not a new bugbear for me! So I'm
just seizing the opportunity to do exactly what Justin predicted :p

Take care

Col

--

+------------------------+
| Colin Guthrie |
+------------------------+
| myth(at)colin.guthr.ie |
| http://colin.guthr.ie/ |
+------------------------+
_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
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justin.hornsby at gmail

Jul 11, 2007, 2:43 PM

Post #8 of 10 (908 views)
Permalink

Re: MythMusic Redux Proposals WAS: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

Elisa is a horrible, closed source, un-free (the useful parts) PoS.

Why would we want an ugly, convoluted UI like that?!

--
Justin Hornsby
Creator of ProjectGrayhem, blootube and neon-wide themes for MythTV
email: justin(dot)hornsby(at)gmail.com
web: http://www.juski.co.uk
_______________________________________________
mythtv-dev mailing list
mythtv-dev [at] mythtv
http://mythtv.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mythtv-dev

adeffs.mythtv at gmail

Jul 11, 2007, 6:02 PM

Post #9 of 10 (903 views)
Permalink

Re: MythMusic Redux Proposals WAS: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

On 7/11/07, Colin Guthrie <mythtv [at] colin> wrote:
> Steven Adeff wrote:
> > Let's use this thread to post and discuss mock-ups. This is not a
> > "wish list" thread, use the wiki for that and those of us creating
> > mock-ups will use that list to create our ideas. Use this thread to
> > comment on the mock-up. Also, please wait for mock-ups to be posted or
> > create your own instead of just adding comments like "I'd like to see
> > things work this way...".
>
> I also do not have much time for coding, but here are some of the things
> that caught my eye of late:
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/9111235 [at] N0/774817433/in/photostream/
> The above link is a series of Mockup a user recently posted to the
> Clutter mailing list. This appears to be his pet project and he has
> written a backend and is now coding the frontend using libclutter and
> the python bindings. For those of you who don't know Clutter is a nice
> API for creating simple but visually rich GL apps, specifically media apps.
>
>
> http://elisa.fluendo.com/
> Elisa is a Pigment based meida player. Pigment seems to be very similar
> to Clutter and some people I've spoken to recently on IRC (MacSlow
> included) have mentioned that they'd like the Pigment and Clutter people
> to work together for the common good. I don't think this is overly
> likely however. It seems Pigment has more focus on the Python bindings
> in that these appear to be the main/recommended approach to leaveraging
> Pigment.
>
>
> The above are designed to give a few thoughts on ideas rather than
> anything else.
>
> Also I recently attended part of the Akademy (KDE Dev conference). There
> are some very interesting things proposed by Qt guys, specifically Zack
> Rusin. He showed some really nice GL based frameworks he was working on.
> I think Qt will really start to shine in it's next 4.x series
> (QGraphicsView is already pretty good I am told but more is gonna come
> in the future).
>
> Also in addition to this, there was significant talk of Strigi (the KDE4
> Indexing tool - think Kat, Kerry, Beagle etc. but actually good!). I
> wanted to catch this lecture but missed most of it. I wanted to ask if
> this was a good thing as there are so many solutions in this field, how
> can we make user facing tools that will work with all backends? Well
> what I did manage to catch of this was that there is now a Freedesktop
> Standard for accessing search indexes!!! Woot!!
>
> http://freedesktop.org/wiki/XesamAbout
>
> This is a mechanism to search these various indexers via DBUS.
>
> This would meed that Tracker or Strigi could be used to index your Music
> files and Xesam could be used to query it.
>
> If there is to be a MythMusic rewrite (or reimplementation as MythTunes
> perhaps?)

MythTunes! perhaps renaming it to that as a separate project is a good idea?

> then i think it could lead the way to building on such a
> backend. I really hope that media applications will go this way - even
> if it means doing work on other projects ot get there. I dream of the
> day I can use Amarok, or RhythmBox or MythTunes and they all share the
> same Meta database, same static playlists, and even the same dynamic
> playlists (some sort of Stored Procedure but for a search index? No idea
> if this exists, but it would be neat!).

I agree, I think it would be great if Amarok and MythTunes shared a db
(I have mySQL running a db for Amarok and MythTV right now anyway) ,
but I don't know if the Amarok db holds enough track/id3 information
to do what is needed. At least thats the impression i get when i look
at the track properties dialog in Amarok. Someone would need to look
at this, and perhaps approach the Amarok team about such a sharing of
databases.

Perhaps a better method would be for there to be a "server" part of
MythTunes that integrates with Amarok in some fashion (amongst other
things it could do, like daap, etc?). Anyway, thats off topic...

> Those of you who know me know this is not a new bugbear for me! So I'm
> just seizing the opportunity to do exactly what Justin predicted :p

I believe many of the previous discussions about this were you and I
bantering back and forth with a few others as no one paid attention =D

Oh, I looked at the links you sent. I'm trying to integrate ideas from
all these sources, including iTunes, AppleTV's interface, etc.

I see perhaps an "iTunes" style interface that is more utilitarian
than pretty, a "JukeBox" style which is more pretty than utilitarian,
and then a version of each for HD and SD. This along with proper a
MythWeb module (which seems to be going well right now from what I've
seen) and it should cover all the ways to manage music. I've got some
drawings on my desk at work I'll continue to work on....

--
Steve
Before you ask, read the FAQ!
http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/Frequently_Asked_Questions
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noisymime at gmail

Jul 15, 2007, 5:22 PM

Post #10 of 10 (867 views)
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MythMusic Redux Proposals WAS: Proposed Change to MythMusic [In reply to]

Colin Guthrie wrote:

>Steven Adeff wrote:
>> Let's use this thread to post and discuss mock-ups. This is not a
>> "wish list" thread, use the wiki for that and those of us creating
>> mock-ups will use that list to create our ideas. Use this thread to
>> comment on the mock-up. Also, please wait for mock-ups to be posted or
>> create your own instead of just adding comments like "I'd like to see
>> things work this way...".

>I also do not have much time for coding, but here are some of the things
>that caught my eye of late:

>http://www.flickr.com/photos/9111235 [at] N0/774817433/in/photostream/
>The above link is a series of Mockup a user recently posted to the
>Clutter mailing list. This appears to be his pet project and he has
>written a backend and is now coding the frontend using libclutter and
>the python bindings. For those of you who don't know Clutter is a nice
>API for creating simple but visually rich GL apps, specifically media apps.

Clutter is a fantastic framework, if a little 'young' at this stage.
I've recently started building a frontend type app from scratch with
it using the python bindings, more as a learning exercise than
anything else, but its amazing what you can achieve very easily. I'm
using the mock-ups you've linked to above as a guide, but also doing
my own thing in places however in my opinion, building an interface
similar to Apple's FrontRow etc would not be that hard at all using
Clutter.

There's a few things that play against it from a Myth perspective though
* It requires OpenGL: Maybe not a huge issue, but there's no way of
just unchecking a box and losing some effects to make it work on old
hardware
* Its based around GTK+ rather than QT. Again not an insurmountable
problem, but definitely something to think about.

Anyway, just my 2c. I'll put up some screenshots of my toy app once
its a little more complete as I would love to hear peoples opinions
about the UI.

-Josh Stewart
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