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Mails about ratings from "Downloads"

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hald at icandy

Nov 11, 2009, 12:58 AM

Post #1 of 12 (971 views)
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Mails about ratings from "Downloads"

Hi,

does anyone think those mails (see attachment) are actually useful? It
does not say who rated my app (because it's almost always anonymous), it
does not say how high this person rated my app nor what the total score
is now.

So basically it provides no information at all. I've got about 10 of
those mails since yesterday. So I would have two suggestions: 1) Don't
send out those mails or 2) Make them say something useful.

What do you think?
Conny

Attachments:

message-rfc822.eml (1.77 KB)

rael at edge

Nov 11, 2009, 2:10 AM

Post #2 of 12 (945 views)
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Re: Mails about ratings from "Downloads" [In reply to]

Hallo!

I'm interested in such mails (AFAIK I was possibly even the person who
requested the feature ;-)).

I'm intersted in getting to know that somebody rated my application since
I'm intersted in improving the rating of my applications. Getting a mail
makes it possible to react on ratings (without regulary polling the web
pages which would be a pain for >10 packages) and for example contact the
author to get more information about the reason of his rating and to find
ways to change the application so that he would increase his rating. There
were several case where I was able to fix/improve the application and get a
higher rating in turn.

I would be intersted in getting more information in the mails (currently I
walk the link to get more information). So please do not remove this
feature (but possibly make it configurable per user if other people are not
interested) but enhance it!

--
Gruß...
Tim
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andrew at bleb

Nov 11, 2009, 2:15 AM

Post #3 of 12 (949 views)
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Re: Mails about ratings from "Downloads" [In reply to]

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 10:10, Tim Teulings <rael [at] edge> wrote:
>
> I'm intersted in getting to know that somebody rated my application since
> I'm intersted in improving the rating of my applications. Getting a mail
> makes it possible to react on ratings (without regulary polling the web
> pages which would be a pain for >10 packages) and for example contact the
> author to get more information about the reason of his rating and to find
> ways to change the application so that he would increase his rating.

Except the thread is about *anonymous* ratings without comments. You
will know that your overall rating may have changed, but you may not
know which direction (especially if you have lots of votes already)
and you do not have a mechanism for contacting the author or gaining
any additional information.

The emails in question are, literally, a notification that your
overall popularity has either gone up a bit, down a bit or unchanged
(but not which one!)

Cheers,

Andrew

--
Andrew Flegg -- mailto:andrew [at] bleb | http://www.bleb.org/
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ferenc at maemo

Nov 11, 2009, 2:20 AM

Post #4 of 12 (944 views)
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Re: Mails about ratings from "Downloads" [In reply to]

Hello,

Cornelius Hald wrote:
> Hi,
>
> does anyone think those mails (see attachment) are actually useful? It
> does not say who rated my app (because it's almost always anonymous), it
> does not say how high this person rated my app nor what the total score
> is now.
>
> So basically it provides no information at all. I've got about 10 of
> those mails since yesterday. So I would have two suggestions: 1) Don't
> send out those mails or 2) Make them say something useful.
>
We have been wondering about the same. The component [1] that handles
comments and ratings are being reworked. Niels requested a bunch of
changes and new features [1]. Among those is the disabling outgoing
mails for ratings. I think the changes will not be online before he returns.

I will look at the component if we could do a temporary hack and save
the inboxes from these messages.

> What do you think?
> Conny
>
Cheers,
ferenc

[1]
https://svn.midgard-project.org/midgard/branches/ragnaroek/midcom/net.nehmer.comments/

[2]
http://lists.maemo.org/pipermail/maemo-community/2009-November/003231.html

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject:
> page Conboy has been commented by (anonymous)
> From:
> "maemo.org admin team" <garage [at] maemo>
> Date:
> Tue, 10 Nov 2009 15:14:46 +0200 (EET)
> To:
> hald [at] icandy
>
> To:
> hald [at] icandy
>
>
>
>
> Link to page:
> http://maemo.org/midcom-permalink-9763a89cadaa11dea310251e31f6601a601a
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> maemo-developers mailing list
> maemo-developers [at] maemo
> https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
_______________________________________________
maemo-developers mailing list
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ferenc at maemo

Nov 11, 2009, 2:20 AM

Post #5 of 12 (939 views)
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Re: Mails about ratings from "Downloads" [In reply to]

Hello,

Tim Teulings wrote:

<snip>

> I would be intersted in getting more information in the mails
> (currently I walk the link to get more information). So please do not
> remove this feature (but possibly make it configurable per user if
> other people are not interested) but enhance it!
>
OK, agreed. Making it configurable per user and beefing up the content
is probably the right way to go. Thanks Tim for the mail. Any other
comments?

> -- Gruß ... Tim

Cheers,
ferenc
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hald at icandy

Nov 11, 2009, 2:33 AM

Post #6 of 12 (932 views)
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Re: Mails about ratings from "Downloads" [In reply to]

On Wed, 2009-11-11 at 10:15 +0000, Andrew Flegg wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 10:10, Tim Teulings <rael [at] edge> wrote:
> >
> > I'm intersted in getting to know that somebody rated my application since
> > I'm intersted in improving the rating of my applications. Getting a mail
> > makes it possible to react on ratings (without regulary polling the web
> > pages which would be a pain for >10 packages) and for example contact the
> > author to get more information about the reason of his rating and to find
> > ways to change the application so that he would increase his rating.
>
> Except the thread is about *anonymous* ratings without comments. You
> will know that your overall rating may have changed, but you may not
> know which direction (especially if you have lots of votes already)
> and you do not have a mechanism for contacting the author or gaining
> any additional information.
>
> The emails in question are, literally, a notification that your
> overall popularity has either gone up a bit, down a bit or unchanged
> (but not which one!)

Exactly, thanks Andrew :) If there is any useful information inside the
mail, I'm super happy to receive it. But right now there is just no
information. So maybe at least add to the mail the rating that this
person (even if it's anonymous) gave.

And thanks Ferenc for the information in you first mail!

Also instead of making it user configurable it could be enough to give
those mails a distinctive title. Then people can easily filter them if
they are not interested. Right now its not easy to find out if this
email provides a comment or not.

Thanks!
Conny

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martin.grimme at gmail

Nov 11, 2009, 3:17 AM

Post #7 of 12 (934 views)
Permalink

Re: Mails about ratings from "Downloads" [In reply to]

Hi,

I like the idea of the rating mails. In fact the rating mail notified
me that my software got an auto-created page on downloads.maemo.org.
But it's true that these mails are pretty useless spam without the
actual rating.

Martin

2009/11/11, Cornelius Hald <hald [at] icandy>:
> On Wed, 2009-11-11 at 10:15 +0000, Andrew Flegg wrote:
>> On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 10:10, Tim Teulings <rael [at] edge> wrote:
>> >
>> > I'm intersted in getting to know that somebody rated my application
>> > since
>> > I'm intersted in improving the rating of my applications. Getting a mail
>> > makes it possible to react on ratings (without regulary polling the web
>> > pages which would be a pain for >10 packages) and for example contact
>> > the
>> > author to get more information about the reason of his rating and to
>> > find
>> > ways to change the application so that he would increase his rating.
>>
>> Except the thread is about *anonymous* ratings without comments. You
>> will know that your overall rating may have changed, but you may not
>> know which direction (especially if you have lots of votes already)
>> and you do not have a mechanism for contacting the author or gaining
>> any additional information.
>>
>> The emails in question are, literally, a notification that your
>> overall popularity has either gone up a bit, down a bit or unchanged
>> (but not which one!)
>
> Exactly, thanks Andrew :) If there is any useful information inside the
> mail, I'm super happy to receive it. But right now there is just no
> information. So maybe at least add to the mail the rating that this
> person (even if it's anonymous) gave.
>
> And thanks Ferenc for the information in you first mail!
>
> Also instead of making it user configurable it could be enough to give
> those mails a distinctive title. Then people can easily filter them if
> they are not interested. Right now its not easy to find out if this
> email provides a comment or not.
>
> Thanks!
> Conny
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> maemo-developers mailing list
> maemo-developers [at] maemo
> https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
>
_______________________________________________
maemo-developers mailing list
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hald at icandy

Nov 11, 2009, 5:37 AM

Post #8 of 12 (937 views)
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Re: Mails about ratings from "Downloads" [In reply to]

It also looks like there is something wrong with the rating interface.
Just right now I got 10 anonymous ratings in just 3 minutes. Yesterday
there was also a cluster of 6 ratings in about 5 minutes.

Before yesterday I didn't even get one rating every month.

To me it looks those are multiple ratings done (accidentally) by one
person.

Anyone else having that?

Cheers!
Conny

On Wed, 2009-11-11 at 09:58 +0100, Cornelius Hald wrote:
> Hi,
>
> does anyone think those mails (see attachment) are actually useful? It
> does not say who rated my app (because it's almost always anonymous), it
> does not say how high this person rated my app nor what the total score
> is now.
>
> So basically it provides no information at all. I've got about 10 of
> those mails since yesterday. So I would have two suggestions: 1) Don't
> send out those mails or 2) Make them say something useful.
>
> What do you think?
> Conny
>
> email message attachment, "Forwarded message - page Conboy has been
> commented by (anonymous)"
> > -------- Forwarded Message --------
> > From: maemo.org admin team <garage [at] maemo>
> > To: hald [at] icandy
> > Subject: page Conboy has been commented by (anonymous)
> > Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 15:14:46 +0200 (EET)
> >
> >
> >
> > Link to page:
> > http://maemo.org/midcom-permalink-9763a89cadaa11dea310251e31f6601a601a
> _______________________________________________
> maemo-developers mailing list
> maemo-developers [at] maemo
> https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers

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vdv100 at gmail

Nov 17, 2009, 4:12 PM

Post #9 of 12 (777 views)
Permalink

Re: Mails about ratings from "Downloads" [In reply to]

Hi,

On Wed, Nov 11, 2009 at 1:37 PM, Cornelius Hald <hald [at] icandy> wrote:

> It also looks like there is something wrong with the rating interface.
> Just right now I got 10 anonymous ratings in just 3 minutes. Yesterday
> there was also a cluster of 6 ratings in about 5 minutes.
>
> Before yesterday I didn't even get one rating every month.
>
> To me it looks those are multiple ratings done (accidentally) by one
> person.
>
>
seems that is still possible to vote trough Maemo-select without login, I'm
still getting a lot of rating from anonymous, most of the times a bunch of
them as described by Conny.

Best regards,

Anyone else having that?
>
> Cheers!
> Conny
>
>
> On Wed, 2009-11-11 at 09:58 +0100, Cornelius Hald wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > does anyone think those mails (see attachment) are actually useful? It
> > does not say who rated my app (because it's almost always anonymous), it
> > does not say how high this person rated my app nor what the total score
> > is now.
> >
> > So basically it provides no information at all. I've got about 10 of
> > those mails since yesterday. So I would have two suggestions: 1) Don't
> > send out those mails or 2) Make them say something useful.
> >
> > What do you think?
> > Conny
> >
> > email message attachment, "Forwarded message - page Conboy has been
> > commented by (anonymous)"
> > > -------- Forwarded Message --------
> > > From: maemo.org admin team <garage [at] maemo>
> > > To: hald [at] icandy
> > > Subject: page Conboy has been commented by (anonymous)
> > > Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 15:14:46 +0200 (EET)
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Link to page:
> > > http://maemo.org/midcom-permalink-9763a89cadaa11dea310251e31f6601a601a
> > _______________________________________________
> > maemo-developers mailing list
> > maemo-developers [at] maemo
> > https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
>
> _______________________________________________
> maemo-developers mailing list
> maemo-developers [at] maemo
> https://lists.maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
>

--
Val�rio Val�rio

http://www.valeriovalerio.org

hald at icandy

Nov 18, 2009, 12:07 AM

Post #10 of 12 (771 views)
Permalink

Re: Mails about ratings from "Downloads" [In reply to]

On Wed, 2009-11-18 at 00:12 +0000, Valerio Valerio wrote:

> seems that is still possible to vote trough Maemo-select without
> login, I'm still getting a lot of rating from anonymous, most of the
> times a bunch of them as described by Conny.

It's also possible to vote anonymously via maemo.org Downloads.

I was looking into why the votes come in batches of 5-10 votes at a time
and it probably has to do with the (super) slow response times of the
web interface + that the backend does not check whether or not someone
already voted. This check seems to be only implemented on the frontend
level.

So what happens it this:

1) User clicks on Vote
2) Browser sends data to server inserts it into the database sends out
email etc...
3) Server needs several minutes to prepare and send back updated html
(or js) to the client.

Between 2) and 3) the user clicks the Vote button again because nothing
happened for 10 seconds or so. Again the vote data is sent to the
server, inserted in the DB etc...

Then still nothing happens and the user clicks Vote again and again and
again. You get lots and lots of votes, all with the same rating from the
same person :)

I actually tried that and gave my app 3 anonymous votes in a row without
problems.

The result is, that, for example, Conboy for Fremantle now has 74 votes
with 284 downloads. Wow that's user participation ;) In reality I think
Conboy got around 7 unique votes.

Cheers!
Conny

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bulfaiter at gmail

Nov 18, 2009, 1:56 AM

Post #11 of 12 (768 views)
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Re: Mails about ratings from "Downloads" [In reply to]

2009/11/18 Cornelius Hald <hald [at] icandy>

> [...]
> So what happens it this:
>
> 1) User clicks on Vote
> 2) Browser sends data to server inserts it into the database sends out
> email etc...
> 3) Server needs several minutes to prepare and send back updated html
> (or js) to the client.
>
> Between 2) and 3) the user clicks the Vote button again because nothing
> happened for 10 seconds or so. Again the vote data is sent to the
> server, inserted in the DB etc...
>
> Then still nothing happens and the user clicks Vote again and again and
> again. You get lots and lots of votes, all with the same rating from the
> same person :)

[...]

> Cheers!
> Conny

That happened to me two weeks ago, and now fuelpad for OS2008,
http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/fuelpad, has 4 more votes. Maybe
it should be possible to delete duplicated votes & comments.

Cheers

aklapper at openismus

Nov 18, 2009, 3:10 AM

Post #12 of 12 (760 views)
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Re: Mails about ratings from "Downloads" [In reply to]

Just a quick note that there's a bug report at
https://bugs.maemo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6192 about the same issue for
Maemo Select on maemo.nokia.com.

Sharing proposals/workarounds/etc is probably welcome. :-)

andre
--
Andre Klapper (maemo.org bugmaster)

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