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Re: The road ahead?
 

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kito at gentoo

Oct 31, 2005, 4:12 PM


Views: 3228
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Re: The road ahead? [In reply to]

On Oct 31, 2005, at 4:17 PM, dirk.schoenberger [at] sz-online wrote:

> Just wanted to put my 2cent into the discussion.
> I suppose I am currently just a pure Gentoo-OSX user, and while I
> see the
> point of the prefix project, I am not really convinced by it. I
> like the
> way Gentoo integrates into the system, or at least the part
> accessible by
> a console.

Wow. You are in the minority in this I think.

A big part of the challenge in designing the beast, is it has to be
compatible with non-prefixed installs, and eventually even a non-
prefixed install on the same machine,... this is by no means a fork,
so portage installing packages to / is obviously not going to go away.

>
> I see this as an advantage above e.g. Fink, with its own namespace.
> The
> namespace variant implies that I have to fudge around with PATH
> variables
> and other CLI stuff, in order to get the apps working. I still have no
> real MacOSX integration, with App folder and GUI starter elements
> (which
> would be my biggest feature request)

The Portage take on this would be slightly different, as it will live
in its own space, with its own set of GUI accessible .apps,
Frameworks, etc. Can you elaborate on "I have to fudge around with
PATH variables and other CLI stuff" and "real MacOSX integration,
with App folder and GUI starter elements" please?

>
> From what I see as a user, the Gentoo packages divide into 4
> categories
>
> 1) packages which integrate nicely into the system (no
> dependencies, or
> dependencies which are properly provided by MacOS)

The problems with this have been outlined numerous times by both
users and devs, but to quickly re-hash them: It makes system backups/
reinstalls a pain, the deps that are 'properly' provided by apple can
and will change without notice, it requires manual mapping of faux-
deps via the profiles, a software update or `diskutil
repairPermissions /` can render your portage installed files useless,
its what keeps the project a laughable novelty to most Darwin/OS X
users and developers

> 2) packages which clash with MacOS provided packages, things like
> python
> or automake spring to mind
> 3) packages which depend on 2)
> 4) misc packages which are otherwise problematic. This means most
> of the
> package.masked packages, where I cannot really speak about.
>
> The biggest problem is obiously the packages in 2)
>
> My private idea in order to emerge packages in 3) would currently
> be to
> manually install the needed packages in places like /usr/local
> (instead of
> Gentoos /usr) and put these packages into package.provided. It
> would be
> really nice if I could use this way while still being able to use the
> emerge functionaltiy. Perhaps this could be handled by a special
> USE flag?

A USE flag for what exactly? I'm not sure I understand you. You can
manually install things to /usr/local and add them to
package.provided right now if you want to. Either way, lying to
portage about whats installed on a system is a bad idea, and always
leads to trouble. Portage package dependencies are just that,
dependencies on other packages in portage. So when an ebuilds has a
DEPEND="app-shells/bash", that means it wants/needs the bash in
portage, not a bash someone has done a ./configure && make && make
install on.

--Kito

P.S. Its good to see you are a human, I was starting to think you
were a clever bugzilla bot someone wrote to keep us busy ;)


--
gentoo-osx [at] gentoo mailing list

Subject User Time
The road ahead? grobian at gentoo Oct 30, 2005, 3:49 AM
    Re: The road ahead? stroller at stellar Oct 30, 2005, 10:15 AM
    Re: The road ahead? J4rg0n at gentoo Oct 30, 2005, 10:25 PM
        Re: The road ahead? grobian at gentoo Oct 31, 2005, 11:58 AM
    Re: The road ahead? kito at gentoo Oct 31, 2005, 11:52 AM
        Re: The road ahead? grobian at gentoo Oct 31, 2005, 12:34 PM
            Re: The road ahead? kito at gentoo Oct 31, 2005, 2:42 PM
                Re: The road ahead? grobian at gentoo Oct 31, 2005, 3:20 PM
            Re: The road ahead? J4rg0n at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 3:45 PM
                Re: The road ahead? kito at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 5:06 PM
                    Re: The road ahead? grobian at gentoo Nov 2, 2005, 12:29 AM
        Re: The road ahead? sesquile at gmail Oct 31, 2005, 5:16 PM
    The road ahead? dirk.schoenberger at sz-online Oct 31, 2005, 3:17 PM
    Re: The road ahead? kito at gentoo Oct 31, 2005, 4:12 PM
        Re: The road ahead? dirk.schoenberger at sz-online Oct 31, 2005, 4:49 PM
    Re: The road ahead? ferringb at gentoo Oct 31, 2005, 5:32 PM
        Re: The road ahead? kito at gentoo Oct 31, 2005, 5:59 PM
            Re: The road ahead? sesquile at gmail Nov 1, 2005, 12:16 PM
        Re: The road ahead? sesquile at gmail Oct 31, 2005, 6:20 PM
    Re: The road ahead? kito at gentoo Oct 31, 2005, 5:51 PM
    Re: The road ahead? ferringb at gentoo Oct 31, 2005, 6:57 PM
    Re: The road ahead? grobian at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 12:33 AM
    Re: The road ahead? nathan.stocks at gmail Nov 1, 2005, 9:07 AM
    Re: The road ahead? kito at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 9:28 AM
        Re: The road ahead? nathan.stocks at gmail Nov 1, 2005, 9:55 AM
        Re: The road ahead? grobian at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 10:17 AM
            Re: The road ahead? nathan.stocks at gmail Nov 1, 2005, 11:09 AM
    Re: The road ahead? dirk.schoenberger at sz-online Nov 1, 2005, 9:57 AM
    Re: The road ahead? grobian at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 10:26 AM
    Re: The road ahead? nathan.stocks at gmail Nov 1, 2005, 11:08 AM
    Re: The road ahead? sesquile at gmail Nov 1, 2005, 12:03 PM
    Re: The road ahead? grobian at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 12:13 PM
        Re: The road ahead? sesquile at gmail Nov 1, 2005, 12:32 PM
    Re: The road ahead? nathan.stocks at gmail Nov 1, 2005, 12:14 PM
    Re: The road ahead? dirk.schoenberger at sz-online Nov 1, 2005, 12:35 PM
    Re: The road ahead? grobian at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 12:36 PM
        Re: The road ahead? sesquile at gmail Nov 1, 2005, 12:45 PM
    Re: The road ahead? kito at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 1:10 PM
        Re: The road ahead? nathan.stocks at gmail Nov 1, 2005, 1:16 PM
        Re: The road ahead? sesquile at gmail Nov 1, 2005, 3:01 PM
        Re: The road ahead? ferringb at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 7:33 PM
            Re: The road ahead? kito at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 8:00 PM
                Re: The road ahead? ferringb at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 9:12 PM
            Re: The road ahead? nathan.stocks at gmail Nov 1, 2005, 9:16 PM
    Re: The road ahead? grobian at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 1:21 PM
        Re: The road ahead? kito at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 1:37 PM
            Re: The road ahead? grobian at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 1:45 PM
                Re: The road ahead? kito at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 1:58 PM
                    Re: The road ahead? grobian at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 2:05 PM
    Re: The road ahead? kito at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 3:55 PM
        Re: The road ahead? sesquile at gmail Nov 4, 2005, 10:50 AM
    Re: The road ahead? ferringb at gentoo Nov 1, 2005, 10:52 PM
    Re: The road ahead? sesquile at gmail Nov 7, 2005, 6:48 PM
    Re: The road ahead? grobian at gentoo Nov 8, 2005, 9:53 AM
        Re: The road ahead? kito at gentoo Nov 8, 2005, 10:09 AM
            Re: The road ahead? sesquile at gmail Nov 8, 2005, 2:10 PM
    Re: The road ahead? sesquile at gmail Dec 4, 2005, 10:19 PM
    Re: The road ahead? kito at gentoo Dec 5, 2005, 10:20 AM

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