Mailing List Archive: Gentoo: Alpha

alpha performance

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nick at computernick

Jan 28, 2005, 4:42 PM

Post #1 of 10 (1291 views)
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alpha performance

hello all,

im new to the list, so im sorry if this has been asked before. but how
does gentoo handle alpha equipment, specificly DEC Personal Workstation
500. how does it handle the 64bit? does it fly? i know nothing about
alpha hardware and am about to get the machine and really want to put
gentoo on it. any info i should know about gentoo and alpha?

thanks for your help

nick

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gabriel at teuton

Jan 28, 2005, 8:00 PM

Post #2 of 10 (1255 views)
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Re: alpha performance [In reply to]

On Friday 28 January 2005 05:42 pm, Nick Smith wrote:

> im new to the list, so im sorry if this has been asked before. but how
> does gentoo handle alpha equipment, specificly DEC Personal Workstation
> 500.

It handles very well.

> how does it handle the 64bit?

There really isn't a 64th bit. Bit numbering starts at 0, so bits are 0-63.
Gentoo uses all 64 of the bits, too.

> does it fly?

Yours may be modified, but the stock DEC Personal Workstation 500 did not come
equipped with any aeronautical devices or enhancements. Sad to say, it's
just a computer. At 500MHz, it will probably feel like a PIII 900MHz (viz.
http://www.netlib.org/benchmark/performance.ps)

> i know nothing about
> alpha hardware and am about to get the machine and really want to put
> gentoo on it. any info i should know about gentoo and alpha?

RTFM.

Gentoo is generally not for Linux newbies. If you're new to Linux, try one of
the other 64-bit distros (like Fedora, SuSe, and IIRC Red Hat). See
www.alphalinux.org.

If you're adventurous -- go for it!

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nick at computernick

Jan 28, 2005, 8:09 PM

Post #3 of 10 (1255 views)
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Re: alpha performance [In reply to]

> Gentoo is generally not for Linux newbies. If you're new to Linux, try one of
> the other 64-bit distros (like Fedora, SuSe, and IIRC Red Hat). See
> www.alphalinux.org.
>
> If you're adventurous -- go for it!
>
>
thanks gabriel, not new to linux or gentoo, just new to alpha, have seen
alot of your posts on the gentoo-user list. i know you know what your
talking about im glad to see your on here too. thanks for the info.

nick
> --
> G a b r i e l M . B e d d i n g f i e l d
>

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gabriel at teuton

Jan 28, 2005, 9:26 PM

Post #4 of 10 (1255 views)
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Re: alpha performance [In reply to]

On Friday 28 January 2005 09:09 pm, Nick Smith wrote:
>
> thanks gabriel, not new to linux or gentoo, just new to alpha, have seen
> alot of your posts on the gentoo-user list. i know you know what your
> talking about im glad to see your on here too. thanks for the info.

DOH!!! I'm sorry... I didn't even look at the name. Yes, I recognize you
from gentoo-user, and yes I know you know your way around gentoo. Please
excuse my smart-@$$ remarks. I misjudged your post. My compliments to you
on your tactful response.

Well, strip away the smart remarks, and I did give you some real answers.
Also:

1. The BIOS-like thing is called "the SRM console" and/or "ARC console."
Yours has both. SRM is for *nix, the ARC is for windoze. While both work
with Linux, SRM is preferred.

2. Compaq/HP does a great job of posting computer data online. You should be
able to get a full users manual with SRM commands and everything. Check hp's
website for "retired systems".

3. Installing gentoo -- I had to use an old liveCD (like gentoo 1.4 or
something). If 2004.3 (or whatever's the latest) doesn't boot for you, try
it. There's also a "jumpstart" disc out there somewhere. It's geared toward
installing RedHat/SuSe... but if you run into trouble it will be handy in
diagnosing your problem. If you get *any* gentoo disc booted, still go ahead
and use a current stage/portage tarball. However, you'll have to work around
a few missing commands that are in the current Handbook. (E.g. mirrorselect
will be gone, you'll have to select mirrors by hand.)

4. On my system (an AlphaStation 2/133) I have two persistent problems, but
I'm able to work around them and live with them OK:
a. When I issue 'halt -p', the box doesn't power down, nor does it
give control to the SRM console correctly. It goes into an infinite
error loop. Relatively harmless. Workaround: cold boots only.
No remote booting. :-( AFAIK this is somewhat rare, and is a
standing bug for FreeBSD as well as Linux.
b. I can't get video to work. That's OK for me, because I'm just using
it as a server / toy machine. Workaround: serial console / ssh.
Note: I didn't try very hard to make it work.

5. Regarding speed -- the benchmarks I posted agree with my experience. These
old boxes don't 'fly.' They just 'work.' My AS 2/133 (133MHz) is like a
Pentium 133MHz. The slowest part is really the hard drives, IMHO. Your
500MHz system may have about 700MB of RAM, which makes for a nice desktop
machine.

6. 2.4 kernels are still recommended.

Good luck, and I hope this helps. Alpha systems require a bit of
reading/research/playing to get up to speed.

--
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kloeri at gentoo

Jan 29, 2005, 4:32 AM

Post #5 of 10 (1256 views)
Permalink

Re: alpha performance [In reply to]

<snip>
>
> 3. Installing gentoo -- I had to use an old liveCD (like gentoo 1.4 or
> something). If 2004.3 (or whatever's the latest) doesn't boot for you, try
> it. There's also a "jumpstart" disc out there somewhere. It's geared toward
> installing RedHat/SuSe... but if you run into trouble it will be handy in
> diagnosing your problem. If you get *any* gentoo disc booted, still go ahead
> and use a current stage/portage tarball. However, you'll have to work around
> a few missing commands that are in the current Handbook. (E.g. mirrorselect
> will be gone, you'll have to select mirrors by hand.)
>
I'm a bit curious about this.. :) I know 2004.3 was foobared but any
boot problems should have been fixed with the 2004.3-r1 livecd that was
available shortly after the original 2004.3 release.

If there's any other problems I'd appreciate you filing a bug at
http://bugs.gentoo.org so I can fix it in future livecds.

> 6. 2.4 kernels are still recommended.
We're moving to 2.6 kernels which works beautifully on most systems - a
few systems still seems to have problems with 2.6 kernels. The 2005.0
livecd will have both 2.6 and 2.4 kernels for this reason.

Regards,
Bryan Østergaard
Gentoo/Alpha release coordinator

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brianp at spamcop

Jan 29, 2005, 4:34 PM

Post #6 of 10 (1256 views)
Permalink

Re: alpha performance [In reply to]

I've been running my Alpha Server 800 - 500Mhz ev56 for a little over a year
on the Gentoo 1.4 rc1 liveCD.
I'm up to the linux-2.6.10-rc1 kernel. (yeah they fixed the OEM DAC960
problem natively and the io/ref problem)

I agree that I've not successfully managed to get X running locally on the
host. (Tried a variety of video cards).

I also have an annoyance with the qlogic 1020 ISP drivers. I've tried both
the "known" broken qlogicisp module and the qla1280 driver with the st
modules.

For some reason after a couple of days the tape devices become unavailable
to the system. Also, attempting to unload the kernel module fails and hangs
the session on which the rmmod was attempted.

Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega scsi(0:0): Resetting SCSI BUS
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega scsi0 : QLogic QLA1040 PCI to SCSI Host Adapter
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega Firmware version: 7.65.00, Driver version 3.25
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega Vendor: SONY Model: SDT-9000 Rev:
0123
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega Type: Sequential-Access ANSI
SCSI revision: 02
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega scsi(0:0:0:0): Sync: period 10, offset 12
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega Attached scsi tape st0 at scsi0, channel 0, id
0, lun 0
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega st0: try direct i/o: yes (alignment 512 B), max
page reachable by HBA 196582
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega Vendor: IBM Model: DCHS09F CLAR09 Rev:
5353
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega Type: Direct-Access ANSI
SCSI revision: 02
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega scsi(0:0:2:0): Sync: period 10, offset 12,
Tagged queuing: depth 255
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega SCSI device sda: 17796078 512-byte hdwr sectors
(9112 MB)
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega sda: asking for cache data failed
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega sda: assuming drive cache: write through
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega SCSI device sda: 17796078 512-byte hdwr sectors
(9112 MB)
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega SCSI device sda: drive cache: write back
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega /dev/scsi/host0/bus0/target2/lun0: p1 p4 p5
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega Attached scsi disk sda at scsi0, channel 0, id
2, lun 0
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega qla1280: QLA1040 found on PCI bus 0, dev 12
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega scsi(1:0): Resetting SCSI BUS
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega scsi1 : QLogic QLA1040 PCI to SCSI Host Adapter
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega Firmware version: 7.65.00, Driver version 3.25
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega Vendor: Quantum Model: DLT4000 Rev:
CD50
Jan 15 11:53:06 alpha-omega Type: Sequential-Access ANSI
SCSI revision: 02

Brian Parkhurst
www.pyrobrian.com
brianp-at-spamcop-dot-net
----- Original Message -----
From: <kloeri [at] gentoo>
To: "Gabriel M. Beddingfield" <gabriel [at] teuton>
Cc: <gentoo-alpha [at] lists>
Sent: Saturday, January 29, 2005 3:32 AM
Subject: Re: [gentoo-alpha] alpha performance

> <snip>
> >
> > 3. Installing gentoo -- I had to use an old liveCD (like gentoo 1.4 or
> > something). If 2004.3 (or whatever's the latest) doesn't boot for you,
try
> > it. There's also a "jumpstart" disc out there somewhere. It's geared
toward
> > installing RedHat/SuSe... but if you run into trouble it will be handy
in
> > diagnosing your problem. If you get *any* gentoo disc booted, still go
ahead
> > and use a current stage/portage tarball. However, you'll have to work
around
> > a few missing commands that are in the current Handbook. (E.g.
mirrorselect
> > will be gone, you'll have to select mirrors by hand.)
> >
> I'm a bit curious about this.. :) I know 2004.3 was foobared but any
> boot problems should have been fixed with the 2004.3-r1 livecd that was
> available shortly after the original 2004.3 release.
>
> If there's any other problems I'd appreciate you filing a bug at
> http://bugs.gentoo.org so I can fix it in future livecds.
>
> > 6. 2.4 kernels are still recommended.
> We're moving to 2.6 kernels which works beautifully on most systems - a
> few systems still seems to have problems with 2.6 kernels. The 2005.0
> livecd will have both 2.6 and 2.4 kernels for this reason.
>
> Regards,
> Bryan �~stergaard
> Gentoo/Alpha release coordinator
>
> --
> gentoo-alpha [at] gentoo mailing list
>
>

--
gentoo-alpha [at] gentoo mailing list

maillist at society

Feb 7, 2005, 9:18 PM

Post #7 of 10 (1254 views)
Permalink

Re: alpha performance [In reply to]

>> 6. 2.4 kernels are still recommended.
> We're moving to 2.6 kernels which works beautifully on most systems - a
few systems still seems to have problems with 2.6 kernels. The 2005.0
livecd will have both 2.6 and 2.4 kernels for this reason.

After asking a few questions here and some initial hair-pulling, I've been
running 2.6.8 with *zero* problems since August '04. The major problems I
encountered during the install itself were the LiveCDs and the infamous
QLOGIC ISP1020 driver issues. Look for my post to this list dated August
24, 2004 titled 'Woo-hoo! (or "Successful Miata Installation Notes")' for
some pointers.

I've since been running NFS, NTP, Samba, Apache2 w/4 virtual hosts,
Postfix, PostgreSQL, UW-IMAP (I've only got a few family members as
users), and various miscellaneous daemons on my Miata. All running quite
happily. I've even done some of my Oracle work on it, using the JDBC thin
client. Other than the SCSI whine of the drives, it's chugging along
fine.

GL!

Rich J.

--
gentoo-alpha [at] gentoo mailing list

jeff_donsbach at yahoo

Feb 8, 2005, 1:07 PM

Post #8 of 10 (1254 views)
Permalink

Re: alpha performance [In reply to]

Has anyone gotten a 2.6 kernel to work on a MILO based
machine? I have an XLT 366 that I have been trying on.
I got the kernel built with only minor problems, but I
wasn't able to get it to boot. It just freezes when
jumping from MILO to the kernel. I had to give up
because I had other things to do (this was a few
weekends ago). If anyone has, maybe you can share your
known working kernel config file? Also, maybe I am
just not passing the right boot flags to the kernel.
What are you using?

Thanks in advance,
Jeff D

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mxa at xs4all

Feb 10, 2005, 1:43 AM

Post #9 of 10 (1253 views)
Permalink

Re: alpha performance [In reply to]

On Tue, February 8, 2005 21:07, Jeff Donsbach said:
>
> Has anyone gotten a 2.6 kernel to work on a MILO based
> machine? I have an XLT 366 that I have been trying on.

I have an XLT 300 and I tried the alpha-sources, vanilla-sources,
gentoo-sources, development sources and gentoo-dev-sources. I only tried
building for the XLT target, not the generic-alpha target (I assume you
did the same?).

> I got the kernel built with only minor problems, but I
> wasn't able to get it to boot. It just freezes when
> jumping from MILO to the kernel. I had to give up
> because I had other things to do (this was a few
> weekends ago).

I have exactly the same results (including giving up due to time
contraints ;-). Building works, but MILO freezes with any kernel > 2.4.21
(latest in alpha-sources). I think it has to do with something in
sys_alcor.c (which received a major overhaul from 2.4.22 onwards) or the
interrupt mapping code. IIRC, Jean-S�bastien Guay had success building for
the generic target, which would confirm that the problem is somewhere in
the alcor-specific code.

So right now, it seems that on an XLT you can use only 2.4.21
(alpha-sources) for the XLT target, or >2.4.22 (including 2.6.x) but only
for the generic-alpha target. Can anyone confirm this?

> If anyone has, maybe you can share your
> known working kernel config file? Also, maybe I am
> just not passing the right boot flags to the kernel.
> What are you using?

I would be very interested as well!

Marnix.

--
gentoo-alpha [at] gentoo mailing list

jeff_donsbach at yahoo

Feb 10, 2005, 8:39 AM

Post #10 of 10 (1256 views)
Permalink

Re: alpha performance [In reply to]

I'm already running vanilla-sources 2.4.25 . That
worked like a charm the first time with no issues.
Yes, I am building an XLT config, not "generic". I've
been running 2.4.25 for somewhere around a year. This
was my first attempt at upgrading to a 2.6 kernel
though.

Jeff

--- Marnix Arnold <mxa [at] xs4all> wrote:

> On Tue, February 8, 2005 21:07, Jeff Donsbach said:
> >
> > Has anyone gotten a 2.6 kernel to work on a MILO
> based
> > machine? I have an XLT 366 that I have been trying
> on.
>
> I have an XLT 300 and I tried the alpha-sources,
> vanilla-sources,
> gentoo-sources, development sources and
> gentoo-dev-sources. I only tried
> building for the XLT target, not the generic-alpha
> target (I assume you
> did the same?).
>
> > I got the kernel built with only minor problems,
> but I
> > wasn't able to get it to boot. It just freezes
> when
> > jumping from MILO to the kernel. I had to give up
> > because I had other things to do (this was a few
> > weekends ago).
>
> I have exactly the same results (including giving up
> due to time
> contraints ;-). Building works, but MILO freezes
> with any kernel > 2.4.21
> (latest in alpha-sources). I think it has to do with
> something in
> sys_alcor.c (which received a major overhaul from
> 2.4.22 onwards) or the
> interrupt mapping code. IIRC, Jean-S�bastien Guay
> had success building for
> the generic target, which would confirm that the
> problem is somewhere in
> the alcor-specific code.
>
> So right now, it seems that on an XLT you can use
> only 2.4.21
> (alpha-sources) for the XLT target, or >2.4.22
> (including 2.6.x) but only
> for the generic-alpha target. Can anyone confirm
> this?
>
> > If anyone has, maybe you can share your
> > known working kernel config file? Also, maybe I
> am
> > just not passing the right boot flags to the
> kernel.
> > What are you using?
>
> I would be very interested as well!
>
> Marnix.
>
>
>
> --
> gentoo-alpha [at] gentoo mailing list
>
>

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